Battle for first place Skins vs Gints pregame thread

[KI Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

All 4 wins, his qbr was over 70. the losses were all less than 60. Even acknowledging the drops against the Pats, if this team had consistent average to good QB play we would be in first place probably by 1 to 2 games.

Except for the elite QB's, virtually no QB is consistently at 60 or above in QBR. So I don't think Kirk's efficiency is why we aren't in first place.

Quick, without looking at their numbers beforehand, name two QB's who you think are consistently good (not elite) QB's and then we'll look up their week-to-week QBR's. I wouldn't mind looking up the numbers.

I'll be honest and admit it if I'm wrong about that.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by KI Skins Fan

Except for the elite QB's, virtually no QB is consistently at 60 or above in QBR. So I don't think Kirk's efficiency is why we aren't in first place.

Quick, without looking at their numbers beforehand, name two QB's who you think are consistently good (not elite) QB's and then we'll look up their week-to-week QBR's. I wouldn't mind looking up the numbers.

I'll be honest and admit it if I'm wrong about that.

One guy from Each Division - not really saying good or bad, just a comparison sample. It's amazing the lack of good qb's overall.
Nick Foles questionable, but hard division to choose from
Eli Manning
Jay Cutler
Matt Ryan - hard to choose an average qb in that division
Blake Bortles
Alex Smith
Joe Flacco
Ryan Tannehill


I didn't look stats for them. My main point is that KC's issue has been and still is wild swings. I think this team would win with a qb who constantly performed in the average + range, but right now we have a Jekyll and Hyde guy.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

One guy from Each Division - not really saying good or bad, just a comparison sample. It's amazing the lack of good qb's overall.
Nick Foles questionable, but hard division to choose from
Eli Manning
Jay Cutler
Matt Ryan - hard to choose an average qb in that division
Blake Bortles
Alex Smith
Joe Flacco
Ryan Tannehill


I didn't look stats for them. My main point is that KC's issue has been and still is wild swings. I think this team would win with a qb who constantly performed in the average + range, but right now we have a Jekyll and Hyde guy.

I started to pull names, but let me just do it this way. Below is each week, and the number of qb's that week that had an ESPN Total QBR rating of 60+

Wk 1, 12
Wk 2, 16
wk 3, 14
wk 4, 18
wk 5, 9
wk 6, 17
wk 7, 13
wk 8, 14
wk 9, 17
wk 10, 9
wk 11, 10
link to week 11, you can select all others from there.
NFL Total Quarterback Rating - National Football League - ESPN

So, asking for a consistent above 60, is probably asking that a qb be consistently slightly above middle of the pack. I agree for the Skins that might be shooting too high

[KI Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

One guy from Each Division - not really saying good or bad, just a comparison sample. It's amazing the lack of good qb's overall.
Nick Foles questionable, but hard division to choose from
Eli Manning
Jay Cutler
Matt Ryan - hard to choose an average qb in that division
Blake Bortles
Alex Smith
Joe Flacco
Ryan Tannehill


I didn't look stats for them. My main point is that KC's issue has been and still is wild swings. I think this team would win with a qb who constantly performed in the average + range, but right now we have a Jekyll and Hyde guy.

I compared the QBR’s of the QB’s you suggested to those of Kirk Cousins. For ease of comparison, I grouped their game by game performances in four tiers: Tier 1 = 70.0 or Above, Tier 2 = 50.0 to 69.9, Tier 3 = 30.0 to 49.9, Tier 4 = 29.9 to 0.0. This should give some idea of each QB’s consistency. Not all QB’s have played the same number of games.

You said that Kirk is wildly inconsistent. I said that he is no more inconsistent than any other good but not elite QB. I think these numbers prove my point, if QBR means anything.

You also said that it might be too much to ask for to have a Redskins QB with a 60.0 QBR. Kirk is already at 58.7 YTD and improving, IMO. I don't see any reason why he can't go over 60.0 by the end of the season.

