Redskins Lions postgame

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

Unfortunately those are probably the two poorest plays of the games yesterday and hold the most scrutiny. Part of RG3 game which has grown this year is the check down, man he really knows how to pad the stat line.

Less RG3, more Alfmo and the running game. Not winning too many game throwing 50 times.

Sure, but you've got to pick your battles when criticizing an 0-3 team.

In my utopian world, my quarterback doesn't ever turn the ball over, and if he does, my depth chart is four deep with equally awesome players who won't turn the ball over, and every choice my coach makes always works.

In reality, even great players make bad decisions sometimes. Griffin has been guilty of the careless play this year. But I thought other than that, the team looked mostly fine yesterday. When you went into the year looking at ways they might lose at home to the Lions, the game that actually happened yesterday was pretty high up there on that list. In isolation, nothing at all to be concerned about.

But we're not looking at yesterday in isolation when we criticize Griffin's turnovers. We're looking at his game yesterday in the context as coming off the worst two game stretch of a Shanahan era that has been very underwhelming in it's totality. And thus the expectation falls on Griffin to not just be great, but to be as great as we need him to be, given declining teammates.

And that's how two careless turnovers go from "young players gonna young" to "totally unacceptable"

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Sure, but you've got to pick your battles when criticizing an 0-3 team.

In my utopian world, my quarterback doesn't ever turn the ball over, and if he does, my depth chart is four deep with equally awesome players who won't turn the ball over, and every choice my coach makes always works.

In reality, even great players make bad decisions sometimes. Griffin has been guilty of the careless play this year. But I thought other than that, the team looked mostly fine yesterday. When you went into the year looking at ways they might lose at home to the Lions, the game that actually happened yesterday was pretty high up there on that list. In isolation, nothing at all to be concerned about.

But we're not looking at yesterday in isolation when we criticize Griffin's turnovers. We're looking at his game yesterday in the context as coming off the worst two game stretch of a Shanahan era that has been very underwhelming in it's totality. And thus the expectation falls on Griffin to not just be great, but to be as great as we need him to be, given declining teammates.

And that's how two careless turnovers go from "young players gonna young" to "totally unacceptable"

U did see the 2 other shoulda been picked throws and fumbled snaps/scramble plays?

RG3 needs to take care of the ball much better.

PS First, that ball was thrown perfect to Robinson.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

U did see the 2 other shoulda been picked throws and fumbled snaps/scramble plays?

RG3 needs to take care of the ball much better.

PS First, that ball was thrown perfect to Robinson.

The snap that hit Logan Paulsen is a better example of the kind of crap that Griffin is dealing with than the fact that he had to save the play.

Also: terrible game management at the end of the game, a Shanahan staple. Could have kicked a FG to cut the lead to seven with 2:20 to play, with plenty of time to get the ball back. Instead, ran about six more plays, got down to the five yard line with 1:40 to go, and THEN kicked anyway when the Redskins absolutely needed a TD. Just so stupid. Only thing missing from that sequence was a wasted timeout because we couldn't get a play in in-time.

Pickin our battles.

[calia]

While 0-3 is a very bitter pill to swallow and there have been precious few things to cheer about the last three weeks, in reviewing these posts and the myriad suggestions ranging from fire Mike/Kyle/Haz/all coaches to cut Fred/Rak/Fletch, etc., it strikes me that even as uninspired as the team has looked, we've collectively got to chill (and I include myself in that category).

This season was going to involve some risk -- especially early -- for the simple reasons that (a) we were facing RGIII recovery and related transition back to full speed, (b) we were facing a complete unknown in the Eagles team in week 1, (c) we were facing a very good Packer team (at least, offensively), in Green Bay where it is very hard to win, and (d) we are starting two rookies in the secondary who, let's face it, still need time to develop from NFL prospects to NFL players. We were probably destined to have a slow start -- 2-2 wouldn't have been a bad start and we could finish just one game behind that at the bye. Also, even though we're 0-3, the Giants are too, the Eagles are 1-2, and Dallas is a very beatable 2-1; we have 5 division games left. That Green Bay, Atlanta, and SF are 1-2 -- all good teams -- should signal that even good teams are going to take their share of lumps. Heck, SF got schooled at home by the Colts -- a game that you know Harbaugh wanted badly to win. Winning in the NFL is just plain hard.

So back to our team, if the team can get on track with a win in Oakland (which would have looked like a lock to me, and I think we will still do), and get some personnel back (Jackson, Jenkins -- solid players for us on D last year where we need the most help) and some injuries behind them (Davis, Rambo) during the bye, we ought to be in a position to at least compete.

BUT, that also will depend on, in my view, three important things: (1) the team needs to get its fire back -- it is amazing to me how they're lost that "us against the wrold" mentality from the end of last season, as though winning the NFC East and the other teams in the division looking weak would translate into guaranteed success this year -- we need some player leadership here, and soon -- no one plays with attitude or a mean streak -- want to know what I mean? watch Richard Sherman -- I hate the guy, but he brings it every play and wants to dominate you and rub it in; (2) they have got to make better adjustments on both sides of the ball (and not wait until halftime to do it) -- the coaching needs to improve on both sides of the ball; and (3) fundamentals, fundamentals -- hang on to the football, wrap folks up when tackling, avoid the stupid penalties, and otherwise play like you're up against a superior adversary every week and thus need to have your A game (because, at least so far, that's actually been the case).

I can still see us salvaging the season -- maybe the playoffs are out of reach, and maybe they're not. But I would settle for a one week at a time approach where we focus like a laser on just getting a win.

[artmonkforhallofamein07]

Ha, I just thought of something. JW did help shore up the safety position we only gave up 386 passing yards to Stafford instead of the 480+ we gave up to Rodgers. Either that or GB is just better by 100 yards....

