Report: Shanahan to DC done deal

[Redskin Warrior]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

Cowher has more playoff games to work with in the scenario because he actuall WON playoff games and could ummm... whats the word?... ADVANCE in the playoffs. Shanahan had just as many "opportunities" yet he didn't capitalize on them. Cowher got BETTER as his career progressed. Shanahan got worse.

Cowher must have been very special to the Rooney family it took him what 15 years to win a Super Bowl. Most coaches don't get that long and only have 1 Super Bowl Ring & 2 AFC Championships.

[SFREDSKIN]

Cowher and Shanahan are pretty comparable, Shanahan being offensive minded and Cowher defensive minded. Shanahan won 2 SB's with Elway, Cowher lost one with Neil O'Donnell and won one with Rothlisberger.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by Redskin Warrior

Cowher must have been very special to the Rooney family it took him what 15 years to win a Super Bowl. Most coaches don't get that long and only have 1 Super Bowl Ring & 2 AFC Championships.

And I think it is fair to say he would not get that here. Shanahan has a higher upside out of the gate, and knows DS and BA and can work with them. Cowher would come here like a raging maniac and tear the team down, DS would get antsy and we would be right back to where we were with Marty. IF this franchise is going to work, there has to be cohesion and understanding of proper roles. I think Shanahan showed far more ability to work with what Bowlen wanted, and that allowed Bowlen to trust him. Cowher simply came into a family that believed in stay the course and we will win. And he did eventually. We are not a "stay the course" franchise. We need a coach and GM who DS respect completely, and who can talk to him clearly. I think that makes MS a better fit here, even if BHA's statistics show Cowher to have had a marginally better career.

[mredskins]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

And I think it is fair to say he would not get that here. Shanahan has a higher upside out of the gate, and knows DS and BA and can work with them. Cowher would come here like a raging maniac and tear the team down, DS would get antsy and we would be right back to where we were with Marty. IF this franchise is going to work, there has to be cohesion and understanding of proper roles. I think Shanahan showed far more ability to work with what Bowlen wanted, and that allowed Bowlen to trust him. Cowher simply came into a family that believed in stay the course and we will win. And he did eventually. We are not a "stay the course" franchise. We need a coach and GM who DS respect completely, and who can talk to him clearly. I think that makes MS a better fit here, even if BHA's statistics show Cowher to have had a marginally better career.

Nice post.

[Trample the Elderly]

Originally Posted by SBXVII

Shanahan:



Cowher:



I don't get the facination of Cowher over Shanahan. Their records are similar?

During play offs Cowher has a .75% and Shanahan has a .625%. So Cowher also played more games. roughly about 10 more games during the regular season and 8 more in play off situations. Cowher has 8 more games to work with in the play offs he should have a better % then Shanahan. During regular season Cohwer had a .615% and Shanahan had a .650%. Cowher had like 10 more games. He should have a better % but didn't during the regular season.

Shanahan has won 3 SB's


Cowher won 1 SB


Shanahan was in 5 championship games in which they won:


Cowher was in 2 championship games:


I love all the fluff for Cowher but I really don't see that the difference is all that great but if you ask me Shanahan has more playoffs and SB's. Am I missing something? One would think you go with the best coach, the coach that has a better chance of taking you to the playoffs, one that has been there more often, and the one that has won more? But to grasp at anything to be able to play Cowher as being the better HC people say Shanahan only did it with a pro bowl QB or a Hall of Fame QB. Nice. I hope you guys can come up with a better arguement then that. Dan Marino is a Hall of Fame QB and he has not won a SB. So I guess all of his coach's sucked.

I'm warming to the idea of Shanahan. I'm atleast giving it the idea it will work. As opposed to Zorn which I was unsure about and a lot of people were all excited about cause he was supposed to be the no name up and commer. The next JG's. Yeah.

Compared to Zorn, I'll take those numbers. Flip a coin.

[tryfuhl]

Well if the coaches were the only element in the game we could really break it down. However, it's not a 1 on 1 sport between coaches, so we'll just have to see.

[SmootSmack]

BHA, are you taking into account times when Shanahan's Broncos won the division and earned a bye while Cowher's Steelers had to play a Wild Card game? I mean to me that's essentially a playoff win (with an asterisk) when you earn a bye.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

BHA, are you taking into account times when Shanahan's Broncos won the division and earned a bye while Cowher's Steelers had to play a Wild Card game? I mean to me that's essentially a playoff win (with an asterisk) when you earn a bye.

I'm not getting into that level of detail. I didnt break down playoff wins/losses. I broke down regular season wins/losses and playoff results.

Its a "what have you done for me lately" league. What Shanahan did almost 20 years ago is about as relevent to what Joe Gibbs 1.0 did.

What we should all be most concerned about is what did they each do in their past 3-10 years, because it most closely resembles what we could expect here.

