What must Jim Zorn accomplish this season to keep his job?

[Skinny Tee]

I think that it is crazy that people are considering this Zorn's make or break year when he hasn't even had the time to coach his rookie draft class to a second season.

The only way you can consider this a make or break year for Zorn is if you had expectations for the Skins to hire a big name coach after Gibbs left.

We never should have had Zorn as a head coach in the first place if that is the case.

[Nflnick11]

Well the chargers owner fired martty after he went 14-2 but lost his first playoff game, and I would say that dan snyder is a more impatient owner than the chargers owner so that's why I say JZ has to win a playoff game to keep his job, paintrain..

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by Nflnick11

Well the chargers owner fired martty after he went 14-2 but lost his first playoff game, and I would say that dan snyder is a more impatient owner than the chargers owner so that's why I say JZ has to win a playoff game to keep his job, paintrain..

Again what current evidence do you have to say DS is a more impatient owner? I don't really know SD that well, but Marty's firing at SD was absolutely crazy. Gibbs went 5-11 after reaching the playoffs, then reached the playoffs BARELY and could have received an extension, yes he was JG but if DS was as impatient as people make him out to be, why would JG have survived 2 non playoff seasons???

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Skinny Tee

I think that it is crazy that people are considering this Zorn's make or break year when he hasn't even had the time to coach his rookie draft class to a second season.

The only way you can consider this a make or break year for Zorn is if you had expectations for the Skins to hire a big name coach after Gibbs left.

We never should have had Zorn as a head coach in the first place if that is the case.

Let's say this season is a total disaster. I don't see that happening but for the sake of this discussion let's say they go 5-11 or worse. In that situation could you not see Zorn being on the hot seat especially if someone like Holmgren is sitting out there?

[ronnieo]

Joe Gibb's had three super bowls! Zorn has what? Unless he makes the Super Bowl or goes 12 and 4 he is out. Its not right but DS will not be able to resist the temptation of going after Cower, Holmgren, Shanahan, or Gruden, heck maybe even Parcells!!!!!!!! Jerry Jones and DS will be in a bidding war for one of these coaches......

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Let's say this season is a total disaster. I don't see that happening but for the sake of this discussion let's say they go 5-11 or worse. In that situation could you not see Zorn being on the hot seat especially if someone like Holmgren is sitting out there?

Holmgren would never take the job if we fired Zorn though. Shanahan or Gruden would take whatever they can get.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by ronnieo

Joe Gibb's had three super bowls! Zorn has what? Unless he makes the Super Bowl or goes 12 and 4 he is out. Its not right but DS will not be able to resist the temptation of going after Cower, Holmgren, Shanahan, or Gruden, heck maybe even Parcells!!!!!!!! Jerry Jones and DS will be in a bidding war for one of these coaches......

So 10-6 or 11-5 won't be good enough?

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

A former player (WR) who joined the Redskins later in his career told me that Turner was a great offensive mind who was completely overmatched as a head coach. He said Norv was way too timid and nice of a guy to be a head coach but he would always be a great coordinator.

Way overmatched. He has never been able to control his players, not in Washington, from what Jerry Rice has said-not in Oakland, and who knows about San Diego. He couldn't multi-task, had limited knowledge of what any unit beyond offense (and really just the passing game) was doing. It's one thing to delegate, like Gibbs did. But at least Gibbs was involved and aware of what was happening across the entire team. Norv was Spurrier-esque in his involvement, or lack thereof. He had no sense of what it meant to "rally the troops" or other intangible qualities necessary to be a head coach. He lost a lot of respect, what little he still had, when he barely gave Westbrook a slap on the wrist after the Stephen Davis incident. He let several veteran superstars (Hall of Famers) walk all over him, and in many cases divide the locker room. Honestly, he and Spurrier were just totally clueless. The difference was that Spurrier didn't seem to care. I think Norv cared but just was way in over his head. Maybe he's improved now, but he was a total joke here.

I hope Zorn doesn't follow the same path.

[MTK]

Zorn doesn't seem to be cut from the Spurrier/Norv mold. Of course it may be too early to tell but he seems to be too smart to go down that same road.

[dmek25]

if all of that is true about Norv, then how in the hell does he keep getting jobs? being a nice guy only goes so far...

[CRedskinsRule]

Getting the job relies on interviewing, and explaining the circumstances of his "failures". Every indication is Norv is a good guy, and cares. He is one of those guys whose potential exceeds what he has shown so far. I think it is called the Peter Principle where someone goes one step higher than they are really qualified for.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by dmek25

if all of that is true about Norv, then how in the hell does he keep getting jobs? being a nice guy only goes so far...

I don't get it either. My only guess is that he's improved. But I think more realistically what happens is he goes from head coaching failure to successful coordinator and GMs/Owners see the successful coordinator, not the head coaching failure.

He's kept a good Chargers team afloat. Although they've gone from 14-2 in Marty's last year to 11-5 to 8-8 the past two seasons. But it's not like you can give Turner the Detroit head coaching job and expect him to turn it around.

[BringBackJoeT]

Originally Posted by dmek25

if all of that is true about Norv, then how in the hell does he keep getting jobs? being a nice guy only goes so far...

I think it's fair to say that there was pretty much universal shock when he was offered the Chargers' position, and not just a few people rationalized it as being AJ Smith's way of sticking it to Marty just a little bit more (Marty not only succeeded Norv in Washington in 2001, but he was also given the head coaching job in San Diego in 2002 after Norv served as the Chargers' offensive coordinator the year before). Of course, one would think Smith is too smart a guy to have hired a coach solely for spite, but there is also little doubt that the acrimony that had developed between him and Marty reached a level uncommon even in the high-pressured NFL FO world.

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Zorn doesn't seem to be cut from the Spurrier/Norv mold. Of course it may be too early to tell but he seems to be too smart to go down that same road.

Yeah, Zorn is a nice guy, but apparently he can really crack the whip when it's necessary. Not the case with Norv and especially Spurrier. Apparently his control of the locker room, or lack thereof, was a total joke.

[KLHJ2]

Has anyone said "Play racquetball with Dan Snyder" yet? I'm just curious.