Haynesworth is Behaving Selfishly

[MTK]

Still waiting to hear/see/read AH say that he doesn't want to play in this D.

Yet somehow that's been taken as fact.

[Defensewins]

The Redskins did measure the trade value of several of their contracted players like JC, CP, AH, etc by talking trade with other teams. When they saw they were not going get what they wanted for certain players they moved on. The fans and the media did not.

The LeBron and Cleveland situation reminds me a lot of the AH situation, only in that the media and fans in Cleveland said some really insulting things about LeBron out of anger and frustration after the final loss in Cleveland. I could not believe some of the things that were said in the media about a fairly decent guy that tries/plays hard and really wants to win a championship. Cleveland fans and media might have shot themselves in the foot, because they want and financially need him to come back. The ironic thing is now that the fans and media have spewed their venom, why would LeBron want to come back to Cleveland?

[BigHairedAristocrat]

I like how Allen says "a lot" of the reports out there about trading Haynesworth aren't true. He didnt deny that some of them were.

I don't think any reasonable person doubts that if a team offered the right compensation for AH, he'd be gone and Allen and Shanahan would be pretty happy about it. But at this point, every team in the NFL has had a chance to offer the right compensation and, obviously, they were either unwilling or unable to meet our demands. The only way he gets moved in 2010 is if a stud DT on a "contending" team suffers a season-ending injury and the team panics. Baring that, Haynesworth should be here through 2010.

From Haynesworth's side, I am not backing down from my opinion that, having just received a 20MM check, he should be willing to do whatever the team asks him to do. We know that, at minimum, he has rebuffed Shanahan's, Hasletts, Allens, Phillip Danie'ls, and Donovan F. McNabb's requests/pleadings that he show up like everyone else. All will be forgiven if Haynesworth shows up for mandatory activities, gives 100% at whatever role his coaches assign him, and dominates during the regular season. But right now, those are very high expectations and Haynesworth's absence makes him look like a primadonna who care's more about himself than the team. Again, nothing we didn't know before signing him. Right now, we're getting what we paid for.

It is a legitimate story, and the media is doing their job by continuing to report on it. I don't think either JLC, the WaPo, PFT, or any other major media outlet is "making stuff up" by reporting what their sources are telling him. This won't go away until Haynesworth is traded or he starts participating in team activities.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

I don't think any reasonable person doubts that if a team offered the right compensation for AH, he'd be gone and Allen and Shanahan would be pretty happy about it. But at this point, every team in the NFL has had a chance to offer the right compensation and, obviously, they were either unwilling or unable to meet our demands. The only way he gets moved in 2010 is if a stud DT on a "contending" team suffers a season-ending injury and the team panics. Baring that, Haynesworth should be here through 2010.

I'm just curious to know what are your thoughts about the change to the 3-4 (without thinking about AH). Part of me wants to somewhat agree with folks that are saying what you are saying.

But my logical side is telling me that it is a bad idea to switch to the 3-4. That making this switch is creating needs on defense that we didn't have before and that it seems that this new coaching staff is willing to gamble in making several players on defense play a new position. With this in mind, it is a bit hard to ignore AH saying that he wants to play a position that will make him more effective.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

I'm just curious to know what are your thoughts about the change to the 3-4 (without thinking about AH). Part of me wants to somewhat agree with folks that are saying what you are saying.

But my logical side is telling me that it is a bad idea to switch to the 3-4. That making this switch is creating needs on defense that we didn't have before and that it seems that this new coaching staff is willing to gamble in making several players on defense play a new position. With this in mind, it is a bit hard to ignore AH saying that he wants to play a position that will make him more effective.

I think switching to a 3-4 base defense in 2010 is completely retarded. We had a Top 10 defense in 2010 with a uber-conservative DC that had two of our top potential playmakers playing out of position (3 if you want to include misusing haynesworth). Additionally, the defense was also hurt because our innept offense couldnt score points and the HC made stupid calls that constantly put our defense in tough spots.

