Is it finally time to rebuild??

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Longtimefan

The concept of rebuild has been well adopted in the minds of many fans, but will it be adopted at the box office. If this team continues it's losing ways, attendance will suffer greatly, forcing management to somehow find a happy medium. Yesterdays announced attendance 66,000+ could become the norm.

Mike Wise - Mike Shanahan and Washington Redskins must face need to rebuild

I'm sure the weather was a factor in that

[Longtimefan]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

I'm sure the weather was a factor in that

That's true, it was definitely cold wet and a little windy, and believe me by the end of the game there was nowhere close to 66,000 left in the stands. I'm not so sure there was that many at the start of the game. Only the true die-hards were present yesterday.

[Daseal]

We have NOT tried to rebuild yet. A lot of people equate losing to rebuilding. Just because we suck doesn’t mean we’re rebuilding. We’re still giving up draft picks for 34 year old players. That is not rebuilding – that’s saying we want to win now. If you want to pick up some veteran FA’s. Fine. If you are trading for them, sacrificing young future players for the team, you’re still trying to win.
I’m ready to break the core of this team apart. See what we can get some value for, turn to the younger players. Start building a new attitude in DC. Not saying trade away everyone. But keep age in mind. Anyone over the age of 27/28 should be expendable, for the right price.

[SouperMeister]

Originally Posted by Daseal

We have NOT tried to rebuild yet. A lot of people equate losing to rebuilding. Just because we suck doesn’t mean we’re rebuilding. We’re still giving up draft picks for 34 year old players. That is not rebuilding – that’s saying we want to win now. If you want to pick up some veteran FA’s. Fine. If you are trading for them, sacrificing young future players for the team, you’re still trying to win.
I’m ready to break the core of this team apart. See what we can get some value for, turn to the younger players. Start building a new attitude in DC. Not saying trade away everyone. But keep age in mind. Anyone over the age of 27/28 should be expendable, for the right price.

Amen Bro! It is time to stockpile and place value on draft picks, and rebuild primarily through the draft. Regardless of who has led our FO, one constant under Snyder's ownership is the trading of draft picks for veterans, as if we're one or two players away from contending. The two playoff appearances in Gibbs 2.0 were a mirage. Those teams had losing records before making final sprints to eek out a #6 seed. They created delusion in the FO that we were close. I would even argue that cutting an able young body like Devin Thomas in favor of older players like Galloway and Roydell Williams may satisfy Shanny's desire to win now, but is counter-productive to getting younger, faster, and stronger in the long term. As a fan, I will willingly take a couple more crappy 5-6 win seasons if it means that the roster is being turned over for a future loaded with young talent ready to contend in 3 years. Time to take a longer term approach if we ever hope to compete in our division, much less make the playoffs.

[ethat001]

Originally Posted by Daseal

We have NOT tried to rebuild yet. A lot of people equate losing to rebuilding. Just because we suck doesn’t mean we’re rebuilding. We’re still giving up draft picks for 34 year old players. That is not rebuilding – that’s saying we want to win now. If you want to pick up some veteran FA’s. Fine. If you are trading for them, sacrificing young future players for the team, you’re still trying to win.
I’m ready to break the core of this team apart. See what we can get some value for, turn to the younger players. Start building a new attitude in DC. Not saying trade away everyone. But keep age in mind. Anyone over the age of 27/28 should be expendable, for the right price.

This is exactly what I meant. Sure, every year every team tries to get younger. BUT rebuilding means that you (1) keep your draft picks, and (2) trade away older core great players to get more picks or younger players. Just like NE trading Randy Moss - good player but the 3rd round pick is more valuable to the team in the long-term. Brilliant.

For us, it'd be any of these guys:
- Cooley
- S.Moss
- C. Rogers
- A.Carter

These are great players but -- how would they help us in the next 3 years? They'd all be older than 31-32 by then, and past their primes. Better to have a younger player that can be around for 10 years.

That is what I meant about rebuilding. Again, I'm not sure we're going to do it. If we get lucky with picks and trades, we can put together a good team each year. But rebuilding has the potential to make a great team for a decade, like NE/Ravens/etc.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by jdlea

http://www.thewarpath.net/redskins-l...tml#post768237

These threads do seem very similar, don't they? I'd merge them but I'm refusing to participate in mod activities except for in nickel packages

[jdlea]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

These threads do seem very similar, don't they? I'd merge them but I'm refusing to participate in mod activities except for in nickel packages

Lol, I'd say they're pretty similar. I put up my preliminary plan for a rebuild before in the other thread and didn't want to copy and paste it here. I figured, "if you want my plans for a rebuild, see this post."

Although, the more I read through them, they seem like they seem like the same thread

[Monkeydad]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

I knew that this year we were seeing Rebuilding whether they wanted to admit it or not.

Yeah,.the rebuilding process started when Vinny was canned and Allen was brought in. I don't know why so many people won't admit it.

I knew this would be a transition/rebuliding year, with more success in year #2.


Of course, I had blindly optimistic hopes for the team...I always do as a true fan...but there was a LOT to fix with a 4-12 team with no offensive line whatsoever...more than could be fixed in a single year.

