NFL Network: 32 in 32 Redskins

[skins89moss]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

I agree with 17 we are an average at best team unless JC becomes McNabb overnight... 9 wins should be a realistic goal this year. Phi, Ny and Dal are all better right now.

Well 17 JC is our best Qb on the roster at this time so we better be pulling for him to succeed. I hope you dont think we would be better with Colt starting?

[tryfuhl]

Man I'm getting antsy and sick of the speculation. Without a full crumble like last year we can definitely be a formidable opponent. We never know what team is just going to click into it, which teams will crumble, who might get injured.

[44Deezel]

I think it's as much on Zorn as it is on Campbell. For a guy who was originally hired to be the Offense Coordinator to average 16 points a game is cause for concern. He's proven nothing. Everyone points to the 6-2 start, but that could have been a fluke, and the 2-6 finish could be what we get with Zorn's offense moving forward. Every team experiences injuries, and we had the same WRs all season, so no excuses.

The D should be all-world. This season will answer 2 questions: Is Zorn a good coach and is Campbell a bonafied NFL starter?

[53Fan]

Originally Posted by 44Deezel

I think it's as much on Zorn as it is on Campbell. For a guy who was originally hired to be the Offense Coordinator to average 16 points a game is cause for concern. He's proven nothing. Everyone points to the 6-2 start, but that could have been a fluke, and the 2-6 finish could be what we get with Zorn's offense moving forward. Every team experiences injuries, and we had the same WRs all season, so no excuses.

The D should be all-world. This season will answer 2 questions: Is Zorn a good coach and is Campbell a bonafied NFL starter?

Could be. Or maybe Kendall fumbling the ball and losing to the Rams was a fluke. Maybe not calling a TD or blowing the play dead when Sellers was sticking the ball over the goal line that resulted in a fumble and a loss against Cincinnati was a fluke. Without those 2 losses on freak plays, we'd have made the playoffs.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by 53Fan

Could be. Or maybe Kendall fumbling the ball and losing to the Rams was a fluke. Maybe not calling a TD or blowing the play dead when Sellers was sticking the ball over the goal line that resulted in a fumble and a loss against Cincinnati was a fluke. Without those 2 losses on freak plays, we'd have made the playoffs.

I agree, I'm more apt to call the 2-6 slide the fluke. Injuries piled up and took their toll and as you point out some odd plays went against us.

[an23dy]

Originally Posted by 44Deezel

I think it's as much on Zorn as it is on Campbell. For a guy who was originally hired to be the Offense Coordinator to average 16 points a game is cause for concern. He's proven nothing. Everyone points to the 6-2 start, but that could have been a fluke, and the 2-6 finish could be what we get with Zorn's offense moving forward. Every team experiences injuries, and we had the same WRs all season, so no excuses.

The D should be all-world. This season will answer 2 questions: Is Zorn a good coach and is Campbell a bonafied NFL starter?

I am very worried about Zorn. Maybe since he had limited time last year is why everything looked the way it did, but it seemed like we had a very limited playbook and when we played tougher defenses at the end of the season it seemed like they figured it out. I mean when I think of Zorn I think Campbell hike, fake pass, hand-off to Portis working the first few games and then never working again. I wish I saw another play off that, like a fake pass, play action. I remember a lot of bubble screens to Moss and HB screens to Portis and them being much less effective after the first few games. The thing I'm most worried about next season is not Haynesworth or Campbell or any player it's Zorn. I really don't know about him and whether he can make the offense work. I want him to be the guy, but I have no clue if he will be.

[44Deezel]

Originally Posted by an23dy

I am very worried about Zorn. Maybe since he had limited time last year is why everything looked the way it did, but it seemed like we had a very limited playbook and when we played tougher defenses at the end of the season it seemed like they figured it out. I mean when I think of Zorn I think Campbell hike, fake pass, hand-off to Portis working the first few games and then never working again. I wish I saw another play off that, like a fake pass, play action. I remember a lot of bubble screens to Moss and HB screens to Portis and them being much less effective after the first few games. The thing I'm most worried about next season is not Haynesworth or Campbell or any player it's Zorn. I really don't know about him and whether he can make the offense work. I want him to be the guy, but I have no clue if he will be.

