McCants: Your thoughts?

[SmootSmack]

With Campbell-a mobile QB of solid character-it's almost as if Gibbs was looking for a young Brunell isn't it?

[offiss]

Originally Posted by Daseal

Actually Offiss, I think Campbell would have been gone within the first 5 picks of the 2nd round. CLE especially would have nabbed him I bet.

Possibly, but my thought is no, I don't think he would have been in danger of being picked until he dropped to cincci. at 16, then possibly miami, and if cleveland didn't take him he would have fell at least into the middle rounds. But that's all speculation now.

[Daseal]

I agree we had other needs, but I think he would have been gone early 2nd. You're right -- it is speculation.

[offiss]

Originally Posted by Daseal

I agree we had other needs, but I think he would have been gone early 2nd. You're right -- it is speculation.

Obviously Daseal my biggest gripe is in our situation we didn't need a project at QB in the first, I could have lived with it if we dealt down and grabbed him in the second knowing we could have filled our need's, I just have a bad feeling that Justin Miller and Vincent Jackson are going to be tremendous players in the NFL for a long time and we missed out.

[RedskinsJunkie]

Another thing to consider here is that Ramsey had to look over his shoulder for Brunell and now again this pick shows Gibbs overall distrust that Patrick can run the offense. He can do it and Gibbs needs to make his Quarterback, the field general of the football team, feel as comfortable as possible and get him to perform on the field. If Gibb's is such the magician of developing QBs then he should do it. It isn't as if Ramsey doesn't have all of the tools.

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by RedskinsJunkie

Another thing to consider here is that Ramsey had to look over his shoulder for Brunell and now again this pick shows Gibbs overall distrust that Patrick can run the offense. He can do it and Gibbs needs to make his Quarterback, the field general of the football team, feel as comfortable as possible and get him to perform on the field. If Gibb's is such the magician of developing QBs then he should do it. It isn't as if Ramsey doesn't have all of the tools.

Gibbs named Ramsey the starter for 2005 before the 2004 season was even completed from what I remember or at least shortly after. At that point, I don't believe Ramsey was having to look over his shoulder.

Hey, Gibbs can only do so much...it's up to Ramsey to prove himself a field general and if he can't do the job, we obviously have to go to someone else who can.

[RedskinsJunkie]

Originally Posted by skinsguy

Gibbs named Ramsey the starter for 2005 before the 2004 season was even completed from what I remember or at least shortly after. At that point, I don't believe Ramsey was having to look over his shoulder.

Hey, Gibbs can only do so much...it's up to Ramsey to prove himself a field general and if he can't do the job, we obviously have to go to someone else who can.

Agreed, but don't you think that bringing in 2 quarterbacks in 2 years with an incumbant starter could kind of screw with his head a bit??? I really think confidence is a HUGE factor in a QB. Everyone wants to compare our team lately with NE because of WR, what if every year Belichek (sp?) brought in guys to compete for Brady's job??? Again, I don't consider these guys in the same ball park right now, but Ramsey has a lot of upside and if he had some continuity in the team and coaches he would be a lot farther along than he is right now. I mean the guy when in two polar opposite directions in Offense from Spurrier to Gibbs... I think we need to give this guy a full season in Gibbs system.

Oh, and Gibbs said that Brunell was the starter for 2004 and he didn't finish the season that way ( Thank God!!!)

[Daseal]

Gibbs also said Ramsey was the quarterback of the future. This pick will further shatter Ramsey's confidence.

[TheMalcolmConnection]

I'm glad everyone is finally starting to remember what I stated when Campbell was first brought in. I know Gibbs wants people with nerves of steel, but a person can only take so much. Ramsey has officially been shafted these past couple of years.

Even so, he can put a lot of that blame on himself for not winning the job in training camp. If I were Ramsey, this is how I would think about the situation in his obviously college-educated brain:

"If they are going to pay Brunell so many millions of dollars, why WOULDN'T they start him, regardless of how he does in training camp or not?"

I mean, you don't bring someone in with that much money and not start them.

[Defensewins]

Do you mean Ramsey's confidence is so weak that we can not have another good QB on the roster or it will 'mess with his head?
If so, get rid of him. We can not have a QB we have hold his hand and have to reassure all time for him to play well. This the NFL and you will always have competition/back ups on your team.

RedskinsJunkie said, "Everyone wants to compare our team lately with NE because of WR, what if every year Belichek (sp?) brought in guys to compete for Brady's job??? Again, I don't consider these guys in the same ball park right now, but Ramsey has a lot of upside and if he had some continuity in the team and coaches he would be a lot farther along than he is right now."

In the first SB season Brady was the backup that came in after Bledsoe got hurt, and when Bledsoe got healthy there was a huge QB controversy. Imagine having a probowl Qb (Bledsoe) on our bench that had previously led his team to the superbowl? Brady played great, the pressure did not effect him. Under your logic Ramsey would have folded like a cheap suit if he had Beldsee on his team.

[RedskinsJunkie]

Originally Posted by Defensewins

Do you mean Ramsey's confidence is so weak that we can not have another good QB on the roster or it will 'mess with his head?
If so, get rid of him. We can not have a QB we have hold his hand and have to reassure all time for him to play well. This the NFL and you will always have competition/back ups on your team.

RedskinsJunkie said, "Everyone wants to compare our team lately with NE because of WR, what if every year Belichek (sp?) brought in guys to compete for Brady's job??? Again, I don't consider these guys in the same ball park right now, but Ramsey has a lot of upside and if he had some continuity in the team and coaches he would be a lot farther along than he is right now."

In the first SB season Brady was the backup that came in after Bledsoe got hurt, and when Bledsoe got healthy there was a huge QB controversy. Imagine having a probowl Qb (Bledsoe) on our bench that had previously led his team to the superbowl? Brady played great, the pressure did not effect him. Under your logic Ramsey would have folded like a cheap suit if he had Beldsee on his team.

