Arizona State QB Brock Osweiler declares for NFL Draft

[GMScud]

Definitely interesting. He's huge and really athletic with a big arm, and like Tripp pointed out, still very young. It will be interesting to see how his pre-draft workouts play out. He was off just about everyone's radar for this year until a few days ago.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Seems like there are a lot of QB prospects that are getting discussed around here as if they are extremely well-regarded. Does anybody know how many QBs are coming out that people like McShay, Mayock, Kiper, etc. would assign a first round grade to?

I hear Tannehill, Foles, this Osweiler guy, several others. Can you draftniks help a brother out and explain where each guy is slotted by the experts? It kind of feels like there are 10 first round QBs this year, a little perspective would be valuable.

Luck, Griffin, Tannehill won't get out of the first round. I just don't think there's any way that Osweiler will either. That's a GTripp opinion right now, as he's really only a second or third round value as a passer coming out. But so was Cam Newton.

Foles could end up being the third guy off the board or the fifth guy off the board.

The best value in this draft (outside of Kellen Moore, who just seems like he's going to get horribly undervalued because you can't look at him and think "first round quarterback") will end up being Cousins because 1) he has first round ability and profiles favorably to one or two of the guys I listed above, and 2) he's just going to get buried into the third round (if not later) by the remarkable depth of this draft.

Basically, you're looking at two guys going in the top five or six picks (or three if the Redskins reach), and another two or three going before the end of the first round. Foles isn't going to make it past pick 40. So that's five guys who will be gone by the time the Redskins are slated to pick in round 2.

And IMO, two other guys with first round quarterback abilities who are going to get driven down the board because of highly superficial concerns about their ability to hold up in the pros as starters. And, well, because supply exceeds demand so that someone is going to get driven down.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Luck, Griffin, Tannehill won't get out of the first round. I just don't think there's any way that Osweiler will either. That's a GTripp opinion right now, as he's really only a second or third round value as a passer coming out. But so was Cam Newton.

Foles could end up being the third guy off the board or the fifth guy off the board.

The best value in this draft (outside of Kellen Moore, who just seems like he's going to get horribly undervalued because you can't look at him and think "first round quarterback") will end up being Cousins because 1) he has first round ability and profiles favorably to one or two of the guys I listed above, and 2) he's just going to get buried into the third round (if not later) by the remarkable depth of this draft.

Basically, you're looking at two guys going in the top five or six picks (or three if the Redskins reach), and another two or three going before the end of the first round. Foles isn't going to make it past pick 40. So that's five guys who will be gone by the time the Redskins are slated to pick in round 2.

And IMO, two other guys with first round quarterback abilities who are going to get driven down the board because of highly superficial concerns about their ability to hold up in the pros as starters. And, well, because supply exceeds demand so that someone is going to get driven down.

Cool that's helpful. So from your point of view - assuming we can't get Luck or Griffin - you're probably hoping to see us be patient and sometime after Round 1 snatch up whichever talented QB drops further than he should on draft day?

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Cool that's helpful. So from your point of view - assuming we can't get Luck or Griffin - you're probably hoping to see us be patient and sometime after Round 1 snatch up whichever talented QB drops further than he should on draft day?

I think that would be a good strategy for any team w/QB need, though I'm not sure it's a luxury the current coaching staff has.

I think it seems to be breaking in a certain way that Tannehill and Osweiler (and this is just speculation, particularly in Osweiler's case) will be overvalued assets on draft day while Kellen Moore, Kirk Cousins, Nick Foles will be undervalued. But that doesn't mean I would wait around until the top four QBs get taken to make a move in the draft to get a QB. I could see Philadelphia targeting Osweiler in the first round and so I may be willing to have the Redskins trade up ahead of Philly to get him, IF they think he can play. Sure, that'd be reaching for him, but the guy has a boatload of talent.

I'm also not sure how Brandon Weeden will play into this. He will on some level, but at 29 years old next year, I'm one of those who believes his advanced age calls everything about his college career into question. When you see it in numbers, it was a really sensational career and someone will take him in the mid rounds for his abilities, but then I go back on tape and watch Kellen Moore against Weeden and it's easy to see why he will be lost in the depth of this class.

[skinsfaninok]

Never seen him play

[skinsfan69]

Only saw one ASU game and it was against Boise. This guy looked like shit. Maybe cause it was against a tough opponent but I just wasn't impressed. He seemed to move pretty well for a big guy, but he wasn't accurate, threw into coverage, missed open wr's, he needs another year of college ball IMO.

Another thing,..Pac Ten QB's really seem to be tough to grade cause they play in a conference that doesn't play defense. How many Pac Ten Qb's have come into the NFL and failed?? Ryan Leaf, Andrew Walter, Kyle Boller, Tommy Maddox, Joey Harrington, Akili Smith, Cade McNown, Todd Marinavich, Kellen Clemons, John David Booty, Matt Leinart...Sanchez is turing out to be not as good as advertised. I'm probably missing a few but I don't think a conference has had more misses than the Pac Ten. Of course the best Pac Ten QB of all time is Mark Rypien!!!

[SFREDSKIN]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

Only saw one ASU game and it was against Boise. This guy looked like shit. Maybe cause it was against a tough opponent but I just wasn't impressed. He seemed to move pretty well for a big guy, but he wasn't accurate, threw into coverage, missed open wr's, he needs another year of college ball IMO.

