Start John Beck Madness Thread

[30gut]

Originally Posted by hooskins

If you have no problems with 3-1 why change? To me if you are content with where we are now why change what got us there?

Because the coaching staff is aiming for optimal performance now to avoid losses in the future?

I think its fair to say that if the QB made a few more plays in the Cowboys game we could have won?

Well what if Beck could provide those few more plays? (Mind you I'm not saying that I know he can, just what if)

[hooskins]

What if my parents didn't meet? What if the perfect amount of cosmic material was not present to facilitate the Big Bang?

You can go on and on with "what ifs" and you will never reach any logical conclusion. In the end you make the best decision with what you have got, try to be as proactive as you can but if you are successful there isn't a need for change.

[fanarchist]

Originally Posted by #56fanatic

Reading all this crap about changing QB's, you'd think we were 1-3. People are ridiculous, and Redskins fans just cant be happy. You all are pointing to the last quarter of the Dallas game, and the Rams game. Armstrong being out is not allowing us to stretch the field, which in turn isn't freeing up some of those middle routes we were use to seeing the first couple of games. that is one reason the passing game has taken a bit of a hit the last two games.

INT's - how many has he thrown 5?? How many of those are off recievers hands that should have been caught?? 3 or 4. ONly really bad one I can remember was the one vs the Rams. Two fumbles, one was at the end of the game where he was trying to make a play running outside the pocket and got hit from behind. That happes a TON in the NFL, to any QB and most QB;s that get caught from behind.

Its ridiculous to have these discussions. Two wins are related to Rex being able to make big plays and win the games. Giants and Cardinals. No one is talking about that. Everyone is bitching and moaning because of what Rex's reputation is and honestly its a bit overplayed. Rex has been playing pretty good when you get down to it. Taking what he is given, not forcing too many balls (as he has in the past), checking down and throwing balls away.

WE ARE 3-1 FOR F*CK SAKE. how bout we act like it

Earlier in this thread you said it was 2-3 ints that could not be attributed to Rex. Now it seems to be 3-4. Pretty soon Rex won't be held accountable for any of his miscues on the field.

No true Redskins fan is discouraged with a 3-1 start. Especially when you consider that a couple of those wins could have easily gone in the other direction. But just because we're 3-1 does not mean we should simply stand pat, rest on our laurels, and delude ourselves into believing that everything is coming up roses in the mystical land of burgundy and gold. Any team, regardless of record, is always looking to repair, or replace areas where cogs in the machine are poorly functioning. QB is one of those cogs.

As I said before, Grossman has yet to throw a completion for over 40 yds this season. That includes the first 2 games with AA present. Last season we were #1 in the NFL in passes over 50. If you're going to employ a run first attack, you should atleast be of the mindset that in pounding the rock, and pulling LBs and safeties into the box, your main objective in the passing game is to exploit the lack of coverage downfield. And if Rex were throwing ints in those circumstances where he's attempting to stretch the field vertically I don't think I'd be as harsh of a critic, because in all reality the worst that could happen is the DB runs the int back for a TD, and that is pretty rare once you've already effected the the amount of field, and distance he has to cover in order to find the endzone. In the pro catagory, your receiver catches the pass, which rapidly impacts the field position, and drastically improves your scoring opportunities. Or your receiver catches the pass, shakes his coverage, and scores. Or you draw a flag, holding, or pass interference. Either option extends the drive. Or you throw an incompletion and live to play another down.

I've already addressed, in previous posts in this thread and others, the deficiencies I see in Rex's game so I don't feel the need to rehash all of that. I'll just say that everything you've stated has already been covered from a diametric view.

We're not classless fans who are never satisfied. We're a collective group of realists who have the foresight to recognize when something is amiss. You can't dismiss critical thought from a progessive discussion just because you don't like a schism.

[fanarchist]

Originally Posted by hooskins

What if my parents didn't meet? What if the perfect amount of cosmic material was not present to facilitate the Big Bang?

You can go on and on with "what ifs" and you will never reach any logical conclusion. In the end you make the best decision with what you have got, try to be as proactive as you can but if you are successful there isn't a need for change.

This is not one of those hypothetical past "what if" scenarios that the coaching staff has no way of proving or impacting. The "what if", in this case, can easily be remedied if you simply play the guy.

[hooskins]

Sure, but like I said no need to make a change if you achieving your goal of winnings games.

You don't just do something because you are unsure of the possible outcome. What if I went up to my boss and demanded a raise or else? Well I am not going to do that right now because I am getting a fair-market value and secure position in a tough economic climate. There would be no need for me to take such a "what if" action. Same applies in this situation. You can "what if" all you want, but in the end, change is not needed nor wanted by the owner, coach or players (the only ones that matter in this decision if I may add). All we do is win win win!

[fanarchist]

Originally Posted by hooskins

Sure, but like I said no need to make a change if you achieving your goal of winnings games.

You don't just do something because you are unsure of the possible outcome. What if I went up to my boss and demanded a raise or else? Well I am not going to do that right now because I am getting a fair-market value and secure position in a tough economic climate. There would be no need for me to take such a "what if" action. Same applies in this situation. You can "what if" all you want, but in the end, change is not needed nor wanted by the owner, coach or players (the only ones that matter in this decision if I may add). All we do is win win win!

If you had been on the job long enough that you'd facilitated an atmosphere where you were clearly an irreplaceable commodity there would be no reason why you shouldn't have the gusto to demand a raise. Rex has not quelled the pre-existing doubts with his perfomances, and has not proven to be that irreplaceable leader who is a force that will drive this franchise forward. Therefore he is expendable, and the next guy in line should be afforded the same opportunity to prove or disprove his merit. Someone who does just enough to get by is often overlooked for potentially greener pastures. But if your hypothetical solution is to manacle yourself to an underwhelming player out of fear that the ramifications for change would be to risky, it seems stagnant to me, but it's your perspective.