2 different situations. Brady came in because a guy was hurt. It was a much easier decision to make when the incumbant is a) hurt b) old and c) going into a contract year. Belichek obviously didn't see that much difference in the 2 QBs to pay out the money to keep Bledsoe and he knew that he could get good value from him by trading him for picks. Ramsey/Brunell/Campbell is a completely different scenerio.

[Defensewins]

Originally Posted by RedskinsJunkie

2 different situations. Brady came in because a guy was hurt. It was a much easier decision to make when the incumbant is a) hurt b) old and c) going into a contract year. Belichek obviously didn't see that much difference in the 2 QBs to pay out the money to keep Bledsoe and he knew that he could get good value from him by trading him for picks. Ramsey/Brunell/Campbell is a completely different scenerio.

Wait you changed the subject:
You brought it up in the context of a young QB not having to look over his shoulder and not feeling confidant. Not about which QB the coach should choose or what trade value that QB has.

Regarding your points that it was easier for coach Bellichek because:
a) the incumbant is hurt
b) the incumbant is old
c) going into contract year

The old and hurt incumbant (Bledsoe) was healthy and on the sidelines and ready to go before the playoffs strated in 2001 season. Brady got hurt in the in a very close AFC Champioship game against the Steelers and Bledsoe led them to the victiory. It was a day before the SB that Bellichek decided to go with Brady after Bledsoe played so well in the Steeler game the week prior.

I was living in Boston from 2000-2004; I was there and there was a huge QB controversy leading into that first SB win in 2001. It was not an easy decision for Bellichek, the city was leaning more towards going with the vet Bledsoe. It was a very unpopular decision in Boston that he went with Brady. Despite all of this pressure, the very young 6th round draft pick (Brady) did just fine.
That is real pressure, getting picked to start the SB over a multi-probowl player and having that probowl player HEALTHY on the side line ready to go.
With Ramsey's weak confidance with Brunnell on his team, he would not have handled this situation since it is more tense.

[RedskinsJunkie]

Originally Posted by Defensewins

Wait you changed the subject:
You brought it up in the context of a young QB not having to look over his shoulder and not feeling confidant. Not about which QB the coach should choose or what trade value that QB has.

Regarding your points that it was easier for coach Bellichek because:
a) the incumbant is hurt
b) the incumbant is old
c) going into contract year

The old and hurt incumbant (Bledsoe) was healthy and on the sidelines and ready to go before the playoffs strated in 2001 season. Brady got hurt in the in a very close AFC Champioship game against the Steelers and Bledsoe led them to the victiory. It was a day before the SB that Bellichek decided to go with Brady after Bledsoe played so well in the Steeler game the week prior.

I was living in Boston from 2000-2004; I was there and there was a huge QB controversy leading into that first SB win in 2001. It was not an easy decision for Bellichek, the city was leaning more towards going with the vet Bledsoe. It was a very unpopular decision in Boston that he went with Brady. Despite all of this pressure, the very young 6th round draft pick (Brady) did just fine.
That is real pressure, getting picked to start the SB over a multi-probowl player and having that probowl player HEALTHY on the side line ready to go.
With Ramsey's weak confidance with Brunnell on his team, he would not have handled this situation since it is more tense.

Bledsoe was hurt pretty early in the year if I remember correctly and Brady had one heck of a year. You could compare that to Rothlesburger (I know I can't spell) because it is pretty similar although Maddox isn't quite Bledsoe.

When Brady got hurt Bledsoe had a great game against the steelers yes, but It was Brady's team at that point. They could have put Bledsoe in well before the Steelers game because he was healthy enough to play. The move to get Brady in and Bledsoe out came out of necesity at first but then it was a shrewed move by Belichek knowing he had value in Bledsoe and he traded him for picks (at least one first rounder right??). We gave away 3 picks for a guy that Gibbs called a project? Listen, I hope all of this turns out for the best, I am just saying that Ramsey needs to be given the team and the trust to prosper.

[TheMalcolmConnection]

Originally Posted by Defensewins

Do you mean Ramsey's confidence is so weak that we can not have another good QB on the roster or it will 'mess with his head?
If so, get rid of him. We can not have a QB we have hold his hand and have to reassure all time for him to play well. This the NFL and you will always have competition/back ups on your team.

If you look at my original reasons for Ramsey possibly having a psychological problem, you'd see that having another good QB on the roster is not the only reason. We all KNOW that Gibbs brought in Brunell to start.

Say you have earned the starting spot after playing fairly well for a couple years, getting sacked repeatedly only to have your new coach draft a veteran and a college kid the next, how do you think people would feel?. Gibbs definitely spouted some rhetoric in saying that the competition would determine who would be starter. Ramsey played well enough to be starter years prior, why should he have to RE-try out for his job?

People are saying that if he is too fragile to handle this or too fragile to handle that, then maybe he's not the right one for us. Ramsey has, for lack of a better term, been shit on fairly heavily in terms of things that are detrimental to a person's psyche.

[MTK]

If Ramsey's confidence is broken by some healthy competition then we don't need a player like him on the team.

I'm sure this example is going to be brought up alot in the coming months and it already has, but look at how Brees responded in San Diego. The Chargers basically left him for dead and were all set to rebuild with Rivers, but Brees responded by working his tail off in the offseason and went out and had a Pro Bowl season.

Once Ramsey stopped pouting last year he seemed to respond pretty well to the presence of Brunell, and look where it got him, instead of continuing to pout all year he was ready when called upon late in the season and he is now the starter for 2005.

Going through last year should enable him to handle the presence of Campbell just fine.