Joe Gibbs lied

[wolfeskins]

i was confused at first but after getting away from the tv for a while i was thinking about the campbell pick and this is what i've come up with. the skins needed to get a good backup qb. gibbs realizes that brunell is done, the skins will cut him next year. ramsey has been given the chance to become the qb of now and the imediate future, if he does then thats great but if he fails the skins need a backup plan. this is were campbell enters the picture. brunell is not the answer and neither is hasselback. gibbs obviously sees something special with campbell. campbell is tall, athletic, can scramble, a great student of the game, has a great work ethic and is a very accurate passer.

[jdlea]

Matty...I never said that Gibbs shouldn't have shown his hand too early. I knew they were picking Rogers and Campbell last week...I read it in the post! I didn't care that he did. I just don't like him coming on right before the draft starts and telling the fans about all the help they're gonna get Ramsey and then he provides Ramsey with nothing but competition. So what he told the fans at the Draft Party was false.

Lie - A false statement deliberately presented as being true; a falsehood.
Something meant to deceive or give a wrong impression.

Did he not give the wrong impression to everyone at FedEx? Did they not believe it to be true? Did they expect Joe Gibbs to present with a falsehood? Tell me again that he didn't lie.

One last point, I never said Campbell would start this year, but the drafting of Campbell in the first round shows that Ramsey is not his QB.

[joecrisp]

Originally Posted by wolfeskins

i was confused at first but after getting away from the tv for a while i was thinking about the campbell pick and this is what i've come up with. the skins needed to get a good backup qb. gibbs realizes that brunell is done, the skins will cut him next year. ramsey has been given the chance to become the qb of now and the imediate future, if he does then thats great but if he fails the skins need a backup plan. this is were campbell enters the picture. brunell is not the answer and neither is hasselback. gibbs obviously sees something special with campbell. campbell is tall, athletic, can scramble, a great student of the game, has a great work ethic and is a very accurate passer.

I pretty much went through the same thought process you did, wolfeskins, and came to the same conclusions. Initially, I was extremely disappointed with the Campbell pick, though I knew that was what they were going to do. It just didn't make sense to me at the time, what with the pressing need for talent and depth at defensive end and various other positions. I still have significant reservations about the pick, but I can take a little more comfort now that I think I understand the logic behind it.

To me, the Campbell pick really is more of an indictment of Brunell and Hasselbeck than it is a foreshadowing of Ramsey's imminent failure. I think Gibbs expects Ramsey to be successful over the next two years, he'll be tough to re-sign beyond 2006, and for cap purposes, Brunell will probably be cut in 2006. It makes sense to begin the grooming process now for the man who will take over if Ramsey leaves for greener pastures after 2006. They obviously see something special in Campbell.

I just hope they at least tried to trade down from that pick. It seems like Campbell could have been taken later. But who knows, maybe other teams had their eyes on Campbell, too. Seattle, Indy, Cleveland and Tampa all may have been waiting for him to fall to them in the late 1st or early 2nd round.

Who knows, but thinking about it that way will help me sleep better tonight.

[offiss]

It seems a lot of guy's here think that this is not a win now pick that Gibbs is looking towards the future? Well why then did he give up the future and vastly overpay for a QB that's probably 3 years away from seeing the field? Why not wait till next year when the QB class will be much stronger? It's not like we need Campbell this season, if Ramsey goes down were screwed anyway, why didn't we go after a bonified franchise QB last season?

The bottom line here is this, we had the 30th ranked offense and choose not to upgrade it, we had the 3rd best defense and choose to upgrade that, are we the only team in the draft that doesn't draft for need?

[jdlea]

Originally Posted by offiss

It seems a lot of guy's here think that this is not a win now pick that Gibbs is looking towards the future? Well why then did he give up the future and vastly overpay for a QB that's probably 3 years away from seeing the field? Why not wait till next year when the QB class will be much stronger? It's not like we need Campbell this season, if Ramsey goes down were screwed anyway, why didn't we go after a bonified franchise QB last season?

The bottom line here is this, we had the 30th ranked offense and choose not to upgrade it, we had the 3rd best defense and choose to upgrade that, are we the only team in the draft that doesn't draft for need?