We had the same talent the year before, so the excuses about personnel don't fly with me. The telling game for me was the last game of the season against San Fran. With absolutely nothing on the line and playing against a very mediocre defense, the offensive stats were pathetic. I get that our O line was dinged up, but we weren't playing the Steelers Or Ravens. I believe Campbell had 156 yards passing? I would rather have seen him force passes into to coverage and throw 5 INTS than see him throw for 156 yards.

I just hope the 2-6 finish wasn't because Zorn got figured out. I like Zorn, but it's not unreasonable to think he might just be a bad head coach. After all, it ain't the easiest job in the world, and even Gibbs struggled in his second stint.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by an23dy

I am very worried about Zorn. Maybe since he had limited time last year is why everything looked the way it did, but it seemed like we had a very limited playbook and when we played tougher defenses at the end of the season it seemed like they figured it out. I mean when I think of Zorn I think Campbell hike, fake pass, hand-off to Portis working the first few games and then never working again. I wish I saw another play off that, like a fake pass, play action. I remember a lot of bubble screens to Moss and HB screens to Portis and them being much less effective after the first few games. The thing I'm most worried about next season is not Haynesworth or Campbell or any player it's Zorn. I really don't know about him and whether he can make the offense work. I want him to be the guy, but I have no clue if he will be.

Yup. In an article on another thread here JC claims that last year we had only about 50 passing plays because everyone was learning a new system. JC says that we now have about 130 pass plays.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by 44Deezel

I think it's as much on Zorn as it is on Campbell. For a guy who was originally hired to be the Offense Coordinator to average 16 points a game is cause for concern. He's proven nothing. Everyone points to the 6-2 start, but that could have been a fluke, and the 2-6 finish could be what we get with Zorn's offense moving forward. Every team experiences injuries, and we had the same WRs all season, so no excuses.

What you say is potentially true, but you're also serving the number one media dichotomy in the process: the one which suggests that the team went from good to bad in the week between the Lions and Steelers games.

No one in the world would have dared called the 4-1 start a fluke. The Redskins beat up on one quality opponent after another for four straight weeks, until they were just a half game behind the Giants for the NFC East lead. That was simply us being a better team than the competition, which included the two teams who played in the NFC Championship scatted amongst the Cowboys and the Saints.

Of course, that team would have totally crushed the Rams, Browns and Lions if it was more than a short-lived mirage. Those games wouldn't have been remotely close. And despite a 2-1 record that probably should have been 3-0, we knew about the time that we beat the Lions that we weren't as good as the 4-1 start.

At the time we were 6-2, but we had been for three weeks like the team who would play in the next 5 games. There wasn't a special date where 40 players decided to wake up and mail it in. Nothing changed. We added D-Hall. That's it. Samuels was still hurting, Jansen/Rabach/and Thomas were already struggling, Moss had totally disappeared (save a token 150 yard performance vs Detroit), Portis was only producing against the worst run defenses in the league. Then the competition got better and we went 1-4. Well duh, we weren't a better team than anyone we lost to.

Between Weeks 6 and 14, we went 3-5, and probably should have gone 4-4 with any justice. But that's who we were for the vast majority of the season: an .800 team with everyone healthy, and a .500 team after the bumps and bruises of an NFL season. We probably deserved to be a 7-6 team, plus or minus a game.

And the last three weeks, you weren't watching the team you were the rest of the year. You were watching some backups play some other backups, with a shameful performance from Donovan McNabb thrown in between. It's hard to believe we'll reach that point again in the next ten years, because most of those starters probably shouldn't have been in the league, for various reasons.

Again, there was no magical point at which the team forgot how to play football. The competition after the bye was simply harder.

So when this team is 9-4 in Week 15 this year, you'll probably be watching much of the same sort of offensive and defensive failures of the 2008 team. But the successes will be far more numerous and far less fleeting.