Isn't it always the easiest out to say, the coaches make the decisions, and abandon any independent thought outside of that? They are human, and they too are capable of flaw.

[44ever]

Originally Posted by hooskins

What if my parents didn't meet? What if the perfect amount of cosmic material was not present to facilitate the Big Bang?

You can go on and on with "what ifs" and you will never reach any logical conclusion. In the end you make the best decision with what you have got, try to be as proactive as you can but if you are successful there isn't a need for change.

Then why run Torain instead of Helu? What if we didnt change it up and give Torain a shot? It was only last week everyone in here was on the Hightower #1RB Helu #2 RB bandwagon, now it seems that since Torain has reasserted himself, most want Torain against the Eagles. This was before word of Hightowers injury was released. Sometimes you have to try something new even when you are winning.

Shanahan said it himself "you cant go off statistics alone" well W-L is a statistic in itself. Its the way your winning and losing that counts.

Grossman is not winning 3-1 the way say Tom Brady is winning 3-1

Not saying Grossman has to be Brady (or ever will be) but just illustrating
the difference in 3-1

I believe with Beck we would be 4-0 right now and have a better chance of going 4-1 game 5. Grossman better put his fast shoes on because the Eagles will be coming at him every play. I also believe game 5 will be the deciding factor in Rex's future as starting QB for the Skins. I guess we wait and see.

With all that said, I do hope Rex shows up. HTTR!

[wilsowilso]

Originally Posted by 44ever

I believe with Beck we would be 4-0 right now

More like 1-3 maybe 2-2. Possibly 0-4.

Bye the way I have been watching the replay of that colossal Santana Moss screw up during the Rams game.

That was a horrible mistake! Worst play of the game by a Redskin. BY FAR!

He basically turned a huge gain and probable TD and massive momentum in the game 180 degrees by dropping an EASY EASY perfectly placed pass. Not only does he drop it he actually deflects it to about the worst freaking place you can send a ball off your hands in the middle of the field.

Dear Santana. That was total bullshit. TERRIBLE.

[irish]

Originally Posted by fanarchist

If you had been on the job long enough that you'd facilitated an atmosphere where you were clearly an irreplaceable commodity there would be no reason why you shouldn't have the gusto to demand a raise. Rex has not quelled the pre-existing doubts with his perfomances, and has not proven to be that irreplaceable leader who is a force that will drive this franchise forward. Therefore he is expendable, and the next guy in line should be afforded the same opportunity to prove or disprove his merit. Someone who does just enough to get by is often overlooked for potentially greener pastures. But if your hypothetical solution is to manacle yourself to an underwhelming player out of fear that the ramifications for change would be to risky, it seems stagnant to me, but it's your perspective.

Isn't it always the easiest out to say, the coaches make the decisions, and abandon any independent thought outside of that? They are human, and they too are capable of flaw.

If there's one thing I've learned its that nobody, no matter who they are or what they do, is irreplaceable.

[MTK]

I wish it were possible to give a thread a negative rating.

[mooby]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

I wish it were possible to give a thread a negative rating.

If anyone can make it happen, it's you! We believe in you!

[30gut]

Originally Posted by hooskins

What if my parents didn't meet? What if the perfect amount of cosmic material was not present to facilitate the Big Bang?

You can go on and on with "what ifs" and you will never reach any logical conclusion. In the end you make the best decision with what you have got, try to be as proactive as you can but if you are successful there isn't a need for change.

Hey dude I was addressing your question.
It made more sense to answer in question form because I can only speculate.
Would it make you feel better if my answers to your questions were in the declarative:

Originally Posted by hooskins

If you have no problems with 3-1 why change? To me if you are content with where we are now why change what got us there?

The coaching staff is aiming for optimal performance now to avoid losses in the future. In short they're not content to merely win they're looking for optimal execution or as Mike Shanahan said they're looking for perfection.

Rex should have made more plays in the Cowboys game and that cost us the victory.

Beck can likely provide the plays missing from the Rex in the Cowboys game.

See now you're parents did meet.

-Cheers

[Chief X_Phackter]

I'm pretty sure Shanahan has already stated that he’ll measure Rex Grossman by wins and losses and he’s 3-1 this season.

I would agree that Rex needs to pick up his play though, especially in the second half of games, or we will lose games similar to those that we have managed to win.

Then, of course, his job will be in jeopardy...but not right now.

Redskins notes: Buchanon returns; Paul's blocking | John Keim | NFL | Washington Examiner

[fanarchist]

Originally Posted by irish

If there's one thing I've learned its that nobody, no matter who they are or what they do, is irreplaceable.

At this point in their careers Tom Brady, Aaron Rogers, London Fletcher, Patrick Willis, Drew Brees, Phillip Rivers, Andre Johnson, Calvin Johnson, and it didn't seem too easy to replace the production of Peyton Manning either. There are some people whos overall contribution to their team can not be replaced.

[irish]

Originally Posted by fanarchist

At this point in their careers Tom Brady, Aaron Rogers, London Fletcher, Patrick Willis, Drew Brees, Phillip Rivers, Andre Johnson, Calvin Johnson, and it didn't seem too easy to replace the production of Peyton Manning either. There are some people whos overall contribution to their team can not be replaced.

If memory serves, when Brady was hurt Cassel came in and the team went something like 15-1. Brett Favre left and Rogers came in. When properly planned for the replacement is invisable, the Colts just didnt plan well. Time and the team goes on.