Jason Whitlock column on Taylor

[BleedBurgundy]

Originally Posted by Crazyhorse1

a moron has lead us into a murderous and elective war complete with cluster bombs and torture, previously thought unthinkable

I was just saying that I thought every Republican member of the board was going to be all over this. Obviously since I was the only one to comment on it, I was wrong. Everything else in your post, I agreed with. I think if you read through this whole thread you'll see that.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by BleedBurgundy

I was just saying that I thought every Republican member of the board was going to be all over this. Obviously since I was the only one to comment on it, I was wrong. Everything else in your post, I agreed with. I think if you read through this whole thread you'll see that.

Sometimes some things aren't worth responding to though

[Crazyhorse1]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Sometimes some things aren't worth responding to though

Cheap comment, based on nothing, offering nothing, dissing an honest and valid insight of a fellow Redskin fan and a much older and more experienced man in a serious discussion after an unbearable tragedy. Nice work. I have a fifteen year old who would love to talk to you. How many friends did you have killed in Nam? or raped children have you had who failed to find justice in court?

How many kids do you have in Iraq? I tell you what. If you don't think my posts are worth responding to, try not responding when I post.

[BrudLee]

I wanted to post this without commentary to hear what the forum thinks before I cluttered it with my own thoughts.

Clearly, a very powerful piece. As sportscurmudgeon said, this is indicative of a stance that Whitlock has taken in the past, but never before has he had such a visceral example.

I agree with memphisskin and others that his belief is less of an indictment of hip-hop than it is an indictment of a culture for which some hip-hop music is only a symptom. The number of black Americans killed in gun violence each year is staggering, yet few consider that this violence is systemic. Whether hip-hop is a reflection of this culture or vice-versa, there must be change.

[Twilbert07]

Wow, very strong and interesting column indeed. He has guts to put that opinion out there. Thanks for posting it, Brud.

[MTK]

I thought Cris Carter made a great point on Inside the NFL last night. He basically said that players can't bring the ghetto to the NFL and they have to cut ties to their prior lives or that's when tragedies like this happen.

[BleedBurgundy]

Not to be rude but this is getting hijacked. If we start in on the politics then we'll get WAY off topic.

[Crazyhorse1]

Originally Posted by BleedBurgundy

Not to be rude but this is getting hijacked. If we start in on the politics then we'll get WAY off topic.

You are rude, however, and a shallow reading such as yours is not appreciated. You see the name of a political figure in a post and knee jerk your way into a foolish hypothesis that a thoughtful post is about politics. The topic is not just Sean Taylor here, but the cultural conditions that make such a hideous crime likely. I cited many aspects of the failures of our society, corrupt politicians being one.

What do you think Whitlock is doing in his column? My post is my take on the subject he introduces. It's your post that is way off topic.

[BleedBurgundy]

Originally Posted by Crazyhorse1

You are rude, however, and a shallow reading such as yours is not appreciated. You see the name of a political figure in a post and knee jerk your way into a foolish hypothesis that a thoughtful post is about politics. The topic is not just Sean Taylor here, but the cultural conditions that make such a hideous crime likely. I cited many aspects of the failures of our society, corrupt politicians being one.

What do you think Whitlock is doing in his column? My post is my take on the subject he introduces. It's your post that is way off topic.

Let me put it this way. Every time Bush or Clinton is brought up on this site, it seems like right away a Right vs. Left arguement breaks out. That was my point, that there's a lot of touchy subjects being discussed and we all have to be careful. If that's rude, that's rude.

[Crazyhorse1]

Originally Posted by BleedBurgundy

Let me put it this way. Every time Bush or Clinton is brought up on this site, it seems like right away a Right vs. Left arguement breaks out. That was my point, that there's a lot of touchy subjects being discussed and we all have to be careful. If that's rude, that's rude.

You make an excellent point. I should have included Clinton as a President who has damaged the moral stature of the government, as has the current Congress on both sides of the aisle.

I believe in the trickle-down theory of corruption and meanness. Not showing respect for others or morality or law starts at the top and trickles on down to where the real dying is done.

Do I believe that characters like Nixon and Johnson and Kennedy and Reagan contribute to negative cultural dynamics that cause gang bangers and bad-boy rappers who want to kill cops and each other.

Yes, I do.

[SmootSmack]

SLAM! has some thoughts on this as well.

SLAM ONLINE | » Why the Sean Taylor issue is important to SLAM

[warriorzpath]

... and i'm not making a case against football culture; my point is that all cultures have a good and bad side - and you have to take the good with the bad. And I also understand that you have to address the social issues, but who is providing solutions or options? You can't get rid of a whole culture, which I think everybody thinks is the answer. So what do you do? Who has the answers? I haven't seen any yet.

And if you question that hip hop is not a culture, just look around.

[BleedBurgundy]

Technically, i think Hip Hop would best be defined as a sub-culture, but I get what you're saying. But I look back to Brudlee's earlier comment in this thread. There wouldn't be today's version of Hip Hop if there were not a pre-existing hopelessness and lack of positive leadership in the urban community.

[warriorzpath]

Originally Posted by BleedBurgundy

Technically, i think Hip Hop would best be defined as a sub-culture, but I get what you're saying. But I look back to Brudlee's earlier comment in this thread. There wouldn't be today's version of Hip Hop if there were not a pre-existing hopelessness and lack of positive leadership in the urban community.

First off, I respectfully disagree with your statement that hip hop is only a subculture. And there may be issues to be addressed in hip hop, but how do we address them?

You can list all of the causes of hip hop's negatives and the results of its influence, but cannot list one viable solution?

How about, first of all, trying to get with the hip hop leaders and talking to them. I hear that Sean Combs and Russell Simmons is feeling out the political arena. What about something like that ?

[BleedBurgundy]

Originally Posted by warriorzpath

First off, I respectfully disagree with your statement that hip hop is only a subculture. And there may be issues to be addressed in hip hop, but how do we address them?

You can list all of the causes of hip hop's negatives and the results of its influence, but cannot list one viable solution?

How about, first of all, trying to get with the hip hop leaders and talking to them. I hear that Sean Combs and Russell Simmons is feeling out the political arena. What about something like that ?

I'd have no problem at all with any individual trying their hand at politics regardless of their views. Everyone should have the chance to be heard. A good idea can come from everywhere. HOWEVER- I do not believe that an individual can make their fortune off of misfortune and still be a driving force for good. It just sends the wrong message. When I say makes a fortune off of misfortune I'm referring to glamorizing violence and cruelty to make a buck. Make no mistake, it is being glamorized.

As for a viable solution, if I had all the answers I'd be giving them to you. But I will say this. I think the answer involves a lot of education. I think it involves alot of individuals in these communities stepping up and saying that they will not accept a culture of violence for their children. I believe it takes consumers being responsible about where they put their money. Basically, it takes dedication to improvement.

Edit- I just read your latest post. IF violence is not a key element in hip hop, if it is only what the salesmen sell, then don't you think it is important that the positive forces in hip hop start getting the pub that all of the thugs are currently receiving? Personally, I am not a fan of rap music because of the message, not the delivery. I don't envy those in economically difficult situations, nor those in prison, nor those making money selling drugs. That may be only the vocal minority in the hip hop community espousing those views but as a very casual observer, that is what I am hearing.