Another thing,..Pac Ten QB's really seem to be tough to grade cause they play in a conference that doesn't play defense. How many Pac Ten Qb's have come into the NFL and failed?? Ryan Leaf, Andrew Walter, Kyle Boller, Tommy Maddox, Joey Harrington, Akili Smith, Cade McNown, Todd Marinavich, Kellen Clemons, John David Booty, Matt Leinart...Sanchez is turing out to be not as good as advertised. I'm probably missing a few but I don't think a conference has had more misses than the Pac Ten. Of course the best Pac Ten QB of all time is Mark Rypien!!!

Aaron Rodgers, John Elway, Dan Fouts, Warren Moon, Jim Plunkett and Troy Aikman weren't too shabby.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN

Aaron Rodgers, John Elway, Dan Fouts, Warren Moon, Jim Plunkett and Troy Aikman weren't too shabby.

Agreed.. although Plunkett didn't have success until much later on in his career. My point is Pac Ten QB's seem to have more guys taken early that fail, for what ever reason.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

Agreed.. although Plunkett didn't have success until much later on in his career. My point is Pac Ten QB's seem to have more guys taken early that fail, for what ever reason.

The Pac 10 was better defensively when Plunkett and Fouts played.

[mbedner3420]

I think we can't discount the fact that anyone named Brock is an undeniable douche.

[SBXVII]

IDK Brandon Weeden looked good in his bowl game beating Stanford with Luck. Weeden is 6-4 and is around 218lbs. I'd take him in the 2nd round, whoever is the best WR in the 1st round and pick up a FA QB.

[mbedner3420]

Originally Posted by SBXVII

IDK Brandon Weeden looked good in his bowl game beating Stanford with Luck. Weeden is 6-4 and is around 218lbs. I'd take him in the 2nd round, whoever is the best WR in the 1st round and pick up a FA QB.

The major downside is that he is already 28. When he acclimated fully to the nfl he'll be 31-32ish. I'd rather have someone far younger that we can mold.

[SBXVII]

Originally Posted by mbedner3420

The major downside is that he is already 28. When he acclimated fully to the nfl he'll be 31-32ish. I'd rather have someone far younger that we can mold.

Let me ask you this.... serious question.... Luck or RGIII is going to acclimate to the NFL better or quicker? You basically saying that he will take 2-4 yrs to acclimate. Newton didn't take that long. Tebow didn't take that long. The QB I wanted the team to take and didn't Andy Dalton was supposed to be a 3rd ro 4th rounder this time last year... he didn't take 2-4 yrs to acclimate.

I'm not pointing a finger at you but some fans here get one player in mind and tune themselves out to any other options.

Luck- is the only good QB. We have to do whatever it costs to get him.

RGIII- Luck will be gone, RGIII is a qualified next best, we have to sell the farm to leap the Browns to get him.

Tannehill- is a decent 2nd rounder that won't be there then cause some team will over reach in the 1st round for him because they don't want to lose out on the QB battles this year.

Everyone else- not worthy.

VETS:

Flynn- Although being in the league for a few years, stayed with the same team the whole time, knows the WCO systems, and has filled in nicely now and then..... basically has not proved himself so he's not worthy.

Hoyer(N.E)- See above.

Orton- No better, no worse then Grossman. Failed with the Bears..demoted..traded. Failed with Bronco's... demoted.

Cassel- 30y/o, although is safer with the ball and does not throw as many INT's, he was not spectacular with the Cheifs. If he fits this style of WCO and its similar to what the Patriots run offensively then bring him, otherwise pass due to age and declining talent.

I know I'm being cynical but this is almost how everyone acts. Out of the bunch apparently there is no good QB's. There will be a need to bring in a Vet to replace Beck. Apparently Crompton is staying so they can evaluate him further as Preseason fodder. Whether Grossman stays or goes is the biggie, if he stays obviously there will only be a need for 1 Vet, if he goes I'd imagine the team bringing in two Vets and signing a Rookie possibly two one being a UDFA. Letting all 5 QB's compete; Vet, Vet, Crompton, Rookie, UDFA. In the end I see Vet, 1st or 2nd round Rookie, UDFA.

and if we are all in for new talent, non aged QB's, healthy, and can play in the NFL, and have not been beaten up then I'd take:

Flynn/Hoyer (Vet)
Tannehill/Weeden (Developmental Rookie)
Late Draft Pick/UDFA (Practice Squad)

[Hog1]

Originally Posted by mbedner3420

The major downside is that he is already 28. When he acclimated fully to the nfl he'll be 31-32ish. I'd rather have someone far younger that we can mold.

YEEooow. I hope that is like....dog years. Was he in the service or just a slow learner? Well, on the positive side I guess he knows about 63 ways to kill a man with his bare hands. That should help with the occasional overzealous Linebacker....

[Hail to the Redskins]

Originally Posted by Hog1

YEEooow. I hope that is like....dog years. Was he in the service or just a slow learner? Well, on the positive side I guess he knows about 63 ways to kill a man with his bare hands. That should help with the occasional overzealous Linebacker....

Brandon Weeden was drafted out of high school by the Yankees in 2002 (He was an All-State baseball AND basketball player... athlete!) and was interestingly enough traded to the Dodgers with Jeff Weaver for Kevin Brown in 2004.

He played 5 seasons in the minor leagues before enrolling at OSU.

Hey... If we draft Blackmon in the 1st, and he's available in the 4th... why not? If anyone, besides Moore, is going to be undervalued... it'd be Weeden due to his age.

Hell, why not take him AND Moore (in the 3rd and 4th or 4th and 5th) if we can?

Do I think he would step in and be worse than Grossman? I don't know.... I don't think he's that bad.