Pretty much what I've been getting at. I am offended that Joe said they would upgrade the offense, when I knew they wouldn't because I knew the 2 guys they were gonna pick and that's exactly what they did. Ignore the need to upgrade an anemic offense and bolster a defense we couldn't keep together. QB doesn't make sense. We could have gotten one next year with our first round pick. Then we would have had a day one receiver. That seems like pretty good logic to me. I don't agree in taking out insurance well before it is needed in this case.

[wolfeskins]

he didn't lie, he just didn't tell the truth. big difference.

[jdlea]

I just don't think he needed to put up a smokescreen 12 minutes before the draft happened at the draft party. That irks me. It's stupid. Especially when the post already said the two players they had fallen in love with. It was stupid. I told my brother that I didn't believe him and I was right.

[sportscurmudgeon]

Frankly, it doesn't matter even a little bit if Joe Gibbs lied or didn't lie.

He was not under oath. He has no obligation to tell fans the truth. His job is to try to make the Redskins into a winner. I have no doubt that he is trying to do that. I may not agree with all of his moves but I don't doubt that that he really thinks they are good ones. I don't believe he is sabotaging this team.

And he does not owe me any "explanations" or "the truth". If he was my doctor or my lawyer, I'd demand the truth from him. He's a football coach, not a doctor or lawyer...

[wolfeskins]

he couldn't give out his true gameplan 12 min. before the draft. thats about 2 hours before his first pick. i don't call that lieing he was just not showing his hand.

[4mrusmc]

Since my beloved Redskins will not be going to the super bowl anytime soon, can anyone tell me how I can get VHS copies of past super bowls? Of course those would be the super bowls that the Redskins won. Any help would be greatly appriciated.

[MTK]

Has Gibbs handed the starting QB job over to Campbell??

He has said Ramsey is his starter, where are the lies?

[4mrusmc]

What NFL team has 4 Q.B.'s? Someone will be cut or traded. What offensive needs got addressed imediately? Certainly not from a rookie Q.B. But maybe he will be the second coming of MCnabb. We still need people who can catch touchdown passes!

[MTK]

Gibbs' comments on Ramsey:

“This does not affect Patrick in any way. I had talks with him last week. Patrick is our starter. Patrick is the guy we are counting on to taking us to the playoffs and championships here. We are trying to get every single thing around Patrick or any quarterback that played for us there. I talked to Patrick about our offensive line and our receivers and the efforts that we made there. We are counting on Patrick. Mark (Brunell) is sitting there in a position that is very important for us. He is a mature guy who can do the things that we feel like are very important. We talked about them in getting Mark last year. I was very comfortable if the competition went and it wound up Mark starting and Patrick sitting there behind him learning and getting ready to play that would be fine.

If it was the other way around I also would be very comfortable. Of course we all know what happened last year. I think the bottom line on this one was when you consider everything and we got down to 25, we felt like there would be some very good players there and there were and we did our homework and we didn’t think that Jason would go that far, we thought he was going to be gone early. When it got down to that pick we felt like it was hard to pass him up.”

[JWsleep]

I agree with this line of thought, wolfeskins and crisp--it explains the move best, I think. But the entire thing was badly handled. THey got very lucky Campbell was still on the board. If Aaron Rogers isn't there, GB may well have taken Campbell. You don't trade up several days before the draft, and then blatantly tip your hand.

If Ramsey isn't the guy, we need to get someone right now to groom. Brunnel's gone, and Hasselbeck doesn't have the tools. So there's some logic to it, I suppose. But it all stems from Gibbs error on Brunnell in the first place--forcing him now to get another QB and taking up a huge chunk of cap space. SO however you cut it, it's bad FO stuff. ANd that's on Gibbs.

And we spent a LOT of picks on this kid. And we undermine Ramsey. And we look like clowns. THe players read the papers too. It's tough to inspire confidence in this kind of atmosphere. And it's tough to change the "culture" at Redskins park if this is how the offseason goes.

We still need a DE, a TE, a stud WR, a MLB, etc. And we've got one more pick, or somehting like that. ANd few picks next year already. DOes this sound like a stable plan? Oh, yeah: given our cap situation, we can't buy the FAs either. And Arringtons pissed with a contract grievance. ANd Taylor is AOL. ANd we traded Coles for Moss because COles was unhappy, taking a 9mil caphit. ANd we still haven't re-signed Moss, who, no doubt, we'll overpay for.

Rant over. Ugh.

[JWsleep]

We needed a CB. BUt I agree about the Campbell thing. I was just trying to rationalize it so I can sleep.