Campbell A Raider

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

Some seem to have very loose definitions of bust, but traditionally a bust is a guy that is an epic failure. A guy that comes into the league with high expectations and quickly proves that he is not a NFL caliber player.

Agreed. Not meeting expectations does not equate to bust. Vernon Gholston is a good example of a bust in recent years. 6th overall pick, and can't even get on the field.

As someone mentioned earlier- Heath Shuler, Akili Smith, Ryan Leaf, Mike Williams (USC WR), Charles Rogers- these are guys that are busts. College studs drafted very high who amounted to diddly poo in the NFL.

If a bust is a 1st round pick that is a starter in the NFL but not a star... well, then the NFL is full of starting players that are busts. Not the case IMO.

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

Some seem to have very loose definitions of bust, but traditionally a bust is a guy that is an epic failure. A guy that comes into the league with high expectations and quickly proves that he is not a NFL caliber player.

I agree with you about the high expectations, and if someone doesn't meet those expectations, that's when they become a bust. We like to talk about the "epic failures" that become busts, and often those big names are the ones synonomous with bust, but that doesn't mean that only the extremely epic failures are the only busts. Campbell was a bust for us, and he will likely suck in Oakland (due to poor leadership in that orginization and no help from players) meaning he will solidify himself as a bust.
Look at Roy Williams, he has played 25 games for the Cowboys, and has had only 57 receptions for 794 yards during those games. He was a Pro Bowler for the Lions, and played extremely well for them. So why is it Roy Williams is now a bust for the Cowboys?

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by jsarno

I agree with you about the high expectations, and if someone doesn't meet those expectations, that's when they become a bust. We like to talk about the "epic failures" that become busts, and often those big names are the ones synonomous with bust, but that doesn't mean that only the extremely epic failures are the only busts. Campbell was a bust for us, and he will likely suck in Oakland (due to poor leadership in that orginization and no help from players) meaning he will solidify himself as a bust.
Look at Roy Williams, he has played 25 games for the Cowboys, and has had only 57 receptions for 794 yards during those games. He was a Pro Bowler for the Lions, and played extremely well for them. So why is it Roy Williams is now a bust for the Cowboys?

By your definition, Roy Williams never won games with the Lions, so there should be no relative considerations, he was a bust when he was acquired by the Cowboys, and he's done nothing to change his plight there.

By the definitions of others, Williams has been a bust for the Cowboys because he was acquired from the Lions for a hefty price and with great expectations, and hasn't offered them acceptable production for their investment. I don't think too many people would actually propose that Williams isn't an NFL caliber player, but given that he was no great shakes for the Lions, the price that Dallas payed to get him looks obscene by comparison.

It's true that Roy Williams didn't offer quite the production that Detroit was hoping to get from a top ten pick, but he was able to play like a professional for four seasons there. Therefore, poor value, though clearly not a bust. Dallas wasn't looking for a professional in 2008, they were paying to get a developed no. 1 receiver, which there was little reason to think Williams would be.

[GusFrerotte]

Shuler was the biggest bust because it cost us most of the 90's. We spent the rest of the decade having starters at QB that were really brought in for depth purposes(Frerotte, Green), then acquired Brad Johnson for 2 seasons. IF Shuler would have been the stud he was projected to be we would have been in a few playoffs in the mid 90's. We were close with both Gus and Trent.

[GusFrerotte]

JC and Rocky aren't busts just never were able to take it to the next level. Shuler was a bust. When have you ever heard of a first round pick being booed for a seventh round QB?

[dgack]

JC may be a bust to us bitter, entitled Skins fans, but look, the guy is going elsewhere to start and even if he wasn't, more than likely, he'd be a solid backup in this league for years to come. That's a far cry from guys who flat out "cannot play".

I think we can all agree he failed to pick the team up on his back and carry it anywhere. He pretty quickly became a "game manager" type of QB, and there's probably a lot of good debate about why that happened, but really -- bust? I think not.

Those of you who've always disliked the guy looking to hang the bust label on him because of the draft picks we gave up to get him need to factor in the Gibbs 2.0 Personnel Inflation Cost (tm). Let's not forget, this was the FO that gave you TJ Duckett, Brandon Lloyd, and Adam Archuleta.

[beau_str]

best of luck to Jason, class act and a hell of a qb. i hope he gets what he deserves which is nothing but the best. absolute class act.

[T.O.Killa]

I am making the Raiders my second favorite team. JC should have never been put in the Suanders offense or the Zorn(west coast offense). JC will be where he belongs in a verticle passing game. With the speed recievers he has they should be able to run under some of his over thown balls. I wish him the best and will use my Direct tv to keep an eye on him. With that said, having McNabb is Awsome.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by T.O.Killa

I am making the Raiders my second favorite team. JC should have never been put in the Suanders offense or the Zorn(west coast offense). JC will be where he belongs in a verticle passing game. With the speed recievers he has they should be able to run under some of his over thown balls. I wish him the best and will use my Direct tv to keep an eye on him. With that said, having McNabb is Awsome.

So you watched the same QB as I did over the past five years. He might have a big arm but he cannot hit the side of a barn down field. His feel for the long pass down right sucked. When he should have lead the WR in he threw it out when he should have lead the WR out he threw it in. When he finally had a wide open WR down field he missed. I don't get how any one can say he had this vertical attack because I think that is the worse part of his game.

