Mark Sanchez at 13th?

[GTripp0012]

Anyway, you guys can count me in the "doubts this will actually get done" category since Snyder isn't just going crazy trying to sell the farm for Sanchez, and you could argue that we don't have a single position of immense need (except Center), but it's a significant handicap to build your team when "next year" is never a consideration to the guy making the calls.

[Ruhskins]

To me, this whole situation seems very simple:

Acquiring an area of need at #13 (OT, DE, or LB) allows the team to get younger and talented in any of those area. The option of trading down is there, giving us the opportunity to get more young players (i.e. a lower 1st rounder and a 2nd or 3rd rounder)

Keeping Jason Campbell for one season does two things: Allow for true continuity from last year to this year, and put everything squarely on JC's shoulder. Prevent us from losing any future draft picks. If JC does well, then well next year we can continue to build on any success from 2009.

Should Jason Campbell fail, after the 2009 season the team can do a complete overhaul. If we have another mediocre to terrible season, our #1 pick would be a high one, and we would have all of our picks. We can either pick one of the top QBs in next year's draft, or hey maybe Phillip Rivers or Big Ben won't extend with their teams (highly unlikely, but who knows) and we could go after them.

Even if the team fails with JC at the helm, our #13 pick (OT, DE, or LB) in 2009 would be an excellent pick and something we can build on (copyright Herm Edwards) if the team goes through a complete overhaul. But unfortunately the owner is not willing to take that risk, is impatient, and will mortgage the #13 and future picks on Sanchez.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

To me, this whole situation seems very simple:

Acquiring an area of need at #13 (OT, DE, or LB) allows the team to get younger and talented in any of those area. The option of trading down is there, giving us the opportunity to get more young players (i.e. a lower 1st rounder and a 2nd or 3rd rounder)

Keeping Jason Campbell for one season does two things: Allow for true continuity from last year to this year, and put everything squarely on JC's shoulder. Prevent us from losing any future draft picks. If JC does well, then well next year we can continue to build on any success from 2009.

Should Jason Campbell fail, after the 2009 season the team can do a complete overhaul. If we have another mediocre to terrible season, our #1 pick would be a high one, and we would have all of our picks. We can either pick one of the top QBs in next year's draft, or hey maybe Phillip Rivers or Big Ben won't extend with their teams (highly unlikely, but who knows) and we could go after them.

Even if the team fails with JC at the helm, our #13 pick (OT, DE, or LB) in 2009 would be an excellent pick and something we can build on (copyright Herm Edwards) if the team goes through a complete overhaul. But unfortunately the owner is not willing to take that risk, is impatient, and will mortgage the #13 and future picks on Sanchez.

I hear what your saying, and those would be the positives to look at in a "worst case scenario" situation but the thought of starting over from scratch next year makes me sick. I mean, whens the last time this team has benefited from starting over from scratch?

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

I hear what your saying, and those would be the positives to look at in a "worst case scenario" situation but the thought of starting over from scratch next year makes me sick. I mean, whens the last time this team has benefited from starting over from scratch?

BHA, I don't think anyone likes starting from scratch, but there are teams that have benefited from this (Atlanta, Miami, heck even Baltimore had a down year or two, and were able to pick up good players through the draft and get back to being contenders). Honestly, I don't know when was the last time that our team started from scratch. But this half-rebuilding/half-reloading doesn't convince me (rebuilding= getting a new young QB in Sanchez or Quinn; reloading = signing Hall, Haynesworth, and Dockery).

[GTripp0012]

With the Redskins, you never know when they are serious or not.

It's hard to believe they could chase Cutler as hard as they did, and then decide that because they didn't get him, they're in rebuilding all of a sudden. That's reason number one why I don't see them pulling the trigger on the trade up. If he's there at 13, he'll be a Redskin, but that seems impossible.

