Report: Grossman Starting on Sunday

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by Hail to the Redskins

My take on Mike Shanahan is pretty clear... He is 100% ANTI "Superstar"... anti-"Special Treatment"

... meaning, he doesn't even entertain the idea of someone getting superstar treatment or being "grandfathered" in to leeway. Either you practice 100%, perform well, or you are sat down.

He's not going to budge at all to meet common ground or give in at all to a player.

That I can respect a little... but at the same time...

He has made some of the craziest bone-headed moves I could have imagined.

Mistake 1: 3-4 defense. If he evaluated the Skins at all last year he'd have known that we had the pieces for a 4-3... with some of our absolute best players thriving in it. And not just Haynesworth, but he, Carter, and Rak all used properly in the 4-3 may have helped us win at least 1 or 2 more games this year IMO.

Mistake 2: Benching McNabb vs Lions wasn't the mistake... it's how he handled it after that was... whoa dumb.

Mistake 3: Not going after Houshmenzadeh or R. Moss when they were available and dirt cheap. We could have had them BOTH... these guys could've help evaluate McNabb (taking away the whole "he had no weapons" excuse... imagine Santana & Randy Moss on the outside, Housh in the slot, with Cooley & F. Davis as your TEs)

Mistake 4: Benching McNabb right now. Everyone knows Grossman & Beck are not future Super Bowl winning QBs and now all we've done is ruin trade value we had for McNabb. If he's not your guy... fine... but whew... dumb.

#1: Do you really think going back to a 4-3 with the same players would make that much of a difference? Just line up Carter, AH, Golston, Orakpo along the front four; with Alexander, Fletch, and McIntosh back at LB and we'd be back in the top 10 defensively? I don't. Something happened with this group of players -- and we know that because they still play in 4-3 alignments. It didn't matter what the scheme was.

#2: Okay, so it was a public relations mishap. Shanny said the wrong things. And? So what? Might as well get used to this head coach being especially cryptic about the information he's willing to release.

#3: Point taken. Housh would have been nice. Randy Moss? Ehh. Not so much.

#4: I don't know what sort of trade value McNabb would have been worth even if he played the rest of the season out. He wasn't doing well. No matter what we would have been looking at a 5th - 7th round pick in the best of circumstances.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

#1: Do you really think going back to a 4-3 with the same players would make that much of a difference? Just line up Carter, AH, Golston, Orakpo along the front four; with Alexander, Fletch, and McIntosh back at LB and we'd be back in the top 10 defensively? I don't. Something happened with this group of players -- and we know that because they still play in 4-3 alignments. It didn't matter what the scheme was.

Agreed, an above average 4-3 defense requires, necessarily, a career-type year from AH. That's a HUGE assumption given where he is now that all we needed to do was stay in the 4-3 on RUNNING downs, and Albert would have terrorized quarterbacks while keeping blockers off of Fletcher better than Ma'ake and Golston (who would have been the DTs) have.

The defense failed because we weren't able to adequately replace Haynesworth's 2009 contributions. Assuming that a 40 front would have made the entire problem with AH disappear is to misunderstand both the Shanahan-Haynesworth dynamic and the natural aging of defensive players.

[Hail to the Redskins]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

#1: Do you really think going back to a 4-3 with the same players would make that much of a difference? Just line up Carter, AH, Golston, Orakpo along the front four; with Alexander, Fletch, and McIntosh back at LB and we'd be back in the top 10 defensively? I don't. Something happened with this group of players -- and we know that because they still play in 4-3 alignments. It didn't matter what the scheme was.

#2: Okay, so it was a public relations mishap. Shanny said the wrong things. And? So what? Might as well get used to this head coach being especially cryptic about the information he's willing to release.

#3: Point taken. Housh would have been nice. Randy Moss? Ehh. Not so much.

#4: I don't know what sort of trade value McNabb would have been worth even if he played the rest of the season out. He wasn't doing well. No matter what we would have been looking at a 5th - 7th round pick in the best of circumstances.

#1: Completely disagree. Name ONE TIME when we had the front 7 you described for an entire game this season. I know when Haynesworth WAS in the game in 4-3 setups he was dominating as always. I don't remember any time where Rak, Haynesworth, Golston, and Carter were on the line at the same time. And you think our defense would be worse than 32nd in the league, which we are?? Allowing 135 rushing yards and 260 passing yards a game while allowing 23.8 points per?? That's 23 more rushing and 53 more passing yards per game compared to last year. We also have allowed the most 10+ play drives in the NFL. As Keyshawn would say... "Come on, man!" I am not saying we'd have been top 10... why are you jumping from 32nd to top 10? I'd be happy with 15th right now. We'll just disagree on that one.

