Should Mike Shanahan be fired?

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by punch it in

He sure as hell is Matty. He is aces up and down in my book. Kid is money - smart- a good kid - all the tools. He will win championships with the Redskins. I dont care who the hell his coach is to tell you the truth. He is special as all hell.

It's way too early to start crowing him a champion. Panther fans said the same thing as you are. Now, they are blaming everybody under the sun, and many pointing the fingers at Cam.


I've said numerous times, years 2 and 3 are going to be more important than this first year. Right now, I don't think we are running our conventional offense and have tailored it to his skills. This is the same thing that Chudzinski did with Cam in Carolina. Now, they are taking the training wheels off and finding out he's not so great at running the conventional offense. Not only that, defenses are now more prepared to face that read option they were doing and were shutting that down as well. Cam was a hero last year, now seems Chud is becoming a goat.

The two things that will separate a QB like RGIII and Cam is, maturity and intelligence. This is why I think RGIII will overcome and be a big time player for a while. That said, still to early to crown him.

[Mechanix544]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

It's way too early to start crowing him a champion. Panther fans said the same thing as you are. Now, they are blaming everybody under the sun, and many pointing the fingers at Cam.


I've said numerous times, years 2 and 3 are going to be more important than this first year. Right now, I don't think we are running our conventional offense and have tailored it to his skills. This is the same thing that Chudzinski did with Cam in Carolina. Now, they are taking the training wheels off and finding out he's not so great at running the conventional offense. Not only that, defenses are now more prepared to face that read option they were doing and were shutting that down as well. Cam was a hero last year, now seems Chud is becoming a goat.

The two things that will separate a QB like RGIII and Cam is, maturity and intelligence. This is why I think RGIII will overcome and be a big time player for a while. That said, still to early to crown him.

Wonderful point. After seeing Cam Newton do what he did last year, I am completely baffled as to why he isn't doing ANYTHING this year. Maybe the fact that the gimmicky college style offense takes a half a season or a little more for teams to scheme for, and once the playing field is leveled on a scheme basis, that advantage is very much diminished. I too think Shanny will be here next year. I do not think we will sniff 8-8 this year, but if he does stay, next year will truly be a test for this regime. Because we will see if he can adjust to defenses adjusting from being able to look at 16 games of tape on our looks and formations, shifts, playcalling tendencies, etc........ I do believe it will be a defining season, whether I am completely wrong and RG3 has ridiculous success next year, because the coaching can plan for the "plans" and adjust, or if he is relying on RG3, runs the same Baylor looks and spreads, and RG3 struggles like Newton this year. If anyone can avoid a sophmore slump, I do believe I have a little, no, ALOT more faith in our guy than Fig Newton. Kyle will definitely have his work cut out for him during this offseason. I am cautiously optimistic, if only for the fact the Griffin looks like Christ with a pigskin, turning water into gatorade and such............

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

It's way too early to start crowing him a champion. Panther fans said the same thing as you are. Now, they are blaming everybody under the sun, and many pointing the fingers at Cam.


I've said numerous times, years 2 and 3 are going to be more important than this first year. Right now, I don't think we are running our conventional offense and have tailored it to his skills. This is the same thing that Chudzinski did with Cam in Carolina. Now, they are taking the training wheels off and finding out he's not so great at running the conventional offense. Not only that, defenses are now more prepared to face that read option they were doing and were shutting that down as well. Cam was a hero last year, now seems Chud is becoming a goat.

The two things that will separate a QB like RGIII and Cam is, maturity and intelligence. This is why I think RGIII will overcome and be a big time player for a while. That said, still to early to crown him.

Cam is a quitter. You will never see RG -3 sulking on tge sidelines or making excuses. He is mature beyond his years. Takes character and skill to win a championship. He has both. I guess its up to your boy Shanny to put a defense/ DC in place to make RG-3 and this offense's success equal wins. I think that what he has shown so far after 8 games and the knowledge that his character bodes well as far as continuing to learn along with his obvious desire to win equal the markings of a young champion. I stand by my statement. He will win a championship with the Redskins. Is it a guess - an opinion. Obviously. Is it an educated one based on legit skill and legit leadership - aka - the tangibles and intangibles it takes to be a champion - yes sir it is.


