Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Rams)

[SC Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Someone here made a good point that I hadn't really though of until watching the game again this morning. Why do we wait until we get in the red zone to go for the end zone?

I say this without having watched any coaches tape, so some of it might come out of ignorance. But there is zero verticality to this offense. Everything is 12 yard crossing routes. They took shots to Kelly (should have gone, bad throw) and Thomas (bad route). But I'm not saying you throw bombs that have a low success rate, but how about some 20 yard digs or something. It is a very compressed offense. And they blame that on teams taking away Moss, but I think it is a lack of imagination on the offensive staff. Or maybe just stubbornness and desire to run some pure WC passing tree. It is possible to have verticality in a WC scheme, though, just look at the Eagles under Reid.

[irish]

Originally Posted by roth74va

Your the 2nd person to make this idiotic comment! WTF guys, he hits D.Thomas and Sellers right in the hands, and your blaming JC because he throws too hard? If you cant catch....you shouldnt have a job in the NFL. I understand dogging him when he under/over throws someone, but now we have issues with how hard he throws? Please.....thats a joke!!! BTW, Favre has made a pretty good name for himself throwing the ball ALOT harder. JC throws a beautiful ball, its always a nice tight spiral. Quit making excuses for NFL'ers who clearly cannot catch!!!!

And if your quoting the paper I apologize, but SBXVII always says this stupid crap.

I think the point is that there is a time for hard balls and a time for easy balls. JC typically throws a hard ball and struggles with the easy balls.

BTW, not only does Sellers have a job iin the NFL, for some unexplicable reason the Redskins just gave him an extension but that's another thread.

[SC Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by roth74va

Your the 2nd person to make this idiotic comment! WTF guys, he hits D.Thomas and Sellers right in the hands, and your blaming JC because he throws too hard? If you cant catch....you shouldnt have a job in the NFL. I understand dogging him when he under/over throws someone, but now we have issues with how hard he throws? Please.....thats a joke!!! BTW, Favre has made a pretty good name for himself throwing the ball ALOT harder. JC throws a beautiful ball, its always a nice tight spiral. Quit making excuses for NFL'ers who clearly cannot catch!!!!

And if your quoting the paper I apologize, but SBXVII always says this stupid crap.

Boswell did say that, but you are right, it is BS. Your Favre comparison is pretty good. The bottom line is that Mike Sellers is a good blocker but nothing else and Devin Thomas is not an NFL receiver. Thomas should never be on the field when we could instead of Kelly out there. They will continue to do it, because they drafted the guy high and they want to see if he has anything, but I am convinced now that he is a major liability whenever he is on the field. Kelly makes the team better.

We really did not learn much about Campbell this week. He left some plays on the field, he had guys let him down at other times. He looked uncomfortable in the pocket at times, but when he could throw on rhythm he was good. We're still in wait-and-see mode, but right now the offensive coaching is the heart of the issue.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Or too much imagination. 3rd down option pass from Portis? How about a fade to Mitchell or Kelly from Campbell? Simple, yet effective

Yeah wrong kind of imagination there. That was high school crap.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by irish

You should read Boswell's article in today's Wash Post. He basically says the O wasnt good at scoring under Gibbs and now with essentially the same guys they arent good at scoring under Zorn. Its the players, not the coaching. Think about it, the Moss & ARE are midgets so they get lost in the RZ. They only have 1 RB that's a threat so he's easily keyed on and stopped. JC throws a hard ball at close range which creates problems. Cooley as the only receiving threat is then double teamed and neutralized. The O can move up the field fine but just doesnt have the horses to be successful in the RZ.

I did and I still have the same opinion.

We now have Kelly, Thomas, and Davis, bigger guys that should be quality RZ targets. Get them all in there along with Cooley. I don't buy this crap that we don't have targets.

