Is anyone else just absolutely disgusted with DM5's play?

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by GMScud

I agree with your post 100%. He's made some awful decisions. I don't think he was worth a 2nd and a 4th, but I guess it was very important to Shanny to have a proven leader at QB while he implements his systems and his coaching style. And that's fine. But anyone who is still expecting McNabb to have some sort of Pro-bowl campaign while in burgundy and gold is smoking something.

I don't think he'll ever be anything better than average for us. And as to your point in bold, we need to get a young stud QB in here asap so he can sit a season or two behind McNabb before taking the reigns of this franchise.

I agree so if that's the case then you gotta wonder why they gave up the draft picks. Could've just kept JC, brought in Grossmam to compete and kept the picks. We'd probably have one less win.

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

I agree so if that's the case then you gotta wonder why they gave up the draft picks. Could've just kept JC, brought in Grossmam to compete and kept the picks. We'd probably have one less win.

Totally agree. I've said this before on here- one thing that Campbell has that McNabb doesn't is the ability to learn a system on the fly. McNabb has apparently really struggled to pick up what Kyle is putting down - so much so that both Shanahan's have been allegedly surprised and disappointed.

I don't think we'd be much better or much worse with Campbell and/or Grossman as a starter this season. And we'd still have two really important draft picks. I mean, McNabb has 15 picks to only 12 TDs, and a rating of 75.2 (3 points lower than JC's this season). Campbell's stats as a starter here were never that poor, and he learned a new system nearly every season. Just saying.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by GMScud

Totally agree. I've said this before on here- one thing that Campbell has that McNabb doesn't is the ability to learn a system on the fly. McNabb has apparently really struggled to pick up what Kyle is putting down - so much so that both Shanahan's have been allegedly surprised and disappointed.

I don't think we'd be much better or much worse with Campbell and/or Grossman as a starter this season. And we'd still have two really important draft picks. I mean, McNabb has 15 picks to only 12 TDs, and a rating of 75.2 (3 points lower than JC's this season). Campbell's stats as a starter here were never that poor, and he learned a new system nearly every season. Just saying.

I generally agree, however, the drama and angst that JC and the previous FO's had established here would have caused far more disruption. In fact, even though DM's play hasn't been stellar, I believe that attention is being more evenly focused, than if JC were here, and all the discussion revolved around his perceived deficiencies.

I hope we give DM another year to settle down, and more importantly build as best we can around him. Not that he will change who he is, but moreso he does not present a vivid reminder of the past malfeasance on the part of the FO.

I was pretty against DM when they brought him in, but not having the weekly JC bash/love threads has been one of the better parts of this season.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by GMScud

Totally agree. I've said this before on here- one thing that Campbell has that McNabb doesn't is the ability to learn a system on the fly. McNabb has apparently really struggled to pick up what Kyle is putting down - so much so that both Shanahan's have been allegedly surprised and disappointed.

I don't think we'd be much better or much worse with Campbell and/or Grossman as a starter this season. And we'd still have two really important draft picks. I mean, McNabb has 15 picks to only 12 TDs, and a rating of 75.2 (3 points lower than JC's this season). Campbell's stats as a starter here were never that poor, and he learned a new system nearly every season. Just saying.

What I'll say about this, really the only thing I can say without this turning into a JC vs. McNabb thread, is that for Campbell to actually have played mediocre enough to be replicating the numbers McNabb is currently putting up...would have fit in only with the side of the argument that thought "boy, we've certainly seen the best Campbell can give us."

