2012 Presidential Election (free for all edition)

[mlmpetert]

Well im as surprised as everyone else. Im glad theres an end to this story finally. But to be nitpicky:

‘The bust of Sir Winston Churchill by Sir Jacob Epstein was uniquely lent to a foreign head of state, President George W Bush, from the Government Art Collection in the wake of 9/11 as a signal of the strong transatlantic relationship. It was lent for the first term of office of President Bush. When the President was elected for his second and final term, the loan was extended until January 2009.

The new President has decided not to continue this loan and the bust has now been returned. It is on display at the Ambassador’s Residence.”

1) Maybe a language barrier of sorts? The whole bust thing was a resonable sized story/lure in America AND in Brittin for several years. Rightfully so or not, doesnt really matter. Why the hell did the Embassy never clairify their remarks?

2) So The White House blog and "fact" checker is just some kid with the internet? WTF, youd think he would have some kind of inside information and be posting real stuff. This fact checking kid is spreading more mis-information than anyone else. He's striaght up wrong on many things. His update doesnt even acknowlege that hes wrong, it just states info that he could have got from perusing the Debating With the Enemy section of his faviort Redskins forum. Jesus.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by mlmpetert

Well im as surprised as everyone else. Im glad theres an end to this story finally. But to be nitpicky:



1) Maybe a language barrier of sorts? The whole bust thing was a resonable sized story/lure in America AND in Brittin for several years. Rightfully so or not, doesnt really matter. Why the hell did the Embassy never clairify their remarks?

2) So The White House blog and "fact" checker is just some kid with the internet? WTF, youd think he would have some kind of inside information and be posting real stuff. This fact checking kid is spreading more mis-information than anyone else. He's striaght up wrong on many things. His update doesnt even acknowlege that hes wrong, it just states info that he could have got from perusing the Debating With the Enemy section of his faviort Redskins forum. Jesus.

No, Dan Pffeifer is the White House Communications Director. He posts blogs at the White House on site occasionally. Been around for years.

The original bust on loan from Nixon was being worked on for a while and the Brits decided to "loan" the match to Bush until the end of his term. It's custom to return all art and such at the end of each of administration. What's being missed in all of this, at some point the original bust was returned to the "residence" and there were two. When O took office they sent the other one down the street.

The end.

[mlmpetert]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

No, Dan Pffeifer is the White House Communications Director. He posts blogs at the White House on site occasionally. Been around for years.

The original bust on loan from Nixon was being worked on for a while and the Brits decided to "loan" the match to Bush until the end of his term. It's custom to return all art and such at the end of each of administration. What's being missed in all of this, at some point the original bust was returned to the "residence" and there were two. When O took office they sent the other one down the street.

The end.

You know at first i was going to call Dan Pffeifer a complete idiot but im thinking its not really his fault. No one knows whats going on in this administration. Its got to be painful working working there, regardless of how strongly you feel about Admin's ideology. For God's sake the second cabinet meeting of the year was just held. Wtf does Obama do all day?

Obama Holds First Cabinet Meeting Since January | The Weekly Standard

And come on 12th. I appreciate your summary of what happened but thats not at all what im saying. Do you not find it odd at all the way the the British Embassy phrased the return of the statue? I mean this is such a non-issue in retrospect. So why did the Obama admin or the Brits never clarify. I mean regardless if you think it was an issue or not we all thought it happened. Even Pffeifer, bless his sole, had no idea what was going on.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by mlmpetert

You know at first i was going to call Dan Pffeifer a complete idiot but im thinking its not really his fault. No one knows whats going on in this administration. Its got to be painful working working there, regardless of how strongly you feel about Admin's ideology. For God's sake the second cabinet meeting of the year was just held. Wtf does Obama do all day?

Obama Holds First Cabinet Meeting Since January | The Weekly Standard

And come on 12th. I appreciate your summary of what happened but thats not at all what im saying. Do you not find it odd at all the way the the British Embassy phrased the return of the statue? I mean this is such a non-issue in retrospect. So why did the Obama admin or the Brits never clarify. I mean regardless if you think it was an issue or not we all thought it happened. Even Pffeifer, bless his sole, had no idea what was going on.

I can't believe I'm still discussing this retarded issue, which says a lot about me actually.

In terms of Cabinet meetings. Really? The president is in meetings everyday. But if you're really concerned, just like I told HG28, go to whitehouse.gov and POTUS' sked is posted daily. Daily. Yes, it's public information.