[skinfan007]

Originally Posted by sean"big hurt"taylor

i'm starting to come around on drafting this guy if he's available for us at 13th. Jason could become a good quarterback in the near future but i think this kid could be our franchise quarterback for the next 10 -15 years. Everything i hear about him makes me believe that we may have to draft him if he's there. He always make the right read, takes what the defenses gives him, very accurate even on the move and he's cerebral which he is able to go through the playbook and analyze it. They even say he knows where the blitz is coming from even though that was college not the pros but can be taught by zorn. Usc also runs the west coast offense which is similar to ours per fred davis. I was favoring the linebacker rey but sanchez might need to be the answer. Before i get flack for this thread i know we need oline help as well as lb and de help but franchise quarterbacks brings championships. Guys what do you think?

you have lost your mind does any body realize that for the last 5 years we have needed a dominating pass rush to contend for the playoffs. We need to either draft a top notch pass rusher or strong side linebacker in first round or an immediate playmaker like a percy harvin. 2nd round we need a complimentary running back for clinton portis if you notice our division is full of two headed monsters in the backfield. We also should have grabbed a torry holt or a ol like peters in free agency . I think we also should bench campbell in favor of brennan

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by skinfan007

you have lost your mind does any body realize that for the last 5 years we have needed a dominating pass rush to contend for the playoffs. We need to either draft a top notch pass rusher or strong side linebacker in first round or an immediate playmaker like a percy harvin. 2nd round we need a complimentary running back for clinton portis if you notice our division is full of two headed monsters in the backfield. We also should have grabbed a torry holt or a ol like peters in free agency . I think we also should bench campbell in favor of brennan

Oh boy.

Welcome aboard though, I'm sure you'll be welcomed by the Cult of Colt soon.

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by skinfan007

you have lost your mind does any body realize that for the last 5 years we have needed a dominating pass rush to contend for the playoffs. We need to either draft a top notch pass rusher or strong side linebacker in first round or an immediate playmaker like a percy harvin. 2nd round we need a complimentary running back for clinton portis if you notice our division is full of two headed monsters in the backfield. We also should have grabbed a torry holt or a ol like peters in free agency . I think we also should bench campbell in favor of brennan

So Percy Harvin in the 1st, a complimentary running back in the 2nd (which we don't have), we should have grabbed Torry Holt, an old WR or Peters (who wasn't a free agent) in free agency and we should bench Campbell in favor of Brennan. Wow.

Welcome to the board, your week here should be interesting.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by skinfan007

you have lost your mind does any body realize that for the last 5 years we have needed a dominating pass rush to contend for the playoffs. We need to either draft a top notch pass rusher or strong side linebacker in first round or an immediate playmaker like a percy harvin. 2nd round we need a complimentary running back for clinton portis if you notice our division is full of two headed monsters in the backfield. We also should have grabbed a torry holt or a ol like peters in free agency . I think we also should bench campbell in favor of brennan

WOW???? You must be either a Gator fan or live down here in the Hampton Roads area to be on Percy Harvin. What's Harvin going to do when he's in the NFL and the DBs are just as fast as he is? Don't get me wrong he should be a solid NFL utility player at WR/KR, but he's a little bigger Ted Ginn Jr. with less polish as a WR. Going to be hard to get a RB in the 2nd round if we take Harvin with the 1st since we don't have a 2nd rounder this year.

Brennan :frusty: We've already

[CRedskinsRule]

I still think this is all a smoke screen, if Det takes an OT, and they think we want a qb, maybe they will trade with us. or even trade ahead of us, thus making sure two qbs are drafted ahead of us, and hopefully leaving an OL/DL option.

[GTripp0012]

ProFootballTalk.com - ‘Skins Bluffing On Sanchez Interest?

Mike Florio plays up...er down the possibility of us getting Sanchez.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

shouldn't your post end "except Campbell"?

Lol, i suppose I deserve that, but seriously - I firmly beleive Campbell will be noticably better in 2009 than he was in 2008... I just don't beleive its likely his play will be enough of an improvement for Snyder to keep Campbell - Hence all my arguments about moving on now: 1) To get compensation for Campbell; 2) to go ahead and start grooming our next (hopefully) franchise QB.

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

What has Zorn done the past two months to change your opinion of him? I thought you had said recently hiring him was a dumb move, and next offseason (presumably when he's gone) couldn't come soon enough

I like Zorn and I like Campbell - I just dont like them together. While its possible both Zorn and Campbell have success in 2009 and beyond, i dont think its likely. If you asked me to chose between the two now, i'd chose Zorn, if for no other reason than that if we fired him after 2009 and kept Campbell, Campbell would have to learn another offense and start from scratch again.