Last 3 years
Cowher - 43-14 (0.708) in the Regular Season. Playoff Runs: 2. Results: 1 Loss in the AFC Championship Game, 1 Superbowl Championship.

Shanahan 24-24 (0.500) in the Regular Season. Playoffs Runs: 0.

Last 10 years
Cowher - Playoff Runs: 6. Results: 2 Losses in the AFC Divisional Game, 3 Losses in the AFC Championship Game, 1 Superbowl Championship.

Shanahan - Playoff Runs: 4. Results: 3 Losses in the Wild-Card Round, 1 Loss in the AFC Championship Game (to the Steelers).

Based on their recent records, with Shanahan, we can expect to make the playoffs less than half the time. When we do make the playoffs, it'll be as a wild-card and 75% of the time we'll lose in the wild-card round. Basically, Shanahan in Washington should feel A LOT like Gibbs 2.0. If that's good enough for you, then I guess we just have different hopes and expectations for our team.

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

I'm not getting into that level of detail. I didnt break down playoff wins/losses. I broke down regular season wins/losses and playoff results.

Its a "what have you done for me lately" league. What Shanahan did almost 20 years ago is about as relevent to what Joe Gibbs 1.0 did.

What we should all be most concerned about is what did they each do in their past 3-10 years, because it most closely resembles what we could expect here.

Last 3 years
Cowher - 43-14 (0.708) in the Regular Season. Playoff Runs: 2. Results: 1 Loss in the AFC Championship Game, 1 Superbowl Championship.

Shanahan 24-24 (0.500) in the Regular Season. Playoffs Runs: 0.

Last 10 years
Cowher - Playoff Runs: 6. Results: 2 Losses in the AFC Divisional Game, 3 Losses in the AFC Championship Game, 1 Superbowl Championship.

Shanahan - Playoff Runs: 4. Results: 3 Losses in the Wild-Card Round, 1 Loss in the AFC Championship Game (to the Steelers).

Based on their recent records, with Shanahan, we can expect to make the playoffs less than half the time. When we do make the playoffs, it'll be as a wild-card and 75% of the time we'll lose in the wild-card round. Basically, Shanahan in Washington should feel A LOT like Gibbs 2.0. If that's good enough for you, then I guess we just have different hopes and expectations for our team.

I didn't realize Shanahan's success as a head coach happened almost twenty years ago. I thought this was 2010, not 2020?

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by skinsguy

I didn't realize Shanahan's success as a head coach happened almost twenty years ago. I thought this was 2010, not 2020?

Ok, i'll be more specific. 1997 and 1998. Guess thats what? 11 and 12 years ago? (Admittedly not 20, but more than 10). Since then, Shanahan hasn't done anything impressive. Cowher on the other hand, had most of his success in his most recent 10 years.

If you look at their two careers, they appear to be going in different directions. Cowher - UP, Shanahan, Down.

Originally Posted by wolfeskins

i don't know for sure,but i would have to think that the defenses by each team during those years had something to do with their final records. niether shanny nor cower should be blamed or praised for their teams defense. they were head coaches not dc's.

The head coach is JUST as responsible for the teams defense as he is the offense, so i don't get your point here. If we were talking about offensive or defensive coordinators, then it would make sense to compare how their individual units performed. The head coach is responsible for results: coaching a team that can win football games and go to the playoffs.

I say enough of this time wasting argument. Shanahan is the Redskins next Head Coach. Just deal with it and be thankful we're getting a head coach who has had success in the NFL in the last decade or so.[/QUOTE]

Shanahan hasn't had success in the last decade and thats my problem with him. He's been on a downward spiral since elway retired. To his credit, his offense were always good and he's been researching the NFLs successful franchises during this past year. IMO shanahan won't succeed here unless he sticks to coaching his side of the ball and entrusts the defense to an agressive defensive coordinator. Shanahan's defenses have been very poor historically, otherwise he would still be coaching in denver.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

Ok, i'll be more specific. 1997 and 1998. Guess thats what? 11 and 12 years ago? (Admittedly not 20, but more than 10). Since then, Shanahan hasn't done anything impressive. Cowher on the other hand, had most of his success in his most recent 10 years.

If you look at their two careers, they appear to be going in different directions. Cowher - UP, Shanahan, Down.

BHA, another way to look at that, is that Cowher took a long time to get his team set up the way he wanted it, again, he won't get that here. Shanahan took an existing team and got it functionally better, that is a better model for what we want. Shanahan Sr won't be coaching for 10 years here, maybe 5 at most, and then he will pass the torch to his son, IF everything goes good. It will be a better longterm solution.