The mix-up was in the initial reporting by the British newspaper, not the White House. Had they clarified from the jump that there were two busts instead of one, this conversation wouldn't exist. It's really that simple to me. Why should the executive branch of our government, with all the pressing issues, keep tabs and report to the general public and media the location of Winston Churchill's bust. Do realize how absurd that sounds?

[saden1]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

I can't believe I'm still discussing this retarded issue, which says a lot about me actually.

In terms of Cabinet meetings. Really? The president is in meetings everyday. But if you're really concerned, just like I told HG28, go to whitehouse.gov and POTUS' sked is posted daily. Daily. Yes, it's public information.

The mix-up was in the initial reporting by the British newspaper, not the White House. Had they clarified from the jump that there were two busts instead of one, this conversation wouldn't exist. It's really that simple to me. Why should the executive branch of our government, with all the pressing issues, keep tabs and report to the general public and media the location of Winston Churchill's bust. Do realize how absurd that sounds?

Dude, take it easy maaaaan. It's like this bro, if the information is not available on the websites I frequent it does not exist. Information must be observed to exist...honestly, it is your responsibility to disapprove anything we say not the other way around.


As for the Churchill bust, you can never have too many of his busts in the White House. It's disappointing that we only have one of his busts when we could have had two.

[drew54]

Originally Posted by saden1

it is your responsibility to disapprove anything we say not the other way around.

Romney didn't pay any taxes for 10 years.

Harry Reid: Bain Investor Told Me That Mitt Romney 'Didn't Pay Any Taxes For 10 Years'

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by drew54

Romney didn't pay any taxes for 10 years.

Harry Reid: Bain Investor Told Me That Mitt Romney 'Didn't Pay Any Taxes For 10 Years'

Certainly a credible source Reid has.....

"Tellingly, neither Reid nor his office would reveal who the investor was, making it impossible to verify if the accusation is true. And as his quote makes clear, he's uncertain if the information is accurate. The Romney campaign's press secretary, Andrea Saul, has previously denied rumors that Romney didn't pay "any taxes at all."

[saden1]

Originally Posted by drew54

Romney didn't pay any taxes for 10 years.

Harry Reid: Bain Investor Told Me That Mitt Romney 'Didn't Pay Any Taxes For 10 Years'

LOL...vicious politics at it's best.

The fact that Romney has had a Swiss and Cayman Island bank accounts and 130 plus shell companies is sufficient for me to know his unscrupulousness. If he wants to hide his taxes it's going to be tough.

[mlmpetert]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

I can't believe I'm still discussing this retarded issue, which says a lot about me actually.

In terms of Cabinet meetings. Really? The president is in meetings everyday. But if you're really concerned, just like I told HG28, go to whitehouse.gov and POTUS' sked is posted daily. Daily. Yes, it's public information.

The mix-up was in the initial reporting by the British newspaper, not the White House. Had they clarified from the jump that there were two busts instead of one, this conversation wouldn't exist. It's really that simple to me. Why should the executive branch of our government, with all the pressing issues, keep tabs and report to the general public and media the location of Winston Churchill's bust. Do realize how absurd that sounds?

I completely realize how absurd it is for the White House to spend time with correspondence of tabloid type issues, but isnt that part of the purpose of The White House blog? Or the Attack Watch team or Obama's Truth Team or the White House Twitter account, or maybe even Obama's Twitter account?

So like you said HAD they clarified this at the begaining it would be a non-issue. And HAD Pfeiffer not simply just made something up (that wasnt true) to dispute a claim thats several YEARS old, then neither of us would be wasting out time on this. Unfotunitly no one knows whats going on there.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Who's going to see this?

2016: Obama's America | Official Movie Site

Looks like Oscar material to me :cool-smil

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

Who's going to see this?

2016: Obama's America | Official Movie Site

Looks like Oscar material to me :cool-smil

Interesting...CPAC speech.

"I think that if you take...and apply it to the action of the son...these are the guys I call Obama's founding fathers...this isn't just a, kinda hit job on Obama...I'm a college professor and the film is a journey...if the american people really knew who Obama was they would see he is not an ordinary democrat."


Any idea if the movie a comedy or a tragedy?

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by mlmpetert

I completely realize how absurd it is for the White House to spend time with correspondence of tabloid type issues, but isnt that part of the purpose of The White House blog? Or the Attack Watch team or Obama's Truth Team or the White House Twitter account, or maybe even Obama's Twitter account?

So like you said HAD they clarified this at the begaining it would be a non-issue. And HAD Pfeiffer not simply just made something up (that wasnt true) to dispute a claim thats several YEARS old, then neither of us would be wasting out time on this. Unfotunitly no one knows whats going on there.