We've kept the same defensive scheme in place 5 years and, with one exception, our defense has been very good for those 5 years. The way i see it, we committed to the WCO and we need to keep it here a minimum of 5 years. Lets keep the system in place and gradually adjust our personnel to suit that system over the course of that timeframe.

BHA, I hear you. While you know we disagree on Campbell's potential here, we agree that with Campbell this is a make or break season and if it's break, then Zorn is going also.

I'm interested in in what scenario do you see Quinn as our starting QB on opening day? How would those trade machinations work out?

Originally Posted by Paintrain

I'm also on board (surprisingly) with your assessment of a Sanchez based draft day. That would mean Washington, who hasn't gotten a sniff anywhere else, would come back as the starter at SLB, we've got players who have started for us before with Heyer and Daniels/Wynn who can man the RT and DE spots so we'd be entering the season with some youth, some age but nothing we hadn't seen before at those spots. It's far from the ideal scenario but it's not doomsday either.

As soon as I read that the skins were in the midst of a 3-way trade with Denver and the Browns, i wondered if Brady Quinn was our true objective and the deal would have sent Cutler to Cleavland, Quinn to DC (Cerrato is a ND boy and loves him some Quinn), and Campbell to Denver... but all the reports indicated we wanted Cutler, so i dismissed the notion.

Then, in his column today, Peter King indicated that the Browns are just as in love with Sanchez as Snyder. I also read a report today (can't remember where) that said the Skins have a tentative deal in place with Browns for a trade if Sanchez falls to Cleavlands spot. Given that Cleavland (evidently) prefers Sanchez and Anderson to Quinn (why are they even looking at Sanchez when they have those two?), it made sense to me that we would be trading for QUINN, after Cleavland selected Sanchez. So, I think its entirely possible that a senario similar to this could happen:

Brady Quinn and Braylon Edwards to Washington for our #13 and Fred Davis (and probably another player)

This would also explain why:
1. The Browns are looking at QBs when they just drafted one in the 1st round. (New coach wants to pick his own guy)
2. There were rumors of Cooley being traded to Cleveland (right position, wrong player)
3. The Browns have yet to trade Edwards. (Our deals better)

In the end, the Browns would get rid of two players they dont really want while picking up a 1st rounder and a starter, and we'd get the "franchise" QB and "stud" WR covetted by Snyder for so long, while only giving up our 2009 1st rounder and a starting caliber TE who is stuck behind a pro-bowler. We'd probably have to give up something else (possibly Santana Moss, ARE, or D. Thomas), but in the end, both sides would get what they covet, without having to give up anything they really wanted.

Again, thats all pure speculation, but its just a possibility that occurred to me after reading Kings article today.

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

As soon as I read that the skins were in the midst of a 3-way trade with Denver and the Browns, i wondered if Brady Quinn was our true objective and the deal would have sent Cutler to Cleavland, Quinn to DC (Cerrato is a ND boy and loves him some Quinn), and Campbell to Denver... but all the reports indicated we wanted Cutler, so i dismissed the notion.

Then, in his column today, Peter King indicated that the Browns are just as in love with Sanchez as Snyder. I also read a report today (can't remember where) that said the Skins have a tentative deal in place with Browns for a trade if Sanchez falls to Cleveland's spot. Given that Cleavland (evidently) prefers Sanchez and Anderson to Quinn (why are they even looking at Sanchez when they have those two?), it made sense to me that we would be trading for QUINN, after Cleavland selected Sanchez. So, I think its entirely possible that a scenario similar to this could happen:

Brady Quinn and Braylon Edwards to Washington for our #13 and Fred Davis (and probably another player)

This would also explain why:
1. The Browns are looking at QBs when they just drafted one in the 1st round. (New coach wants to pick his own guy)
2. There were rumors of Cooley being traded to Cleveland (right position, wrong player)
3. The Browns have yet to trade Edwards. (Our deals better)

In the end, the Browns would get rid of two players they dont really want while picking up a 1st rounder and a starter, and we'd get the "franchise" QB and "stud" WR coveted by Snyder for so long, while only giving up our 2009 1st rounder and a starting caliber TE who is stuck behind a pro-bowler. We'd probably have to give up something else (possibly Santana Moss, ARE, or D. Thomas), but in the end, both sides would get what they covet, without having to give up anything they really wanted.