Shanahan's offense and play-calling alone would indirectly improve our defense. Move Landry to SS, Orakpo to full-time 4-3 DE, and let Hasletts more aggressive calling work its magic. In my mind, those changes alone would make our defense top 5. Instead, I don't see any way our defense is not in the bottom 10 of the league in 2010. we've simply got too many guys on the roster who don't really fit anywhere in the system and/or who are playing out of their natural position now. IMO Haynesworth is, by far, the best player on our defense, if not the entire team, and the coaches should be doing everything as possible to get the most out of him. Shanahan and Hasletts forcing the 3-4 on the team now is no different than Cerrato forcing the WCO on Jason Campbell. Its a square peg and a round hole. Eventually, you can make it ok, but the coaches are just making a problem when there doesnt need to be one. Great coaches are supposed to adapt their systems to their personnel. All teams run a little bit of everything to confuses offenses, and i'm not averse to the team going to a base 3-4 eventually. But doing it in 2010 is just further evidence that Shanahan is still a moron when it comes to defense.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

I think switching to a 3-4 base defense in 2010 is completely retarded. We had a Top 10 defense in 2010 with a uber-conservative DC that had two of our top potential playmakers playing out of position (3 if you want to include misusing haynesworth). Additionally, the defense was also hurt because our innept offense couldnt score points and the HC made stupid calls that constantly put our defense in tough spots.

Shanahan's offense and play-calling alone would indirectly improve our defense. Move Landry to SS, Orakpo to full-time 4-3 DE, and let Hasletts more aggressive calling work its magic. In my mind, those changes alone would make our defense top 5. Instead, I don't see any way our defense is not in the bottom 10 of the league in 2010. we've simply got too many guys on the roster who don't really fit anywhere in the system and/or who are playing out of their natural position now. IMO Haynesworth is, by far, the best player on our defense, if not the entire team, and the coaches should be doing everything as possible to get the most out of him. Shanahan and Hasletts forcing the 3-4 on the team now is no different than Cerrato forcing the WCO on Jason Campbell. Its a square peg and a round hole. Eventually, you can make it ok, but the coaches are just making a problem when there doesnt need to be one. Great coaches are supposed to adapt their systems to their personnel. All teams run a little bit of everything to confuses offenses, and i'm not averse to the team going to a base 3-4 eventually. But doing it in 2010 is just further evidence that Shanahan is still a moron when it comes to defense.

THIS!

...Shanahan, Haslett and Allen should be grilled come the regular season when the defense takes a big step backward. I mean we bring in these super smart football guys to replace a coke-head toady working w/ Snyder and the first thing they do, literally, is take the strongest facet of the team and blow it UP. That's just stupid. Fans and media should put them through the ringer when the defense is underwhelming.

[tryfuhl]

Originally Posted by The Goat

THIS!

...Shanahan, Haslett and Allen should be grilled come the regular season when the defense takes a big step backward. I mean we bring in these super smart football guys to replace a coke-head toady working w/ Snyder and the first thing they do, literally, is take the strongest facet of the team and blow it UP. That's just stupid. Fans and media should put them through the ringer when the defense is underwhelming.

I understand the skepticism however i'm sure that their plan extends past just this year and if we're able to already evaluate the future performances of our players for this year we'd probably have jobs at the park or with any other organization for that matter

[tryfuhl]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

I like how Allen says "a lot" of the reports out there about trading Haynesworth aren't true. He didnt deny that some of them were.

You expect him to say ALL of the reports? Knowing that he couldn't have possibly read them all?

Jesus man, take the tin foil hat off.

[over the mountain]

well, if we are going to switch to a 3-4, i think it is going to take a year or so to implement the system and turn over the personel to fit the 3-4.

its going to take atleast a year to make the switch, so why not do it this year when we are in a full flux of change. That way, next year, we already went through the transition period and am ready to roll full steam with the 3-4 in 2011.

plus, it seems we are going to ease our way into the 3-4, not commit fully to the scheme this year.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by over the mountain

well, if we are going to switch to a 3-4, i think it is going to take a year or so to implement the system and turn over the personel to fit the 3-4.

its going to take atleast a year to make the switch, so why not do it this year when we are in a full flux of change. That way, next year, we already went through the transition period and am ready to roll full steam with the 3-4 in 2011.

plus, it seems we are going to ease our way into the 3-4, not commit fully to the scheme this year.

good points

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by over the mountain

well, if we are going to switch to a 3-4, i think it is going to take a year or so to implement the system and turn over the personel to fit the 3-4.

its going to take atleast a year to make the switch, so why not do it this year when we are in a full flux of change. That way, next year, we already went through the transition period and am ready to roll full steam with the 3-4 in 2011.

plus, it seems we are going to ease our way into the 3-4, not commit fully to the scheme this year.