#2: He TWICE fumbled with an excuse. It put a huge dent into the whole "new regime, new attitude... out with dysfunction, in with professionalism." For a guy who expects his players to be stand up, stand behind your work guys... then shouldn't he? If he was disappointed in McNabb's play, just say so... why go with 2-minute offense and cardiac endurance craziness?

#3: Explained in my other post.. Do I think he'd be better than Armstrong... especially when Armstrong is mostly used for deep passes... yes. Just my opinion.

#4: I think if they know he doesn't fit what they want to do and they want to go in a different direction, then you play him... hope he plays well enough over the last 3 games that between the Vikings, Cardinals, Bengals, Panthers, Broncos, Titans, etc there could have been SOME competition to drum up trade value is all I am saying. Evaluate Grossman & Beck? Do you honestly think either will be our starting QB in 2012?

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Hail to the Redskins

#1: Completely disagree. Name ONE TIME when we had the front 7 you described for an entire game this season. I know when Haynesworth WAS in the game in 4-3 setups he was dominating as always. I don't remember any time where Rak, Haynesworth, Golston, and Carter were on the line at the same time. And you think our defense would be worse than 32nd in the league, which we are?? Allowing 135 rushing yards and 260 passing yards a game while allowing 23.8 points per?? That's 23 more rushing and 53 more passing yards per game compared to last year. We also have allowed the most 10+ play drives in the NFL. As Keyshawn would say... "Come on, man!" I am not saying we'd have been top 10... why are you jumping from 32nd to top 10? I'd be happy with 15th right now. We'll just disagree on that one.

32nd is a really poor estimation of where our defense is right now. It implies that Houston, Jacksonville, Dallas, Denver, and Seattle are better right now on that side of the ball. They aren't.

I'd say, with our injuries and all, we're right about as strong of a defense as New England is. They don't rank very well either. 27th I think, by total yards against. I think that's a good estimation of where our defense is by production.

[Hail to the Redskins]

How about this...

* Our defense has been great this year... huge improvement from 2009 in the 4-3.
* Randy Moss is a worse WR than Anthony Armstrong.
* Housh & Moss were given huge contracts with their new teams. (I could've SWORN they both got vet mins after being released... looked it up... umm yep that is fact... but eh... who cares about that?).
* Mike Shanahan's handling of McNabb's benching against Detroit wasn't too much of a mess.

You know... I think... after a while.... it's really idiotic to argue OPINIONS. They are opinions. When someone other than yourself puts them on a message board... do you have to try and prove them wrong? Is that what a message board is? I thought I was just venting my opinion... didn't realize this was a place to attempt to act like the smartest football evaluator in the history of man.... maybe my idea of a fan message board is all wrong.... I guess I'll stand corrected.

[Dirtbag59]

Originally Posted by GMScud

Interesting snippet from that article:

Wilbon, who made no pretense of objectivity as he ripped into Shanahan, said that McNabb has no ill will toward Rex Grossman, who has replaced him as the starter. In fact, Wilbon claims that one of the things McNabb is upset about is that Shanahan waited until after Thursday’s practice to make the move, depriving Grossman of the opportunity to work with the first-string offense on Wednesday and Thursday.

Gotta agree with DM on that one. If you're gonna make the move, and you supposedly were considering it before last week's game as well, why not just insert Grossman at the start of this week's preparation for Dallas? Was DM so bad in this week of practice that he'd make this switch two days before the game without giving Grossman a full week of snaps with the first team?

Shanahan looks bad.

Feels more like he's trying to secure a high draft slot. Which is a good sign. Maybe we'll finally get our rebuilding project. Just pray it doesn't turn out like the 49er's.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Hail to the Redskins

How about this...

* Our defense has been great this year... huge improvement from 2009 in the 4-3.
* Randy Moss is a worse WR than Anthony Armstrong.
* Housh & Moss were given huge contracts with their new teams. (I could've SWORN they both got vet mins after being released... looked it up... umm yep that is fact... but eh... who cares about that?).
* Mike Shanahan's handling of McNabb's benching against Detroit wasn't too much of a mess.

You know... I think... after a while.... it's really idiotic to argue OPINIONS. They are opinions. When someone other than yourself puts them on a message board... do you have to try and prove them wrong? Is that what a message board is? I thought I was just venting my opinion... didn't realize this was a place to attempt to act like the smartest football evaluator in the history of man.... maybe my idea of a fan message board is all wrong.... I guess I'll stand corrected.