I am confident that I am looking at it with rose colored glasses, and if in the end its another fiasco, i'll be ticked, but I believe these changes are going to bring the Redskins franchise out of the NFL doghouse, and I am glad about that. Cowher wouldn't do that, I don't think. I think he would come in and fight DS and in the end he would leave and our franchise would be in worse shape. But I can acknowledge that is pure speculation, and that if he was coming here, I would probably be supporting the move as much as I do Shanahan's (hopefully) imminent hiring.

[wolfeskins]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

The head coach is JUST as responsible for the teams defense as he is the offense, so i don't get your point here. If we were talking about offensive or defensive coordinators, then it would make sense to compare how their individual units performed. The head coach is responsible for results: coaching a team that can win football games and go to the playoffs.

all i'm saying is you can't give a head coach too much credit or too much blame for his success in the nfl. true some coaches are better than others but it takes more than just a good hc to make the playoffs year after year and to be able to compete for a super bowl.

you act as if cower is a better coach than shanny just because the steelers were a bit more succssful.

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

Ok, i'll be more specific. 1997 and 1998. Guess thats what? 11 and 12 years ago? (Admittedly not 20, but more than 10). Since then, Shanahan hasn't done anything impressive. Cowher on the other hand, had most of his success in his most recent 10 years.

Yeah, 11 and 12 years ago doesn't equal 20 years ago. Nice try.

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

If you look at their two careers, they appear to be going in different directions. Cowher - UP, Shanahan, Down.

And looking at the whole body of work from either coach, Shanahan has more Super Bowls. Has only had two seasons that were below .500. While Cowher may or may not have a better winning percentage, it took him his whole career to win one Super Bowl. Mike turned the Broncos around in a short time and turned them into Super Bowl Champions.

[wolfeskins]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

I'm not getting into that level of detail. I didnt break down playoff wins/losses. I broke down regular season wins/losses and playoff results.

Its a "what have you done for me lately" league. What Shanahan did almost 20 years ago is about as relevent to what Joe Gibbs 1.0 did.

What we should all be most concerned about is what did they each do in their past 3-10 years, because it most closely resembles what we could expect here.

Last 3 years
Cowher - 43-14 (0.708) in the Regular Season. Playoff Runs: 2. Results: 1 Loss in the AFC Championship Game, 1 Superbowl Championship.

Shanahan 24-24 (0.500) in the Regular Season. Playoffs Runs: 0.

Last 10 years
Cowher - Playoff Runs: 6. Results: 2 Losses in the AFC Divisional Game, 3 Losses in the AFC Championship Game, 1 Superbowl Championship.

Shanahan - Playoff Runs: 4. Results: 3 Losses in the Wild-Card Round, 1 Loss in the AFC Championship Game (to the Steelers).

Based on their recent records, with Shanahan, we can expect to make the playoffs less than half the time. When we do make the playoffs, it'll be as a wild-card and 75% of the time we'll lose in the wild-card round. Basically, Shanahan in Washington should feel A LOT like Gibbs 2.0. If that's good enough for you, then I guess we just have different hopes and expectations for our team.

i don't know for sure,but i would have to think that the defenses by each team during those years had something to do with their final records. niether shanny nor cower should be blamed or praised for their teams defense. they were head coaches not dc's.

[Bucket]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

I'm not getting into that level of detail. I didnt break down playoff wins/losses. I broke down regular season wins/losses and playoff results.

Its a "what have you done for me lately" league. What Shanahan did almost 20 years ago is about as relevent to what Joe Gibbs 1.0 did.

What we should all be most concerned about is what did they each do in their past 3-10 years, because it most closely resembles what we could expect here.

Last 3 years
Cowher - 43-14 (0.708) in the Regular Season. Playoff Runs: 2. Results: 1 Loss in the AFC Championship Game, 1 Superbowl Championship.

Shanahan 24-24 (0.500) in the Regular Season. Playoffs Runs: 0.

Last 10 years
Cowher - Playoff Runs: 6. Results: 2 Losses in the AFC Divisional Game, 3 Losses in the AFC Championship Game, 1 Superbowl Championship.

Shanahan - Playoff Runs: 4. Results: 3 Losses in the Wild-Card Round, 1 Loss in the AFC Championship Game (to the Steelers).

Based on their recent records, with Shanahan, we can expect to make the playoffs less than half the time. When we do make the playoffs, it'll be as a wild-card and 75% of the time we'll lose in the wild-card round. Basically, Shanahan in Washington should feel A LOT like Gibbs 2.0. If that's good enough for you, then I guess we just have different hopes and expectations for our team.

That's total nonsense. It's a team effort, and it's the whole organization that builds a team. Not just the head coach. Just because coach A was successful on one team, or not successful. Doesn't mean that he won't be successful on another.

How many coaches have won superbowls or made the playoffs for one team, and failed to deliver in another?

I'm happy that Shanny is going to be our new coach. I'm excited to see the run game be established again in D.C.