Portis and Cooley Calling Out an Offensive Teammate?

[Trample the Elderly]

Originally Posted by Longtimefan

It's going to get worse next week.

It had better not.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by Longtimefan

It's going to get worse next week.

If we don't beat the Rams by atleast 14 points, then this team isn't going to win more than 5 games. If we lose to the Rams, Zorn's on notice. If we start out 0-4, Zorn should be fired.

That said, I think we should expect the skins to be 3-1 in the first quarter of the season. Anything less is simply unacceptable.

[GTripp0012]

The other factor, is that Campbell still has a major rapport with Randle El, one that he clearly does not have with either Kelly or Thomas. With Randle El completely schooling Terrell Thomas all game long, the ball was coming out quickly most of the game.

[GTripp0012]

The Giants gamble was: if they took away Moss with just one guy (Webster), they could use a safety on Kelly and prevent him from making a play beyond 15 yards. But where they went wrong is that they couldn't keep Randle El from beating them, so the fact that they took away Kelly became irrelevant in the grand scheme.

[44Deezel]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

The Giants gamble was: if they took away Moss with just one guy (Webster), they could use a safety on Kelly and prevent him from making a play beyond 15 yards. But where they went wrong is that they couldn't keep Randle El from beating them, so the fact that they took away Kelly became irrelevant in the grand scheme.

Good Offenses don't let Defenses take their play-makers out of the game. That's just another pathetic excuse by a pathetic Offense. You think Santana gets any more attention that Randy Moss, Andre Johnson, Larry F, Roddy White, Greg Jennings, Reggie Wayne or just about every other #1 receiver in the league? And yes, those teams have other weapons, but we have 5 players on Offense that have played in the pro-bowl - Sellers, Samuels, Cooley, Portis, Moss. Plenty of options and not a valid reason for averaging 16 points a game over the last 17 games.

[dmvskinzfan08]

Originally Posted by 44Deezel

Good Offenses don't let Defenses take their play-makers out of the game. That's just another pathetic excuse by a pathetic Offense. You think Santana gets any more attention that Randy Moss, Andre Johnson, Larry F, Roddy White, Greg Jennings, Reggie Wayne or just about every other #1 receiver in the league? And yes, those teams have other weapons, but we have 5 players on Offense that have played in the pro-bowl - Sellers, Samuels, Cooley, Portis, Moss. Plenty of options and not a valid reason for averaging 16 points a game over the last 17 games.

Exactly. I totoally agree. Its not about the conference or the players (as far as this discussion goes). Its about philosophy and the team takes on the character of their coaches. Its also about scheme. San Diego at one point didn't have good receivers. Before they got Vincent Jackson or the other WR. But they used what they had. LT and Gates. They still lit it up. We have Moss, Portis and Cooley and a lot of "potential" in the young WRs.

Going back to one year. When Sellers had all those catches for touchdowns. How many passes has he caught since Zorn has been here? Does Zorn even go back and try to look at some of the old tapes of what works and doesn't work with our personnel that has been here and then adapt and run shcemes that can work for the newer players. I think he jsut came in and said I am the man and this is how I am going to do it. Instead of being fleixible. But somethign tells me the talk he had with Gibbs will finally click in his head. I am sure Gibbs gave him some good advice regardless of how he did his second time around. Gibbs knows the evaluate players and put them in a position to win.

[44Deezel]

Originally Posted by dmvskinzfan08

Exactly. I totoally agree. Its not about the conference or the players (as far as this discussion goes). Its about philosophy and the team takes on the character of their coaches. Its also about scheme. San Diego at one point didn't have good receivers. Before they got Vincent Jackson or the other WR. But they used what they had. LT and Gates. They still lit it up. We have Moss, Portis and Cooley and a lot of "potential" in the young WRs.

Going back to one year. When Sellers had all those catches for touchdowns. How many passes has he caught since Zorn has been here? Does Zorn even go back and try to look at some of the old tapes of what works and doesn't work with our personnel that has been here and then adapt and run shcemes that can work for the newer players. I think he jsut came in and said I am the man and this is how I am going to do it. Instead of being fleixible. But somethign tells me the talk he had with Gibbs will finally click in his head. I am sure Gibbs gave him some good advice regardless of how he did his second time around. Gibbs knows the evaluate players and put them in a position to win.