Since when is telling someone they are wrong out of line on a discussion board? If you just want to feel warm and fuzzy about your beliefs, then not posting them is the best way to ensure that.

There's not even great evidence that you are wrong, re: our defense, as our run defense ranking is down significantly from last year while our pass defense...is similar. That was supposed to be a positive trade-off, but there's been no trade. It's just been a decline in run defense. The trade off has been less pass rush for better coverage, instead of better coverage for less run defense. That suggests a problem in the personnel on the front.

I can assure you those problems are named McIntosh, Golston, and Kemoeatu, and Orakpo is a liability against the run who was protected by the scheme last year. We have more blockers on Fletcher right now than ever before. That can be blamed on the 3-4, but independent of scheme, I'm looking at McIntosh and Golston and Kemo not doing their jobs in any scheme. Gap defense is gap defense. If we're bad at it, we're bad at it. Doesn't matter where you stand before the play, you need to control your gap.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Hail to the Redskins

You know... I think... after a while.... it's really idiotic to argue OPINIONS. They are opinions. When someone other than yourself puts them on a message board... do you have to try and prove them wrong? Is that what a message board is? I thought I was just venting my opinion... didn't realize this was a place to attempt to act like the smartest football evaluator in the history of man.... maybe my idea of a fan message board is all wrong.... I guess I'll stand corrected.

if we all just posted our opinions without having to ever defend them this would just be a blog basically. This is a place to share your opinions and hear others that may or may not agree with you. You have the full right to vent your opinion as others do too. Disagreeing with you doesn't necessarily make your opinion wrong or right

[skinsfaninok]

Btw where has Aceinthehouse been?? He hasn't said much as of late

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

Btw where has Aceinthehouse been?? He hasn't said much as of late

Doesn't have much to say I suppose.

[mooby]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

Btw where has Aceinthehouse been?? He hasn't said much as of late

I heard when the Skins started losing big in the second half of the season it made him take a step back and reevaluate his 14-2 prediction, and that once he did he realized his only course of action was to become a Buddhist Monk and join a monestary. He changed his name to mona-muananunana and devoted his life to Buddha.

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by Hail to the Redskins

#1: Completely disagree. Name ONE TIME when we had the front 7 you described for an entire game this season. I know when Haynesworth WAS in the game in 4-3 setups he was dominating as always. I don't remember any time where Rak, Haynesworth, Golston, and Carter were on the line at the same time. And you think our defense would be worse than 32nd in the league, which we are?? Allowing 135 rushing yards and 260 passing yards a game while allowing 23.8 points per?? That's 23 more rushing and 53 more passing yards per game compared to last year. We also have allowed the most 10+ play drives in the NFL. As Keyshawn would say... "Come on, man!" I am not saying we'd have been top 10... why are you jumping from 32nd to top 10? I'd be happy with 15th right now. We'll just disagree on that one.

#2: He TWICE fumbled with an excuse. It put a huge dent into the whole "new regime, new attitude... out with dysfunction, in with professionalism." For a guy who expects his players to be stand up, stand behind your work guys... then shouldn't he? If he was disappointed in McNabb's play, just say so... why go with 2-minute offense and cardiac endurance craziness?

#3: Explained in my other post.. Do I think he'd be better than Armstrong... especially when Armstrong is mostly used for deep passes... yes. Just my opinion.

#4: I think if they know he doesn't fit what they want to do and they want to go in a different direction, then you play him... hope he plays well enough over the last 3 games that between the Vikings, Cardinals, Bengals, Panthers, Broncos, Titans, etc there could have been SOME competition to drum up trade value is all I am saying. Evaluate Grossman & Beck? Do you honestly think either will be our starting QB in 2012?

The tumble we took defensively was going to happen regardless of how we lined up. I've argued that for weeks now. It's the same players, they're just in different spots. In fact, I've read that we've only been in the 3-4 about 30% of the time. Outside of Orakpo, Landry and Fletch, the guys we have in the front 7 just aren't very good.

Again, I won't argue with you about what Shanny said or shouldn't have said. That's his m.o. and you might as well get used to it. He's not a coach who is going to write a tell-all for every press conference he gives.

And I don't know who our starting QB will be next year. McNabb wasn't playing well, so he got benched. It happens with every other position on the field, but somehow, if it happens to the quarterback, people have a conniption fit.

It didn't work out with McNabb. Sucks, but oh well. I'd rather it go this way than to hang on forever hoping against hope that your guy will work out. We should be thankful Shanny isn't as stubborn as others might have been.