We've made a lot more progress than our record shows. I'm a bit worried about the defensive scheme, but individuals have played well on defense. The 4-3 to 3-4 move is rarely smooth.

[sportscurmudgeon]

Originally Posted by Buster

Yeah,.the rebuilding process started when Vinny was canned and Allen was brought in. I don't know why so many people won't admit it.

I knew this would be a transition/rebuliding year, with more success in year #2.


Of course, I had blindly optimistic hopes for the team...I always do as a true fan...but there was a LOT to fix with a 4-12 team with no offensive line whatsoever...more than could be fixed in a single year.

We've made a lot more progress than our record shows. I'm a bit worried about the defensive scheme, but individuals have played well on defense. The 4-3 to 3-4 move is rarely smooth.

Agree the Skins changed course when Vinny turned in the keys to the executive wash room. And I defnitely agree the change in course was a positive one.

I must say however that I really do not know how much Bruce Allen has had to do with the new direction of the team - - other than to be a figurehead and a pointman for marketing/PR/communications activities. It sure looks to me as if Mike Shanahan is the main man and Bruce Allen handles contracts and salary caps and community stuff only.

[freddyg12]

Originally Posted by sportscurmudgeon

Agree the Skins changed course when Vinny turned in the keys to the executive wash room. And I defnitely agree the change in course was a positive one.

I must say however that I really do not know how much Bruce Allen has had to do with the new direction of the team - - other than to be a figurehead and a pointman for marketing/PR/communications activities. It sure looks to me as if Mike Shanahan is the main man and Bruce Allen handles contracts and salary caps and community stuff only.

Pretty major stuff! He's ushered in a new era of fiscal responsibility thus far.

[sportscurmudgeon]

Originally Posted by freddyg12

Pretty major stuff! He's ushered in a new era of fiscal responsibility thus far.

Biggest payroll in the NFC and that's fiscal responsibility?

How many new/additional scouts did he hire for the Redskins - - collegiate scouts and pro player scouts? I believe the answer would be ZERO. And that makes improvement on your drafting and free agency evaluations more of a "random thing" than an organizational commitment.

The Skins need to rebuild. They do not have the infrastructure to do that - - because they do not have the organizational commitment to do that.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by Buster

Yeah,.the rebuilding process started when Vinny was canned and Allen was brought in. I don't know why so many people won't admit it.

I knew this would be a transition/rebuliding year, with more success in year #2.


Of course, I had blindly optimistic hopes for the team...I always do as a true fan...but there was a LOT to fix with a 4-12 team with no offensive line whatsoever...more than could be fixed in a single year.

We've made a lot more progress than our record shows. I'm a bit worried about the defensive scheme, but individuals have played well on defense. The 4-3 to 3-4 move is rarely smooth.

I disagree cause if they truly thought that then why give philly two picks for mcnabb? and two more picks for brown? they wanted to win now.

[SmootSmack]

Graham Gano essentially represents the conundrum Redskins fans face. Ask every 5 Redskins fans, and probably 3 want him gone. But if you want to rebuild, you probably have to have patience and put up with Gano missing some kicks, Sundberg botching a snap, Banks fumbling, Riley committing a penalty, Moore missing a tackle...that said, there's a fine (very fine) line between being patient and holding on for too long

[WilbursHomie]

Every crappy team is about 3 small moves away from at least being respectable. OFFENSIVE LINE!!! That's it. That's the only thing that matters. This is not hard to figure out, I don't understand why we can't EVER have a decent offensive line anymore. We are the only team that has a nickname for our O line glory days for Christ Sake. A massive, pissed off group of hairy armed Offensive linemen should be industry standard in DC. Like good Defense in Pittsburgh or Chicago or sissy's in Dallas. You want better defensive play, get an offensive line. You want better QB play, get an offensive line. You want aging WR's to be more effective, get an offensive line. You want to save money, get an offensive line, sign my slow ass for 50 grand a year at running back and watch me get 125 a game behind those corn fed mules. 3 studs and 5 above average guys. That's it. That's how you win a SB with Trent Dilfer at QB. That's how you take a 6th round pick named Tom Brady and turn him into TOM BRADY!!! A young confident QB is a dangerous thing, talented or not. O line gives that to you. I would use every single draft pick for 3 years on O line. I'd be lining up a 350 pound monster running a 6.6 40 yard dash at wide receiver I'd be so deep at O line. We might not win a SB, but we'll go 10-6 and make the playoffs every single year from now until the end of time. That's how I still have faith in our deflated franchise. Always 3 moves away if they can figure it out.

[Longtimefan]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Graham Gano essentially represents the conundrum Redskins fans face. Ask every 5 Redskins fans, and probably 3 want him gone. But if you want to rebuild, you probably have to have patience and put up with Gano missing some kicks, Sundberg botching a snap, Banks fumbling, Riley committing a penalty, Moore missing a tackle...that said, there's a fine (very fine) line between being patient and holding on for too long

I agree SS...In the case of Gano, there wasn't a lot of pressure on him to make either of the kicks he missed yesterday We play so many close games that in most instances a F/G often decides the outcome of the game. Should the team ever get to the point where it can score touchdowns and not be so dependent on F/G's some of the pressure may be relieved on the young kicker. Another case where a little patience should be exhibited.