Belichick...Best of All Time????

[gibbsisgod]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

But if you're going to knock Belichik down a peg for his horrible stint with the Browns, then don't you have to knock Gibbs down a peg for his 21-27 record with the 'Skins in his recent tenure?

1) Lombardi
2) Schula
3) Gibbs
4) Landry
5) Noll
6) Walsh
7) Belichik
8) Parcells
9) Brown
10) Rich Kotite

!!!!!!!

[Redskin Rich]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

But if you're going to knock Belichik down a peg for his horrible stint with the Browns, then don't you have to knock Gibbs down a peg for his 21-27 record with the 'Skins in his recent tenure? I can't do that though, you accomplished what you accomplished, a sub-par stint in another time or place doesn't change that.

1) Lombardi
2) Schula
3) Gibbs
4) Landry
5) Noll
6) Walsh
7) Belichik
8) Parcells
9) Brown
10) Rich Kotite

You should rethink the comment on Bill B and his time with the Browns.... think about it... one year, they are in the playoffs and heading in the right direction. The next season, while it is going on, the owner announces the team that is identified by that city is moving... and then everything went to SH_T.

and come on... Rich Kotite????? be real

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by Redskin Rich

and come on... Rich Kotite????? be real

You should get 3 months for having no sense of humor.

Joke
–noun 1.something said or done to provoke laughter or cause amusement, as a witticism, a short and amusing anecdote, or a prankish act: He tells very funny jokes. She played a joke on him.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by Redskin Rich

You should rethink the comment on Bill B and his time with the Browns.... think about it... one year, they are in the playoffs and heading in the right direction. The next season, while it is going on, the owner announces the team that is identified by that city is moving... and then everything went to SH_T.

Also, you clearly are missing my point on his Browns' tenure. That stint does nothing to take away from his accomplishments in New England.

[Redskin Rich]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Also, you clearly are missing my point on his Browns' tenure. That stint does nothing to take away from his accomplishments in New England.

Schneed... according to my wife, that would not be the first time I have done this...

But my point was if the Brown's had not moved.... he had things going in the right direction.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by Redskin Rich

Schneed... according to my wife, that would not be the first time I have done this...

But my point was if the Brown's had not moved.... he had things going in the right direction.

I think you and I are on the same page, I think Belichick is the friggin man. I just wouldn't rank him top 5.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Redskin Rich

But my point was if the Brown's had not moved.... he had things going in the right direction.

IMO, I don't think an HC has the ability to get a team going in the right direction. The greatest good for a coach is to give his team the greatest and most consistent advantage year in and year out. You can do this motivationally, or you can do this strategically.

But ultimately, the expected responsibility of the coach is to make sure he is playing the best 11 players for any given situation. And I don't know how someone can make a top ten list and leave Andy Reid off it. All-time.

I'm torn on Gibbs. I mean he created one of the most innovative and effective systems ever and clearly used his talent correctly. But as the generations passed and more and more of the population became interested in football coaching, it's clear that the old horses like Gibbs and Parcells, while still incredibly effective coaches, were not so elite anymore. Since anyone can learn how to coach, the consistent winners are the teams who have better football players, a skill that cannot easily be taught.

In the 60s and 70s, a dominant coach could give a big edge to his team. Nowadays, the guy on the other sideline knows all the tricks and trades that you do. You have little advantage over the other 31 coaches, and due to this, the effect of coaching on the outcome of games is nearly nullified.

Anyway, here's my list:

1. Vince Lombardi
2. Bill Walsh
3. Don Shula
4. Andy Reid
5. John Madden
6. Bill Belicheik
7. Bill Cowher
8. Paul Brown
9. Chuck Noll
10. Dick Vermeil

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

But if you're going to knock Belichik down a peg for his horrible stint with the Browns, then don't you have to knock Gibbs down a peg for his 21-27 record with the 'Skins in his recent tenure? I can't do that though, you accomplished what you accomplished, a sub-par stint in another time or place doesn't change that.

1) Lombardi
2) Schula
3) Gibbs
4) Landry
5) Noll
6) Walsh
7) Belichik
8) Parcells
9) Brown
10) Rich Kotite

Kotite?!

LOL I missed that the first time around.

[skinsfan69]

It's tough to say because of the different era's. But you could argue that he is one of the best 5 all time. It's not like he doesn't belong in the conversation.

Could Vince L. coach in today's era? I would say not. Those old timers could not hack it in today's football. They couldn't handle the players of today. But he was the best of his era.

But no question BB is the best right now. His teams are so well prepeared for any situation.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

Could Vince L. coach in today's era? I would say not. Those old timers could not hack it in today's football. They couldn't handle the players of today. But he was the best of his era.

One of the attributes of a great coach is to adapt and win, no matter the situation. If the all-time great coaches were coaching today, they would adapt to the players of today....or more likely make the players of today adapt to them. Players who win multiple championships understand they must put team before self in order to win. Generally these types of players do not have many off-field issues or demand unreasonable contracts. Great coaches attract and pursue these types of players, hence they win.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Here is my top five:

1) Lombardi - 96-34 / 9-1 Playoffs / 7 championships in 11 years.
2) Halas - 318-148-32 / 6-4 Playoffs / 6 championships
3) Shula - 328-156-6 / 3 championships
4) Gibbs - 146-86 / 17-6 Playoffs / 3 championships (with 3 different QBs). 1982 - 1991 9 of 10 seasons with 10 or more wins. (1982 strike season 8-1). If Gibbs can win 1 or 2 more rings before retiring (without any more 5-11 seasons) he will vault to # 2.
5) Landry - 250-162 / 20-16 Playoffs / 2 Championships. 1968 - 1983 13 of 15 seasons with 10 or more wins.

Belichick is in the top 10 discussion, not top five.

[skinsfan69]

I think Walsh was a better coach than Shula and Knoll. Walsh was a true inovator of NFL offense. How many teams in the NFL use the West Coast system, or some type of version of it. One of the best tactitions sp? of all time.

[diehardskin2982]

NO he is not. ESPN are known New England/ Boston homers.... for the most part except for you Smoot.

[celts32]

Belichak best of all time...So Cleveland never happened?

They have actually been ahead of the curve as an organization working the current rules of the NFL...it's not even close to all Belichek. I am more inclined to put Scott Pioli in the top 5 front office guys of all time.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by celts32

Belichak best of all time...So Cleveland never happened?

They have actually been ahead of the curve as an organization working the current rules of the NFL...it's not even close to all Belichek. I am more inclined to put Scott Pioli in the top 5 front office guys of all time.

Well you could use the same agument w/ Gibbs 1 and Gibbs 2.

Gibbs 1 had a GM and Gibbs 2 does not.