[irish]

Originally Posted by SC Skins Fan

Boswell did say that, but you are right, it is BS. Your Favre comparison is pretty good. The bottom line is that Mike Sellers is a good blocker but nothing else and Devin Thomas is not an NFL receiver. Thomas should never be on the field when we could instead of Kelly out there. They will continue to do it, because they drafted the guy high and they want to see if he has anything, but I am convinced now that he is a major liability whenever he is on the field. Kelly makes the team better.

We really did not learn much about Campbell this week. He left some plays on the field, he had guys let him down at other times. He looked uncomfortable in the pocket at times, but when he could throw on rhythm he was good. We're still in wait-and-see mode, but right now the offensive coaching is the heart of the issue.

Do you think it says anything about JC and the WRs that by his own admission they are still working on the end zone fade? I do.

Dont forget, the fastball was only one of Boswell's points about why the O will struggle to score down close.

[irish]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

I did and I still have the same opinion.

We now have Kelly, Thomas, and Davis, bigger guys that should be quality RZ targets. Get them all in there along with Cooley. I don't buy this crap that we don't have targets.

Like JC said to Kelli Johnson, they are still working on fade routes. Obviously JC and the WRs arent ready to run those kind of plays in the RZ.

Like Bos said, these guys are mules not thoroughbreds. There's nothing wrong with mules but you cant expect thoroughbred preformance. That also means there is no need to get upset when they dont play like thoroughbreds. They are what they are.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by irish

Like JC said to Kelli Johnson, they are still working on fade routes. Obviously JC and the WRs arent ready to run those kind of plays in the RZ.

You don't have to run only fades though.

[irish]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

You don't have to run only fades though.

True. This is all the same arguments and heartburn we had when the key guys couldnt score for Gibbs. Its becomming obvious its the players not the coaches.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by irish

True. This is all the same arguments and heartburn we had when the key guys couldnt score for Gibbs. Its becomming obvious its the players not the coaches.

We don't know if it's the players when they're not even given the chance.

You really think Zorn is calling a good game inside the RZ?

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by irish

Its funny you mention the fade. Kelli Johnson asked JC about running the fade during CSN's post game show yesterday and JC's response was "we are working on it". I almost fell out of my chair.

Chase and Marko had the fade down perfectly. Obviously the answer is to go back and get Chase

[irish]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

We don't know if it's the players when they're not even given the chance.

You really think Zorn is calling a good game inside the RZ?

I think there's a reason they arent given the chance. If I was Zorn I'd put these players out there, run it wide open and show once and for all that they cant do it the way its supposed to be done. That way I could go to mgmt and say see, I dont have the guys that can get it done. But that said I think Zorn knows this is a marathon and you have to play with the cards you are dealt so he is trying his best to put them in a position to succeed based on their limitations.

What I see in the RZ is pretty bad but I think Zorn calls plays based on the players he has not the players he wishes he had.

[redsk1]

First post after the game:

My main problems w/ the game was the playcalling on our RZ offense. I think we ran on all of the 1st downs. 4 I think. 1 down is one that defenses aren't real sure what you are going to run. You've got to run some routes in the end zone.

The Portis Throw was a horrible call. It wasn't even disguised well. It's like we are coming up w/ BS plays b/c we know we can't score w/ our normal offense.

The D came to play and gave up 7 pts. Yes, it wasn't pretty all day but effective. I don't care what anyone sais AH had another great game.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by irish

True. This is all the same arguments and heartburn we had when the key guys couldnt score for Gibbs. Its becomming obvious its the players not the coaches.

I think it is becoming obvious that may ALSO be the players.

[CRedskinsRule]

I do think JC probably struggles with the fade. Chase, Collins, and the other guy have all shown some ability at it. JC is a very line of sight type passer. Soooo if that's the case, maybe he needs a little bit of coaching on that. I wonder who works the most with the qb's.

I will defend the Portis throw to the end, especially since JC's ankle was hurt. Portis has thrown that before, and nearly hit it. A shot is a shot, and if JZ doesnt think Campbell can throw the touch, give it to someone who can. My biggest gripe is the last CP stretch run, not because the formation was bad but I think the defense was so anxious to over run it that a fake would have left Cooley wide open in the opposite direction.