Because, objectively, we were already getting this level of performance out of him. The argument for keeping him would have been that a guy 3 years from the peak of his career might have been capable of giving us more than he has. Or more than we're getting now. But we've never been a team to commit to youth that doesn't pay immediate dividends. Just be happy that Orakpo, Trent, and Landry all had big rookie years. Otherwise, they too would have been marginalized as "useless, but necessary" players.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Absolutely disgusted? Not at all. Part of what McNabb brings is the intangible leadership that's necessary particularly following such a disastrous year and the necessary changes taking place this year, and at least next year. Did we overtrade (if that's a word) for leadership? Yeah probably. On the field, he has made some big plays that few, if any QBs, on our roster the past couple of years (this year included) could have made. And several of his interceptions have not been his fault...but he doesn't have Joey Galloway to blame anymore.

Wait a minute. What good is the leadership to lead a team out of a disastrous season if the result of the leadership is that the next season is just as disastrous?

I'm not saying 1) Leadership isn't important, and I'm not saying 2) McNabb doesn't bring leadership (I'm also not asserting either of those things). I'm saying that we need to look at the value of that leadership in context: if the proposed intangible hasn't produced anything tangible, then we need to question how valuable it really is.

It's also possible that McNabb's not responsible for the lack of improvement, but the Shanahan's are. I don't see any way we can draw a line where one's responsibility ends, and the other begins. We do need to be mindful of the results before we start talking about how happy we are to finally have some real leadership in the quarterback position. The big plays he's brought have made a difference. The leadership, apparently, has not.

[tmandoug1]

Ok fellas lets look at it this way, how many times have you seen our QB have enough time to throw the ball to anyone. I agree our line needs work, however I have seen to many plays by DM5 where he underthrows or leads to much. Case in point armstrong short throw, alot of you say he was under pressure but if he throws the ball two seconds before there is any pressure than he hits him stride for a TD. His accuracy and timing sucks a--. If I see his ass smile one more time after "missing one", an easy one I am going through the roof.

[firstdown]

I'm guessing the guy who started this thread is not even a skins fan and just trying to stir up the pot. I could be wrong just a feeling I have.

[SolidSnake84]

I dont find his level of play disgusting. It's not THAT bad....but i think as redskins fans, we have kind of gotten used to poor play at QB, except for in 05 with Brunell, and 07 with Collins..

I think Donovan is exactly what most people figured he would be on this team..a good leader who is able to still do some things, but is past his best and best used in a role where he starts for a year or 2 while another QB watches from the bench until he is ready..

[44ever]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

I dont find his level of play disgusting. It's not THAT bad....but i think as redskins fans, we have kind of gotten used to poor play at QB, except for in 05 with Brunell, and 07 with Collins..

I think Donovan is exactly what most people figured he would be on this team..a good leader who is able to still do some things, but is past his best and best used in a role where he starts for a year or 2 while another QB watches from the bench until he is ready..

Good post. That makes the most sense. What better position for a young QB to be in, A HOF QB to sit under, one that will only play for another year or two. But for this to work, we must secure a young future QB next season at the latest. I think we will see that.

I don't think Shanny is planning moment by moment, he has a plan. McNabb is just a bridge that not only gives us a chance to win now but the future as well.

[Lotus]

Not disgusted with DM5. He's made some plays for us that others would not have made.

Still, I wonder when he will show up. Sometimes it is like the lights are on but no one is at home.

Maybe in his second year in DC he will be more mentally present and therefore more effective.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by 44ever

Good post. That makes the most sense. What better position for a young QB to be in, A HOF QB to sit under, one that will only play for another year or two. But for this to work, we must secure a young future QB next season at the latest. I think we will see that.

I don't think Shanny is planning moment by moment, he has a plan. McNabb is just a bridge that not only gives us a chance to win now but the future as well.

Damn expensive bridge if you ask me. I think when the season is finally over, people will still ask, and rightfully so, are we that much better off now that Jason Campbell is no longer here and Donovan McNabb is the Redskins' quarterback. Especially if the Raiders back into the playoffs or sniff a winning record.

[44ever]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

Damn expensive bridge if you ask me. I think when the season is finally over, people will still ask, and rightfully so, are we that much better off now that Jason Campbell is no longer here and Donovan McNabb is the Redskins' quarterback. Especially if the Raiders back into the playoffs or sniff a winning record.