And who were Brady's receivers when he won those 3 Super Bowls? I can only name the future hall of famer, Deion Branch

[dmvskinzfan08]

Originally Posted by 44Deezel

And who were Brady's receivers when he won those 3 Super Bowls? I can only name the future hall of famer, Deion Branch

That is the point I was making with San Diego that you are trying to make with NE. They didn't have pro bowl caliber receivers on offense beside LT and Gates until they drafted receivers in the past few years. But they still were putting up points even when Brees was there. I am saying that we have the players but we dont utilize them well and have a scheme that is molded to our players strengths.

Looking at my previous posts. I really need to check for typos..lol

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by 44Deezel

Good Offenses don't let Defenses take their play-makers out of the game. That's just another pathetic excuse by a pathetic Offense. You think Santana gets any more attention that Randy Moss, Andre Johnson, Larry F, Roddy White, Greg Jennings, Reggie Wayne or just about every other #1 receiver in the league? And yes, those teams have other weapons, but we have 5 players on Offense that have played in the pro-bowl - Sellers, Samuels, Cooley, Portis, Moss. Plenty of options and not a valid reason for averaging 16 points a game over the last 17 games.

Santana Moss, playmaker?! What year are we in?

[WaldSkins]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Santana Moss, playmaker?! What year are we in?

Can we have 3 slot receivers at all times?

[skins89moss]

Originally Posted by 44Deezel

Good Offenses don't let Defenses take their play-makers out of the game. That's just another pathetic excuse by a pathetic Offense. You think Santana gets any more attention that Randy Moss, Andre Johnson, Larry F, Roddy White, Greg Jennings, Reggie Wayne or just about every other #1 receiver in the league? And yes, those teams have other weapons, but we have 5 players on Offense that have played in the pro-bowl - Sellers, Samuels, Cooley, Portis, Moss. Plenty of options and not a valid reason for averaging 16 points a game over the last 17 games.

Your wrong on that because Andre Johnson of the Texans was taken out of the game against the Jets. Go look at his stats and see for yourself. CB Reves of the Jets heald him in check.

[itvnetop]

Originally Posted by skins89moss

Your wrong on that because Andre Johnson of the Texans was taken out of the game against the Jets. Go look at his stats and see for yourself. CB Reves of the Jets heald him in check.

AJ's not going to be held in check very often. Revis is the goods.

[mike340]

Putting myself in Moss's shoes:

I'm running a route. The QB is running towards the line of scrimmage and won't throw the ball before crossing the line of scrimmage. I
1) Run towards the line of scrimmage to give him a target to throw to, or
2) Cut off my run hoping to keep the defenders out of the area where the QB will run.

I didn't record the game, so can someone who did tell me if this is a possible scenario?

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by mike340

Putting myself in Moss's shoes:

I'm running a route. The QB is running towards the line of scrimmage and won't throw the ball before crossing the line of scrimmage. I
1) Run towards the line of scrimmage to give him a target to throw to, or
2) Cut off my run hoping to keep the defenders out of the area where the QB will run.

I didn't record the game, so can someone who did tell me if this is a possible scenario?

The INT is on Moss not so much for what he did before the pass but what he did once the football left Jason's arm. Moss did nothing to block out the DB and therefor 1.) make a better play on the ball 2.) minimize the chance the defender could get his hands on the ball. I rewatched the play a few times and Moss clearly could denied the INT...it's another instance where he gave up IMO.

Generally speaking though none of our WR corp (with the possible exception of Devin) use their body effectively block their DB from breaking up the pass. I mean when i watch other offenses, especially the potent ones, their WRs do an excellent job of positioning their body to again 1) make the best possible play on the ball 2.) minimize the chance the DB could get his hands on the ball. It eerily similar to what I think I see in college ball basically every game...WRs not yet skilled enough to do what a pro does. I think our WRs aren't there because there position coach hasn't progressed beyond the college level of WR play. I think it also begins to explain why Hixon has never been able to develop a WR at the professional level.

[GusFrerotte]

Hell Yeah!!!!!! CP and Cooley are the only Pro Bowler caliber guys we have on offense and are always true gamers since day one. Fellas better listen to them too!!! If this crap keeps up we will lose both next time they are up for contract renewal. At some point soon CP and CC are going to want to go out with a ring. Just think Barry Sanders. I agree put in Marko in for Moss more often, etc.