Pretty remarkable that we've had these many exchanges and still don't eye to eye. The purpose of the White House blog is not to debunk baseless right wing theories as to the location of artwork. The White House has an entire office dedicated to that. So that, you know, the president and his staff can focus on governing.

White House Art | The White House

Curator's Office - White House Museum

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

Pretty remarkable that we've had these many exchanges and still don't eye to eye. The purpose of the White House blog is not to debunk baseless right wing theories as to the location of artwork. The White House has an entire office dedicated to that. So that, you know, the president and his staff can focus on governing.

White House Art | The White House

Curator's Office - White House Museum

I thought the WH blog was to point to jobs Obama created in districts that don't exist.

[mlmpetert]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

Pretty remarkable that we've had these many exchanges and still don't eye to eye. The purpose of the White House blog is not to debunk baseless right wing theories as to the location of artwork. The White House has an entire office dedicated to that. So that, you know, the president and his staff can focus on governing.

White House Art | The White House

Curator's Office - White House Museum

Haha, couldnt agree more.... at least thats one thing right?


What i find problematic is the way Pfeiffer handled the whole thing. I think everyone would agree Pfeiffer made a mistake and maybe even went a little rouge in what hes otherwise supposed to be “reporting” on.

But this isn’t some baseless right wing theory. It’s a well known thing, carried on by some ignored by others. Honestly before last week didn’t you think the artwork was returned a little hastily? I think Saden1 even thought that it was returned perhaps in an insisting way. And that’s the whole point. No one really cares whos correct in mentioning the exact whereabouts of the bust. The whole issue which has been and is still being ignore is how the bust got to where it is.

First to break the story of the Churchill bust being returned to the British Embassy was The Sunday Telegraph’s Tim Shipman (now at The Daily Mail), who wrote in February 2009:

Barack Obama has sent Sir Winston Churchill packing and pulse rates soaring among anxious British diplomats. A bust of the former prime minister once voted the greatest Briton in history, which was loaned to George W Bush from the Government's art collection after the September 11 attacks, has now been formally handed back.
The bronze by Sir Jacob Epstein, worth hundreds of thousands of pounds if it were ever sold on the open market, enjoyed pride of place in the Oval Office during President Bush's tenure.
But when British officials offered to let Mr Obama to hang onto the bust for a further four years, the White House said: "Thanks, but no thanks."

Two weeks earlier, in January 2009, The Times had revealed the bust had been removed from the Oval Office and placed in storage, in a piece headlined: "Churchill bust casts shadow over the Special Relationship" (no longer online, but available on news databases such as Lexis/Nexis). Significantly, The Times noted that the British government, led at the time by Gordon Brown, was keen for the bust to go back to the Oval Office:

Britain wants President Obama to put a bronze bust of Sir Winston Churchill back in the Oval Office, where it stood for the past eight years as a symbol of an enduring special relationship with America. The White House is not so sure.
Shortly before Mr Obama's inauguration, the Jacob Epstein bronze is understood to have been removed and placed in storage by White House curators. Recent photographs show that a bust of Abraham Lincoln, one of the new President's heroes, has been moved to take the position once occupied by Churchill.
The bronze was lent to George Bush by Tony Blair in 2001 from the Government Art Collection for the duration of his presidency. It is now due to be returned.
However, a spokesman for the British Embassy in Washington said yesterday: "We have made it clear that we would be pleased to extend the loan should Mr Obama so wish." He added that no response had been received; yesterday the White House declined to comment.

Churchill bust debacle: ‘amateurish’ Obama White House remains firmly in denial over snub to Britain – Telegraph Blogs

[NC_Skins]

Holy shit. Stop the presses and alert Rupert Murdoch. Somebody has gone rogue at Fox News.


Obama's right, Americans can't succeed without government | Fox News

A lot has been made over comments made by the president last Friday to this effect. In many cases, President Obama was deliberately quoted out of context. Here is what the president actually said:

It’s not either/or. The president was clear: We succeed because of our individual initiative but also because of the public investments that help springboard that success. Don’t believe me? Then go start a business in Pakistan or Russia. American entrepreneurs succeed in part because they’re in America. And in America, we don’t get ours and then yank away the ladder of opportunity for the next generation.

We can slash Medicare and Social Security and public schools and college grants and all of the stepping stones that poor and middle class families have historically relied on to help climb the ladder of prosperity. Or millionaires and billionaires can pay the same tax rate as the middle class.

Well, that happy feel good moment didn't last long.


Small business owner to Obama -- you owe us! | Fox News