First of all, The money doesn't mean crap to anyone but DS and he has more than he can spend so we need to stop making money a factor in these situations.

Secondly, JC was on his way out wether DM came here or not. And if people will ask if we are better off without JC now that DM is the Redskin QB, the answer is YES. Give DM last years Defense or this years playing the 4-3 and Portis And DM more than puts up enough points to win most of the games we lost.

I've said this before, bring JC back here and he would be just like last year or worse.

The team as a whole is playing worse than last year. Sad but true.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by 44ever

First of all, The money doesn't mean crap to anyone but DS and he has more than he can spend so we need to stop making money a factor in these situations.

Secondly, JC was on his way out wether DM came here or not. And if people will ask if we are better off without JC now that DM is the Redskin QB, the answer is YES. Give DM last years Defense or this years playing the 4-3 and Portis And DM more than puts up enough points to win most of the games we lost.

I've said this before, bring JC back here and he would be just like last year or worse.

The team as a whole is playing worse than last year. Sad but true.

I wasn't referring to the money, but rather the draft picks we gave up for what, thus far, has been a very underwhelming Donovan McNabb.

As far as JC goes, as long as McNabb continues to have sub-par performances, I think the Jason Campbell discussion will always have some relevance to Skins fans.

[SirClintonPortis]

Originally Posted by 44ever

First of all, The money doesn't mean crap to anyone but DS and he has more than he can spend so we need to stop making money a factor in these situations.

Secondly, JC was on his way out wether DM came here or not. And if people will ask if we are better off without JC now that DM is the Redskin QB, the answer is YES. Give DM last years Defense or this years playing the 4-3 and Portis And DM more than puts up enough points to win most of the games we lost.

I've said this before, bring JC back here and he would be just like last year or worse.

The team as a whole is playing worse than last year. Sad but true.

He's a bridge to nowhere. There's a whole host of second rounders who already have panned out this year that we could have used long after McNabb would be gone. Terrence Cody, Nate Allen, hell, even reaching for Jared Veldheer would have benefited us more than McNabb.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by 44ever

First of all, The money doesn't mean crap to anyone but DS and he has more than he can spend so we need to stop making money a factor in these situations.

Secondly, JC was on his way out wether DM came here or not. And if people will ask if we are better off without JC now that DM is the Redskin QB, the answer is YES. Give DM last years Defense or this years playing the 4-3 and Portis And DM more than puts up enough points to win most of the games we lost.

I've said this before, bring JC back here and he would be just like last year or worse.

The team as a whole is playing worse than last year. Sad but true.

Thing is, you can isolate the offenses from the rest of the team, and ours is worse this year than it was last year. Not much worse. Just a little bit, and the difference is entirely in the passing game.

The defense has been a problem. It was average last year, it was average this year until the bye week. It's been bad since. It was never improved, but that would have been a lofty expectation, given that we didn't invest anything in it between 2009 and 2010.

We made all of our investments (McNabb, Trent Williams, Jammal Brown, Artis Hicks, Larry Johnson, Joey Galloway, Roydell Williams, Kory Lichtensteiger) on the offensive side of the ball. That's the side we were planning on making a significant improvement. It didn't, so you should probably figure out what went wrong. Why hasn't McNabb played like he did in Philly? Why hasn't Artis Hicks been the starting lineman we thought? Who thought Joey Galloway could still play? etc.

The defense is its own animal. It's badly underachieved the last four games, particularly against the run. But we didn't invest anything there so things were more prone to go wrong on that side of the ball (additions: Buchanon, Carriker, Kemoeatu). The troubling thing about the season is on the offensive side, where we've been no better, and would rank probably 30th in points if not for the contributions of one Brandon Banks.

We actually released Banks prior to the Rams (Texans?) game, if you'll remember. That's how much we were expecting to need his contributions.