Again, that's all pure speculation, but its just a possibility that occurred to me after reading Kings article today.

It's an interesting premise. It would accomplish a couple of Snyder's long term 'goals'. I think it may be too many moving parts for it to come to fruition but it's interesting nonetheless.

Does anyone miss the relative calm of last offseason when we were just talking about a protracted coaching search, a new unproven head coach, the retirement of an organizational icon and an unprecedented number of draft picks? Ah the good old days!

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

Then, in his column today, Peter King indicated that the Browns are just as in love with Sanchez as Snyder. I also read a report today (can't remember where) that said the Skins have a tentative deal in place with Browns for a trade if Sanchez falls to Cleavlands spot. Given that Cleavland (evidently) prefers Sanchez and Anderson to Quinn (why are they even looking at Sanchez when they have those two?), it made sense to me that we would be trading for QUINN, after Cleavland selected Sanchez. So, I think its entirely possible that a senario similar to this could happen:

Brady Quinn and Braylon Edwards to Washington for our #13 and Fred Davis (and probably another player)

This would also explain why:
1. The Browns are looking at QBs when they just drafted one in the 1st round. (New coach wants to pick his own guy)
2. There were rumors of Cooley being traded to Cleveland (right position, wrong player)
3. The Browns have yet to trade Edwards. (Our deals better)

In the end, the Browns would get rid of two players they dont really want while picking up a 1st rounder and a starter, and we'd get the "franchise" QB and "stud" WR covetted by Snyder for so long, while only giving up our 2009 1st rounder and a starting caliber TE who is stuck behind a pro-bowler. We'd probably have to give up something else (possibly Santana Moss, ARE, or D. Thomas), but in the end, both sides would get what they covet, without having to give up anything they really wanted.

Again, thats all pure speculation, but its just a possibility that occurred to me after reading Kings article today.

I wouldn't mind this scenario, however we'll be giving up more than our # 1 and Davis to make it happen. Currently the market for Edwards is a #1 & #3-#4 pick. Quinn was #21 (or therabout). So in your scenario, we'd wind up with a either Edwards or Quinn, not both.

I'm a big ND fan, but am definitely not a fan of giving up our # 1 this year for Quinn or using it on Sanchez. These are unproven commodities when we have at worst a decent QB. IMO, JC is on the cusp of being very good.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

Lol, i suppose I deserve that, but seriously - I firmly beleive Campbell will be noticably better in 2009 than he was in 2008... I just don't beleive its likely his play will be enough of an improvement for Snyder to keep Campbell - Hence all my arguments about moving on now: 1) To get compensation for Campbell; 2) to go ahead and start grooming our next (hopefully) franchise QB.

Fair point, if you're going to move in another direction, why not move now? I just don't understand why they feel the need to move on from Campbell. I like Sanchez (much more than Stafford) but is he that much of an improvement over Campbell? Heck, why not just trade for Leinart?

I like Zorn and I like Campbell - I just dont like them together. While its possible both Zorn and Campbell have success in 2009 and beyond, i dont think its likely. If you asked me to chose between the two now, i'd chose Zorn, if for no other reason than that if we fired him after 2009 and kept Campbell, Campbell would have to learn another offense and start from scratch again.

My mind must be playing tricks on me. I thought you were anti-Zorn (regardless of Campbell). And if it's Gruden or Shanahan (or even Holmgren) next year than Campbell would likely not have to learn a new system. And if it's Cowher then he would conceivably be in that drop-back system that many (yourself included I believe) think he is best suited for.

We've kept the same defensive scheme in place 5 years and, with one exception, our defense has been very good for those 5 years. The way i see it, we committed to the WCO and we need to keep it here a minimum of 5 years. Lets keep the system in place and gradually adjust our personnel to suit that system over the course of that timeframe.

Constantly changing systems is not good on any level.