Kirk Cousins

T1 = 4, T2 = 2, T3 = 3, T4 = 1. YTD QBR = 58.7. High QBR = 83.4. Low QBR = 23.2

Kirk’s trends most closely resemble Eli’s and Cutler's except that their highs are higher. There were at least 7 dropped passes in his lowest QPR game vs. NE.

Eli Manning

T1 = 4, T2 = 2, T3 = 3, T4 = 1. YTD QBR = 68.6. High QBR = 94.1. Low QBR = 23.0

Jay Cutler

T1 = 4, T2 = 1, T3 = 2 T4 = 1. YTD QBR = 65.4. High QBR = 90.2. Low QBR = 29.6

Matt Ryan

T1 = 2, T2 = 4, T3 = 4 T4 = 0. YTD QBR = 63.5. High QBR = 93.0. Low QBR = 36.0

Steadiest QB of the group. No very bad games but also fewer very good games than Eli, Jay, and Kirk.

Blake Bortles

T1 = 3, T2 = 1, T3 = 4 T4 = 2. YTD QBR = 54.1. High QBR = 89.8. Low QBR = 11.9

Probably the least consistent of the group.

Alex Smith

T1 = 3, T2 = 2, T3 = 3 T4 = 2. YTD QBR = 54.0. High QBR = 97.9. Low QBR = 7.4

On the surface, Alex looks to be thoroughly average but he’s had a lot of swings in his QPR. He’s not very consistent.

Joe Flacco

T1 = 1, T2 = 4, T3 = 1 T4 = 4. YTD QBR = 40.9. High QBR = 75.4. Low QBR = 8.6

Poor Joe. Terrible season ending with a knee injury. Didn’t get much help.

Ryan Tannehill

T1 = 1, T2 = 3, T3 = 1 T4 = 5. YTD QBR = 33.3. High QBR = 94.2. Low QBR = 9.7

Ryan is just a terrible pro QB.

Nick Foles

T1 = 1, T2 = 2, T3 = 2 T4 = 4. YTD QBR = 33.0. High QBR = 81.9. Low QBR = 1.5

Nick can’t be as bad as Tannehill, can he?

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by KI Skins Fan

I compared the QBR’s of the QB’s you suggested to those of Kirk Cousins. For ease of comparison, I grouped their game by game performances in four tiers: Tier 1 = 70.0 or Above, Tier 2 = 50.0 to 69.9, Tier 3 = 30.0 to 49.9, Tier 4 = 29.9 to 0.0. This should give some idea of each QB’s consistency. Not all QB’s have played the same number of games.

You said that Kirk is wildly inconsistent. I said that he is no more inconsistent than any other good but not elite QB. I think these numbers prove my point, if QBR means anything.

You also said that it might be too much to ask for to have a Redskins QB with a 60.0 QBR. Kirk is already at 58.7 YTD and improving, IMO. I don't see any reason why he can't go over 60.0 by the end of the season.

Kirk Cousins

T1 = 4, T2 = 2, T3 = 3, T4 = 1. YTD QBR = 58.7. High QBR = 83.4. Low QBR = 23.2

Kirk’s trends most closely resemble Eli’s and Cutler's except that their highs are higher. There were at least 7 dropped passes in his lowest QPR game vs. NE.

Eli Manning

T1 = 4, T2 = 2, T3 = 3, T4 = 1. YTD QBR = 68.6. High QBR = 94.1. Low QBR = 23.0

Jay Cutler

T1 = 4, T2 = 1, T3 = 2 T4 = 1. YTD QBR = 65.4. High QBR = 90.2. Low QBR = 29.6

Matt Ryan

T1 = 2, T2 = 4, T3 = 4 T4 = 0. YTD QBR = 63.5. High QBR = 93.0. Low QBR = 36.0

Steadiest QB of the group. No very bad games but also fewer very good games than Eli, Jay, and Kirk.