[12thMan]

I'm just insanely frustrated with how thins have turned out. I don't know.

I tend to agree that Robert is getting better with each game. We just have to patient. This is only his third game this year. Didn't get much work in training camp or preseason. I really think things will click with this team. As bad as the defense has been, I can't imagine where'd we be without Kerrigan and some of the plays by D.Hall. We'll find our way.

A change in defensive coaching might be in order. I don't know if Rah is the answer, but Has' time may have run it's course here in D.C. Bottom line, until Robert starts to turn it up a notch the team will probably continue to play spotty instead of dominating football.

[skinsfaninok]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

I'm just insanely frustrated with how thins have turned out. I don't know.

I tend to agree that Robert is getting better with each game. We just have to patient. This is only his third game this year. Didn't get much work in training camp or preseason. I really think things will click with this team. As bad as the defense has been, I can't imagine where'd we be without Kerrigan and some of the plays by D.Hall. We'll find our way.

A change in defensive coaching might be in order. I don't know if Rah is the answer, but Has' time may have run it's course here in D.C. Bottom line, until Robert starts to turn it up a notch the team will probably continue to play spotty instead of dominating football.

I mean how is it that the redskins get worse after a 10 win season?? It just sucks man, I was really looking forward to this year and it really seems like it's already over

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

I mean how is it that the redskins get worse after a 10 win season?? It just sucks man, I was really looking forward to this year and it really seems like it's already over

One important thing to keep in mind: teams that have great continuity from year to year don't have great continuity because they fear changing their starters, they just have a great player development system that promotes players from within right when they are entering their prime.

The Redskins don't have this. They didn't promote even one starter from within between 2012 and 2013. So what they have is the second oldest team in football (after the one that just beat us) thats just hanging on to declining vets because they feel they are limited to replace them only through current year draft picks and free agents (cap space).

So while it was a pretty impressive accomplishment that they were able to keep last year's team together, it also meant they're really struggling to improve the roster on last year.

[mredskins]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

One important thing to keep in mind: teams that have great continuity from year to year don't have great continuity because they fear changing their starters, they just have a great player development system that promotes players from within right when they are entering their prime.

The Redskins don't have this. They didn't promote even one starter from within between 2012 and 2013. So what they have is the second oldest team in football (after the one that just beat us) thats just hanging on to declining vets because they feel they are limited to replace them only through current year draft picks and free agents (cap space).

So while it was a pretty impressive accomplishment that they were able to keep last year's team together, it also meant they're really struggling to improve the roster on last year.

I think alot of that ties back to the cap penalty.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

One important thing to keep in mind: teams that have great continuity from year to year don't have great continuity because they fear changing their starters, they just have a great player development system that promotes players from within right when they are entering their prime.

The Redskins don't have this. They didn't promote even one starter from within between 2012 and 2013. So what they have is the second oldest team in football (after the one that just beat us) thats just hanging on to declining vets because they feel they are limited to replace them only through current year draft picks and free agents (cap space).

So while it was a pretty impressive accomplishment that they were able to keep last year's team together, it also meant they're really struggling to improve the roster on last year.

I think that goes back to the cap hit we took the past two years.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by firstdown

I think that goes back to the cap hit we took the past two years.

Cap penalty or no cap penalty, a football team can choose it's veterans. You're stuck with the young talent you bring in because of rookie contracts and the waivers system, but the veteran market is different. You can always save money by cutting.

If the players in their first three seasons were struggling, and that's why the team was 0-3, you might suggest that the cap penalty was limiting the team from getting enough talent to compete. But the young players who were drafted have been thrust into the lineup almost immediately and have more than held their own.

If you make a list of guys who aren't helping, you get Fletcher and Meriweather near the top, but also Fred Davis, Will Montgomery, Tyler Polumbus, Stephen Bowen, Adam Carriker, and probably Josh Morgan (though I'm feeling more charatable yesterday after AlfMo's TD run). There's just a ton of cap dollars tied up there that have nothing to do with the penalty.

[artmonkforhallofamein07]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

I mean how is it that the redskins get worse after a 10 win season?? It just sucks man, I was really looking forward to this year and it really seems like it's already over

I get the offensive problems with griff coming back from injury, but the defense truly is epically bad. Most of these guys have been in this system 3 years and are starting thier fourth.

Terrible mess.

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by artmonkforhallofamein07

I get the offensive problems with griff coming back from injury, but the defense truly is epically bad. Most of these guys have been in this system 3 years and are starting thier fourth.

Terrible mess.

To me, the defense being a mess, is that really honest to god a surprise? Did we watch last year?

The surprise is the offense. Kyle is doing a terrible job, and like Garcon said today, RG3 is not healthy. Thats the main reason we need to run the ball.

[artmonkforhallofamein07]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

To me, the defense being a mess, is that really honest to god a surprise? Did we watch last year?

The surprise is the offense. Kyle is doing a terrible job, and like Garcon said today, RG3 is not healthy. Thats the main reason we need to run the ball.

When did garçon say he wasn't healthy? I thought that was last week, and I disagree with the guy he looked alot healthier yesterday than he did in weeks 16,17, and wildcard game last year.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

I'm just insanely frustrated with how thins have turned out. I don't know.

I tend to agree that Robert is getting better with each game. We just have to patient. This is only his third game this year. Didn't get much work in training camp or preseason. I really think things will click with this team. As bad as the defense has been, I can't imagine where'd we be without Kerrigan and some of the plays by D.Hall. We'll find our way.

A change in defensive coaching might be in order. I don't know if Rah is the answer, but Has' time may have run it's course here in D.C. Bottom line, until Robert starts to turn it up a notch the team will probably continue to play spotty instead of dominating football.

0-3, most likely.