[SBXVII]

Originally Posted by firstdown

So you watched the same QB as I did over the past five years. He might have a big arm but he cannot hit the side of a barn down field. His feel for the long pass down right sucked. When he should have lead the WR in he threw it out when he should have lead the WR out he threw it in. When he finally had a wide open WR down field he missed. I don't get how any one can say he had this vertical attack because I think that is the worse part of his game.

Ditto. How many times did we see the ball even on short routes thrown behind the receivers? I'll admit he's safe with the ball, but being safe with the ball only means he didn't turn it over. Any QB who can throw the ball into the dirt and out of bounds would be considered safe with the ball.

He was an upgrade from Brunell. Atleast he could scramble and get the ball beyond 10 yrds once and a while. We have McNabb, who is supposed to be far and above better then JC. As long as we have upgraded and not made a lateral move like they tried to do last summer I'm happy.

[Miller101]

Originally Posted by firstdown

So you watched the same QB as I did over the past five years. He might have a big arm but he cannot hit the side of a barn down field. His feel for the long pass down right sucked. When he should have lead the WR in he threw it out when he should have lead the WR out he threw it in. When he finally had a wide open WR down field he missed. I don't get how any one can say he had this vertical attack because I think that is the worse part of his game.

Say what you want about Campbell, but remember that he got sacked 50 times last year. And most of those sacks were because Zorn didn't know anything about protection schemes. Also, remember that Campbell had two Offensive Coordinators last year and one of his coordinators was used to calling, "N37" or "B18". No other quarterback in the league has had to go through something like that. So, putting up 3600 yards passing and 20 touchdowns...................................yeah, those are average numbers, but putting up average numbers when you're getting sacked 50 times while hearing "B19" from your coordinator...........................Thats pretty impressive if you ask me. Letting him go was dumb. Letting him go for almost nothing in return was dumber. And trading for McNabb was the dumbest move this franchise has made since bringing in Deon Sanders.

But, you got to tip your cap to the Raider's front office on this one. They got a mobile gun slinger, who can learn a new system every year, do well with any offensive coordinator in the league, and can take hard hits! And it didn't cost them anything. What a move by the Raiders...........................

[JLW428]

Originally Posted by Miller101

Say what you want about Campbell, but remember that he got sacked 50 times last year. And most of those sacks were because Zorn didn't know anything about protection schemes. Also, remember that Campbell had two Offensive Coordinators last year and one of his coordinators was used to calling, "N37" or "B18". No other quarterback in the league has had to go through something like that. So, putting up 3600 yards passing and 20 touchdowns...................................yeah, those are average numbers, but putting up average numbers when you're getting sacked 50 times while hearing "B19" from your coordinator...........................Thats pretty impressive if you ask me. Letting him go was dumb. Letting him go for almost nothing in return was dumber. And trading for McNabb was the dumbest move this franchise has made since bringing in Deon Sanders.

But, you got to tip your cap to the Raider's front office on this one. They got a mobile gun slinger, who can learn a new system every year, do well with any offensive coordinator in the league, and can take hard hits! And it didn't cost them anything. What a move by the Raiders...........................

I'll give Campbell that - He is tough as nails. I think Campbell could've been a good QB if there was any type of continuity around him. It has to be very hard to basically start from scratch every year.

Best of luck to him in Oakland.

[SBXVII]

Originally Posted by Miller101

Say what you want about Campbell, but remember that he got sacked 50 times last year. And most of those sacks were because Zorn didn't know anything about protection schemes. Also, remember that Campbell had two Offensive Coordinators last year and one of his coordinators was used to calling, "N37" or "B18". No other quarterback in the league has had to go through something like that. So, putting up 3600 yards passing and 20 touchdowns...................................yeah, those are average numbers, but putting up average numbers when you're getting sacked 50 times while hearing "B19" from your coordinator...........................Thats pretty impressive if you ask me. Letting him go was dumb. Letting him go for almost nothing in return was dumber. And trading for McNabb was the dumbest move this franchise has made since bringing in Deon Sanders.

But, you got to tip your cap to the Raider's front office on this one. They got a mobile gun slinger, who can learn a new system every year, do well with any offensive coordinator in the league, and can take hard hits! And it didn't cost them anything. What a move by the Raiders...........................

I'll give you credit for the whole Zorn crap. Although it doesn't speak for his time with Gibbs. As far as the Bingo caller, remember the team got better and actually won a couple of games because of him. So don't blame the Bingo caller, blame the guy who couldn't win prior to the Bingo caller.

[MTK]

I do feel bad he's getting shipped to the black hole, but on the positive side of things he's going to be working with a very good OC in Hue Jackson. And with the level of "talent" at QB on that roster, he should definitely have the leg up on winning that starting job.

[freddyg12]

I always liked the Raiders, though w/age I don't really follow teams other than the Skins that much other than just watching important games. Since JC is there now & they made some good picks this weekend, I think the raiders may at least be respectable & I'll route for them. We don't play them for another 3 years.

I don't know if JC can win the job there but I'll be routing for him. Actually, they have quite a logjam at qb, it's quite possible that JC gets cut.