"Jason Campbell struggles against the Steelers"

[jgalecpa]

I personally believe, that if after 12 regular season games (NOT preseason) we are not in the playoff hunt, then it will be time to look elsewhere.

J-Dawg.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by jgalecpa

I personally believe, that if after 12 regular season games (NOT preseason) we are not in the playoff hunt, then it will be time to look elsewhere.

J-Dawg.

This is probably about right. After 12 games, you can probably evaluate Campbell's development as a player in it's entirety.

Still, context is important. If at that point, we're not in the playoff hunt, but the evidence suggest that Campbell has improved (i.e. we have the 26th best defense in the league), then you have to act accordingly in the offseason. This isn't the open and shut playoffs or bust case people would like it to be.

[warriorzpath]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I think it's a fair assumption that he was trying to do his best, and yet, any scout with any experience will tell you that little can be concluded from an endless string of Campbell's play this year.

Despite your prior assertion that you're also considering past play, you seem to be a slave to the idea of a "clean slate" in this presason. Campbell has no more to prove than anyone else on the roster, and can only do so much before getting an entire game to play.

Honestly though, even if you judged him by just what you saw in the preseason, the results would be mixed, and you'd want to see more of him. By writing him off, you're showing some degree of non-objectivity.

No one has a clean slate in the nfl, even the rookies. If an undrafted rookie was having his type of performance (if it were against non-starters), it would be assumed that the rookie would be cut. However if it were a 1st round rookie, the chances would be lessened because of the benefit of the doubt given.

There are more expectations for Campbell to perform, even now because of the lack of confidence that the fo has shown. Everyone's past playing history, performance, and expectations all are taken into account just like everyone else is.

[jgalecpa]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

This is probably about right. After 12 games, you can probably evaluate Campbell's development as a player in it's entirety.

Still, context is important. If at that point, we're not in the playoff hunt, but the evidence suggest that Campbell has improved (i.e. we have the 26th best defense in the league), then you have to act accordingly in the offseason. This isn't the open and shut playoffs or bust case people would like it to be.

Absolutely. If he significantly improves his QB rating, dials in the long balls a bit better, and continues to protect the ball as he has done the last year and a half, than you are correct.

J-Dawg.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Bullshit. I've seen plenty of excellent individual plays from the guy.

You're coming off like a pissy ex-girlfriend. I've never seen so much whine in one place.

I have also seen a lot of great plays from the guy. But please try to avoid using harsh language and attacks.

[30gut]

Originally Posted by DBUCHANON101

Is it just me od do you guys feel that Zorn tried to run too much inside the redzone?
ran 3 in a row with starters. JC can move,why not try a rollout?
ok,time for practice.

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

Zorn stinks at calling plays IMO. It's the freakin pre season and he's running the damn ball which wasn't the problem last year. I'd be throwing it almost every down.

I think that Zorn is wasting the preseason.
He's admits that he hasn't been game planning:

"I guess a week ago, I felt like we were just running plays. It was like a practice, we didn't gameplan much; [this week] we gameplanned a little bit more. Our guys were much more intent on improving, because they could see what was going on on video. And they did, they showed much more enthusiasm for playing. They kind of understood some of the moments of the game, the fourth downs, the third downs"
Redskins Blog -- The Official Blog of the Washington Redskins

Heck he isn't even running plays that they rep'd in practice:

"It was close,” said Kelly. “The crazy thing, though, is that me and Jason never practiced that route all week long. The first time we ran it was in the game. We'll get it done,
though—we'll complete it next time."
http://www.theomfield.com/2009/08/re...-qb-jason.html

Meanwhile other teams are gameplanning and playing their starters for most of the 1st half.

JC hasn't even played enough to struggle.
I don't know what Zorn is doing, but i wish he was working on the offense.
The playcalling in the RZ was :confused:

I thought that we needed to work on the passing game especially the RZ.
But, Zorn chose not to call a fade route to Kelly or Thomas.
He didn't even call 1 RZ pass.
But, Zorn seemed to save his best playcalling for the 3rd team offense.

*Edit*- I'll be surprised if the passing game looks sharp against the Pats.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by warriorzpath

No one has a clean slate in the nfl, even the rookies. If an undrafted rookie was having his type of performance (if it were against non-starters), it would be assumed that the rookie would be cut. However if it were a 1st round rookie, the chances would be lessened because of the benefit of the doubt given.