I guess that's my main issue. Given our current roster, switching to a 3-4 now makes no sense. Switching to a 3-4 makes sense when a team is young. However, the vast majority of our defense is at or past its prime.
In three years, when the "real" part of Haynesworth's contract is up, and Andre Carter, London Fletcher, and Phillip Daniels have all retired would seem to be the ideal time to siwtch... if we even decided to switch. I know the 3-4 defense is "trendy" right now, but its not like the 4-3 defense is obsolete.

To me, it seems like we're forcing the 3-4 just for the sake of having it. With the potential exception of Orakpo, every single defensive starter and the majority of our backups from 2009 is a prototypical 4-3 defensive player. Whereas before, we had great depth with guys like Lorenzo Alexander, Chris Wilson, and Jeremy Jarmon, now I wonder if any of these guys will even be on the team in 2011. Seems like an awful waste of existing talent to me.

However, I do agree that we will probably not run as much 3-4 as most "3-4" teams. I honestly wouldnt be surprised if we pretty much only play 3-4 when Haynesworth is "injured" or taking a breather.

[NYCskinfan82]

Originally Posted by over the mountain

well, if we are going to switch to a 3-4, i think it is going to take a year or so to implement the system and turn over the personel to fit the 3-4.

its going to take atleast a year to make the switch, so why not do it this year when we are in a full flux of change. That way, next year, we already went through the transition period and am ready to roll full steam with the 3-4 in 2011.

plus, it seems we are going to ease our way into the 3-4, not commit fully to the scheme this year.

We don't have the personnel yet so net year when we go out and get the personnel we will have to teach the system again.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by NYCskinfan82

We don't have the personnel yet so net year when we go out and get the personnel we will have to teach the system again.

We aren't going to get all the personnel on defense next year, and the ones who succeed and stay will help those coming in grasp the concept.

I have no idea about the rightness/wrongness of transitioning to a 3-4, and I'm waiting to see about Haslett. BUT, Green Bay last year was in the exact same predicament, and they went ahead with the transition, and had a pretty good D. We have some players on our team, and regardless of system, they are going to bring it every game, Orakpo, Fletch, (I say) AH, Rodgers will stop the WR, Hall will pick some balls off. Our D can be effective, in transition, and then we will re-evaluate after our last game in February

[over the mountain]

Originally Posted by NYCskinfan82

We don't have the personnel yet so net year when we go out and get the personnel we will have to teach the system again.

agreed we dont have every player we need right now but we got some pieces. also, i dont think it is wise to wait until next year to start collecting the personnel. we have already started adding pieces with kemo, carrikter (sp), that lb we drafted in the 4th (hill?).

include those guys with orakpo, jarmon, blades and we have a good bit of guys who are going to be here (or atleast expected to be in our future plans) who need to be coached up on the 3-4.

that way, next year when we draft another 3-4 lb or DL, all those guys i just listed above have already played a year under the scheme and all we have to do is bring 1 or 2 rookies up to speed.

we arent canonballing ourselves into the deep end. we are taking baby steps in the shallow part of the pool and as we add more pieces and get more comfortable over the next year or two we will find ourselves swimming in the deep end with no problems.

[tryfuhl]

Originally Posted by NYCskinfan82

We don't have the personnel yet so net year when we go out and get the personnel we will have to teach the system again.

The correct personnel will not really have to learn as much as those not already geared for this system that's part of what makes them the correct guys .. there will be the new players each and every year to teach though.. that goes for every other team as well