[KLHJ2]

Originally Posted by 44Deezel

I think it's as much on Zorn as it is on Campbell. For a guy who was originally hired to be the Offense Coordinator to average 16 points a game is cause for concern. He's proven nothing. Everyone points to the 6-2 start, but that could have been a fluke, and the 2-6 finish could be what we get with Zorn's offense moving forward. Every team experiences injuries, and we had the same WRs all season, so no excuses.

The D should be all-world. This season will answer 2 questions: Is Zorn a good coach and is Campbell a bonafied NFL starter?

I laugh everytime I hear that word. It reminds me of the movie "O' Brother Where Art Thou?" I want to know where one goes to get bonafied. Do you think that it will look good on my resume? Will it help my chances of success in today's civilization?

[SBXVII]

Originally Posted by Angry

I laugh everytime I hear that word. It reminds me of the movie "O' Brother Where Art Thou?" I want to know where one goes to get bonafied. Do you think that it will look good on my resume? Will it help my chances of success in today's civilization?

You may already be one and don't know it. Your could be a "bonafied" pessimistic person. :O

[freddyg12]

That last game v. SF might be foreshadowing; JC led the team down to a game tying td, but the defense couldn't hold SF.

I'm not penciling in this defense to carry the team as it has in the past. I think they'll have big games, but I also think the 4th overall ranking was a bit misleading by the end of the year. They're not a dominant unit & a couple injuries can derail them quite a bit. I know AH is obviously a big addition, but I think the expectations of the pass rush are a bit optimistic by many here. Orakpo is still a rook, expect a rookie like season not 10+ sacks.

I think the O will improve but not be able to score td's against the tougher defenses. I think JC is gonna 'fight his guts out' & really step up as a leader, but I don't know that the pieces are in place for this unit to be above avg. Not knowing what we have at RT yet is a big part of that.

Overall, 17 is very fair & objective at this point. This team has a lot to prove.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by freddyg12

That last game v. SF might be foreshadowing; JC led the team down to a game tying td, but the defense couldn't hold SF.

I'm not penciling in this defense to carry the team as it has in the past. I think they'll have big games, but I also think the 4th overall ranking was a bit misleading by the end of the year. They're not a dominant unit & a couple injuries can derail them quite a bit. I know AH is obviously a big addition, but I think the expectations of the pass rush are a bit optimistic by many here. Orakpo is still a rook, expect a rookie like season not 10+ sacks.

I'm fully expecting the defense to carry it's weight even more than it has in prior years. Haynesworth will tie up multiple blockers which will only help everyone else along the d-line in getting after the QB. And he's not too shabby in getting after the QB himself. I think his impact will be huge.

Rookie or not, Orakpo has the ability to make an immediate impact in the pass rush.

With an improved pass rush it should help take pressure off the secondary and it should also lead to more turnovers.

A defense that was already solid should be more of an impact D this year.

[freddyg12]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

I'm fully expecting the defense to carry it's weight even more than it has in prior years. Haynesworth will tie up multiple blockers which will only help everyone else along the d-line in getting after the QB. And he's not too shabby in getting after the QB himself. I think his impact will be huge.

Rookie or not, Orakpo has the ability to make an immediate impact in the pass rush.

With an improved pass rush it should help take pressure off the secondary and it should also lead to more turnovers.

A defense that was already solid should be more of an impact D this year.

Hope you're right but at the end of last season I saw a defense that probably was overachieving. AH should be huge & should impact the pass rush, but to what degree? Will they get 5, 10 more sacks? 20% more hurries? The pass rush might improve but I don't look for AH to make an extreme difference in that regard. Somebody has to emerge as a legit pass rusher on the edge.

Both end spots are still questionable w/Rak being a rookie & AC not having a great year pass rushing in 08 (he has improved v. the run). LB still remains a concern too, though I give them credit for addressing it in the offseason.

[53Fan]

I don't think Zorn could install as much of the offense as he would have liked last year. Everyone was learning a new system including the coaches. He made mistakes which is to be expected for a rookie HC, but I expect the offense to expand this year and run smoother.