There are more expectations for Campbell to perform, even now because of the lack of confidence that the fo has shown. Everyone's past playing history, performance, and expectations all are taken into account just like everyone else is.

I agree, but it's this realization that makes the posts about "having to perform" in the preseason a bit ridiculous. Everything we've seen to this point suggests adequacy (the problem is that we're expecting more than just adequacy), so why should 13 passes with varying degrees of execution matter? They shouldn't, over everything we've got.

So it looks really bad when you see an underthrown deep ball in the rain, and a bit of a high throw to Moss mixed in with some nice conversions on third down, and the first thing you think is "this guy is a complete bum". He looked better in a lot of ways against Pittsburghs defense than Charlie Batch did against our defense, which may not be a fair comparision, but it's an easy to normalize the weather conditions that everyone had to play in.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

I have also seen a lot of great plays from the guy. But please try to avoid using harsh language and attacks.

My bad. I apologize.

[53Fan]

In all fairness to Zorn, the Ravens didn't gameplan the first preseason game either.

[30gut]

Originally Posted by 53Fan

In all fairness, the Ravens didn't gameplan the first preseason game either.

Really?

I live in Baltimore and the talk from Ravens camp has been that Cameron planned to open up the offense.

And guess what?

In the preseason game against us the Ravens put Flacco in shotgun and spread the field and passed the ball 15 times 2 more then JC has thrown the entire preseason.

And the Ravens were blitzing on defense, which used to be no-no for preseason.

*The rules for preseason have changed and Zorn is behind the curve.

[GTripp0012]

There are a few starting quarterbacks in the NFL who haven't proved adequacy:

1. Kyle Orton
2. Matt Cassel
3. Shaun Hill
4. The post-Green Bay Brett Favre
5. Matthew Stafford
6. Luke McCown
7. Mark Sanchez
8. The post-Martz Marc Bulger
9. JaMarcus Russell
10. Derek Anderson/Brady Quinn
11. Trent Edwards
12. Vince Young
13. Joe Flacco

You could take any of these guys over Campbell, but it would be merely a personal preference. Not anything based on past performance.

[warriorzpath]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I agree, but it's this realization that makes the posts about "having to perform" in the preseason a bit ridiculous. Everything we've seen to this point suggests adequacy (the problem is that we're expecting more than just adequacy), so why should 13 passes with varying degrees of execution matter? They shouldn't, over everything we've got.

So it looks really bad when you see an underthrown deep ball in the rain, and a bit of a high throw to Moss mixed in with some nice conversions on third down, and the first thing you think is "this guy is a complete bum". He looked better in a lot of ways against Pittsburghs defense than Charlie Batch did against our defense, which may not be a fair comparision, but it's an easy to normalize the weather conditions that everyone had to play in.

That's the situation that campbell is in - he's under the microscope. He should know that coming into this season and also preseason. It's almost like a rookie that is trying to make the team. Every play, bad or good, is scrutinized.

But he can't control this anymore, except for his play this season. That's the only way to show what he can do. Personally, I don't see anything unfair about having this opportunity. We should all be so lucky.

[53Fan]

Originally Posted by 30gut

Really?

I live in Baltimore and the talk from Ravens camp has been that Cameron planned to open up the offense.

And guess what?

In the preseason game against us the Ravens put Flacco in shotgun and spread the field and passed the ball 15 times 2 more then JC has thrown the entire preseason.

And the Ravens were blitzing on defense, which used to be no-no for preseason.

*The rules for preseason have changed and Zorn is behind the curve.

Ravens-Redskins Preview: Conservative will be the Theme | Luke Jones’ Blog | WNST

[Dirtbag59]

Did Campbell have a good camp? I mean we're hearing a ton of praise about Orakpo and Mitchell so it kind of worries me that no one seems to be saying anything about JC.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by gibbsisgod

Maybe its just me but I thought he was making very good decisions with the football and getting it out of his hands quick. He wasn't waitng for someone to come open, he was anticipating it and being very quick in the pocket. If things broke down he used his legs and I think that is good. He hasn't taken a sack and hasn't turned the ball over. Again, not great but not worthless as you would make it sound.

It's not just you. I agree.