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[skinsfaninok]

Isn't Mike an offensive coach?? Hmm

[Bucket]

I think Punch it in would commit suicide if RG3 turned out to be Vince Young II

[53Fan]

Just one more thing and I'll try to leave it alone. When we talk of how Mike has brought in good young talent and turned this roster around who are we comparing him to.....Vinny? I think most coaches would have done the same thing now that Allen is here and it's actually possible. Coach the offense...get a good DC and let him do his thing Mike. Let's win some games baby!

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by Bucket

I think Punch it in would commit suicide if RG3 turned out to be Vince Young II

Maybe I will be the president of his fan club one day.

Edit: if i was ever going to commit suicide over football related matters it would have been sometime during the John Beck era. My brain was telling me to stop watching but my eyes werent listening and so than my brain was telling me to stick hot pokers in my eyes , which probably would have looked like a suicide even though it was just a desperation move to never have to see john beck play again. But Than Rex came back and i just threw up in my mouth alot and beat my skull with blunt objects.
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[punch it in]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

Isn't Mike an offensive coach?? Hmm

Yeah Thats why i said / DC - its Shannys call who takes over the D post Haslett rite?


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[RedskinRat]

Are people not seeing the difference between being in every game and being on the wrong end of an Eagles-like loss (whichever season it was they jumped us for the most ugly, lopsided score I've seen)?

I see progress with this squad and if we'd had our starting Safeties, Carriker and Rak, who knows where we'd be now.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by RedskinRat

Are people not seeing the difference between being in every game and being on the wrong end of an Eagles-like loss (whichever season it was they jumped us for the most ugly, lopsided score I've seen)?

I see progress with this squad and if we'd had our starting Safeties, Carriker and Rak, who knows where we'd be now.

We were in a ton of games last year and the year before.

[Skinzman]

Originally Posted by The Goat

We were in a ton of games last year and the year before.

Out of 8 games, there has only been one we werent in. That didnt happen all that much the last few years.

Im still a believer that most teams went ultra conservative with us the last few years (or like the Giants last year, just assumed the win was guaranteed as long as they showed up and gave a half-ass effort). Most teams knew that as long as they werent giving up pick 6's to our defense, they would most likely win. We had no offense, so there was no reason to put in game plans to try and score 30 points against us and risk our defense scoring points. Its not that teams didnt want to score like crazy on us, they just knew that there was no reason to risk a play when you could just punt knowing that the ball would come back with no points scored by the Skins. Get a TD or two, then laugh as Rex/Beck/McNabb/Cambell ect. tried to get us back into the game.

I think we are getting teams best efforts and best game plans this year, and are staying right with them even with the terrible defense that we have.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by Skinzman

Out of 8 games, there has only been one we werent in. That didnt happen all that much the last few years.

Im still a believer that most teams went ultra conservative with us the last few years (or like the Giants last year, just assumed the win was guaranteed as long as they showed up and gave a half-ass effort). Most teams knew that as long as they werent giving up pick 6's to our defense, they would most likely win. We had no offense, so there was no reason to put in game plans to try and score 30 points against us and risk our defense scoring points. Its not that teams didnt want to score like crazy on us, they just knew that there was no reason to risk a play when you could just punt knowing that the ball would come back with no points scored by the Skins. Get a TD or two, then laugh as Rex/Beck/McNabb/Cambell ect. tried to get us back into the game.

I think we are getting teams best efforts and best game plans this year, and are staying right with them even with the terrible defense that we have.

Well said, and I agree with this.

[skinsfan69]

Bottom line is MS has to take the blame for the defense. He came in and changed it. It's been worse since he's taken over. And even with Carriker and Orakpo we were still at best an average defense. Changing to the 3-4 has not been a good move and the numbers back it up. RG3 buys him another year.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

Bottom line is MS has to take the blame for the defense. He came in and changed it. It's been worse since he's taken over. And even with Carriker and Orakpo we were still at best an average defense. Changing to the 3-4 has not been a good move and the numbers back it up. RG3 buys him another year.

Just curious what your take on the train of thought that offenses didn't run it up on us because they believed we couldn't come back - thus artificially raising our defensive stats.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

Just curious what your take on the train of thought that offenses didn't run it up on us because they believed we couldn't come back - thus artificially raising our defensive stats.

I think that's somewhat over analyzing it.