Blake Bortles

T1 = 3, T2 = 1, T3 = 4 T4 = 2. YTD QBR = 54.1. High QBR = 89.8. Low QBR = 11.9

Probably the least consistent of the group.

Alex Smith

T1 = 3, T2 = 2, T3 = 3 T4 = 2. YTD QBR = 54.0. High QBR = 97.9. Low QBR = 7.4

On the surface, Alex looks to be thoroughly average but he’s had a lot of swings in his QPR. He’s not very consistent.

Joe Flacco

T1 = 1, T2 = 4, T3 = 1 T4 = 4. YTD QBR = 40.9. High QBR = 75.4. Low QBR = 8.6

Poor Joe. Terrible season ending with a knee injury. Didn’t get much help.

Ryan Tannehill

T1 = 1, T2 = 3, T3 = 1 T4 = 5. YTD QBR = 33.3. High QBR = 94.2. Low QBR = 9.7

Ryan is just a terrible pro QB.

Nick Foles

T1 = 1, T2 = 2, T3 = 2 T4 = 4. YTD QBR = 33.0. High QBR = 81.9. Low QBR = 1.5

Nick can’t be as bad as Tannehill, can he?

Good stuff. Thanks

Sent from my S6 Edge

[skinsfaninok]

Eli owns the skins, he's always played great against us. Hopefully that changes sun

[punch it in]

Cam Newtons total QBR is 58.5. Moral of the story is - QBR is stupid.

[skinsfaninok]

Qbr is a dumb stat that espn only uses. Nobody cares about it

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

Qbr is a dumb stat that espn only uses. Nobody cares about it

my points are still valid if you use QB Ratings,
one point was KC has problems with the Giants
KC against the Giants using QB Rating:
61.2
57.6
31.8
____________

The next point was that we would be in first place if we had a reliable consistent NFL QB
In 4 wins, Kirk's QB Rating : 110.3,91.8, 124.7, 158.3
in 6 losses, Kirk's QB Rating :68.8, 69.8, 69.7, 57.9, 68.4, 89.2

Winning either the Miami game or Giants game would have put us in 1st, winning both would have us with a 2 game lead.

_____________

Finally the 3rd point I said was that using QBR a > 70 score was a direct correlation to a win. The Panthers game breaks that a little, because while you could say >90 qb rating is a direct correlation to a win, no one is going to say that if KC had completed 2 more passes, or thrown one more TD, (either of which would give him a 90 qb rating, that we would have won that game.

[skinsfan69]

Giants don't have a good defense. We are at home and I expect us to move the ball and play better than last week.

[Chico23231]

Enough of cousins....what about the running game? This where our problem lies on offense. For one:, commitment and scheme...two: blocking, three: production by the backs and finally the fumbling problem

This needs to be fixed yesterday...

[30gut]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

Enough of cousins....what about the running game? This where our problem lies on offense. For one:, commitment and scheme...two: blocking, three: production by the backs and finally the fumbling problem

This needs to be fixed yesterday...

If past performance tells us anything then I would hope the staff realizes they've got to run the ball better to win this game.

But I'm not holding my breath on that....Jay will proly put the game in Kirk's hands....maybe this is the breakthrough game?

[skinsfaninok]

Yeah we started the season running great then it just stopped. If we can't run Sunday we won't win. This is the game of the season for us, if we win I believe we win the east.

[HailGreen28]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

Yeah we started the season running great then it just stopped. If we can't run Sunday we won't win. This is the game of the season for us, if we win I believe we win the east.

Is it a case of our line getting hurt, or teams started keying in to our run/figuring our plays?

[30gut]

Originally Posted by HailGreen28

Is it a case of our line getting hurt, or teams started keying in to our run/figuring our plays?

I think keying in/figuring out is the culprit. Imho the run game struggles have more to with being out coached, out game planned and beaten by the defensive playcalling.