Who called the 2nd timeout?

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

We're going to have to agree to disagree, I guess. Maybe because I consider guys like Pollin, Czaban, Doc Walker local media even though they are national as well. And the fans? Hardly sympathetic.

I mean I keep hearing about how tough it's been all week for the players, for Williams. How they left it all on the field. But...well I've hardly heard anything about that for Gibbs, and I just don't believe for one minute anyone would have given him any credit for a win.

I agree that it was a boneheaded move on his part, but I hope that Redskins fans and the media aren't so narrow minded as to continue to blame everything single mistake on him. It may seem like I go overboard to defend Gibbs, but sometimes I have to just to balance out all the absolute hate there is towards him.

As a fan I want him back next year. But as a friend (of a friend of a friend of a friend, etc.) I think he deserves better than to be involved with this organization and its fans.

Smoot, sometimes I do think you go overboard in defending Gibbs. But you know what? I can't really blame you. Gibbs is such a great man who has bought so much joy to alot of us his first go around. He's a quality human being. I could never boo the man as some fans did yesterday. But as some have said it comes with the territory. He gets more credit for the first go around than I think he deserves. No one ever talks about Ritchie Pettibone, who was one of the best DC's of all time. If there was a HOF for assistants he would be a first ballot. People rarely mention Bobby B. And no one, I mean no one credits Charley C. for getting the players ( Tim Johnson, Matt Millen, Eric Williams, Fred Stokes, Jason Buck, Jumpy Geathers, I'm sure I'm mssing a few) on plan B in 89 & 90 to help the 91 team win the SB. It's all Gibbs. He got in the HOF because of the people that were around him, as well as him being a great heach coach. I'm not knocking him in anyway but that's the truth. The HC, like the QB gets too much credit for winning and too much blame for losing.

The 2nd TO yesterday was awful, but people are just plain old stupid if they think that cost us the game.

[skinsfan69]

One call or play never wins or loses a game. The defense gave up a terrible play over the middle to let Buff get in FG range. But I can't blame the defense. They gave up 15 points. That sould be good enough to beat a team starting a rookie qb w/ a no name rb.

I give the team a pass. I mean it's just not fair to judge this team anymore with everything that's going on. Honestly, I just want the season to end.

[Luxorreb]

It is unfair to blame this loss on Gibbs.
Sure a mistake might have led to the loss, but that mistake happened many, many times by many people on the Redskins today. The OL gave up 2pts and didn't give Portis or JC much time or help in trying to put up points.
The defense under horrible circumstance held the Bills with no TDs.
Before people call for the head of Joe Gibbs perhpas they should step back and look at the big picture. Gibbs is not the problem, but I still believe he'll be a huge part of the solution.

[RedskinPete]

Time out or not sorry but Gibbs is our hope. He is just like us. This hole ST thing has us all not on the right page. This team needs to look at out O and D lines! That is where all good or great teams started. We have a few nice players but most are other teams left overs! We also need to get young good players and stay away from the older player looking for that last kill pay day!

[djnemo65]

I feel for Gibbs, but that has got to be one of the absolute dumbest things I have ever seen. I'm sorry, I know it's an emotional day, but in a season filled with clock management failures this is the low point. Everybody knows that rule. I just can't believe it.

Yeah we should have stopped them, moved the ball in the second half, scored TD's not FG's in the first, fine fine fine. But to not understand that rule, to make that mistake with the whole season on the line, is simply inexcusable.

[bedlamVR]

Okay I am going to admitt for a minute after the game I felt the same way as the majority here i said to my wife "i don't know how the team dares to wear the 21 patch they were an insult to his name"
Then I thought ... just a second, and I felt how the team must be fealing. In the post game PC Smoot who i thought played a blinder of a game being real physical and tras:h talking said

"sometimes i cried when I looked back at the safety possition not seeing Sean there"

And that has to tell you something about the way the team was playing . They have to bury not only a teamate but a friend tomorrow and yes it would have been great to 'win the game for Sean' but would that have brought him back ... in the bigger picture it is just a game .

[bedlamVR]

Also from the post today :

washingtonpost.com

"Unsure about the rules regarding the use of timeouts in an attempt to "freeze" a place kicker, Gibbs said he consulted an official along the sideline, asking whether he could call another timeout after the one he had used a moment earlier, before Buffalo's Rian Lindell sent the ball through the uprights from 51 yards away. Regardless of what the official told Gibbs, his decision to call consecutive timeouts in that situation led to a 15-yard penalty. "

[Sammy Baugh Fan]

Every Coach in the NFL but just 1 fails every season. If you don't win the Super Bowl you failed. Period.

I think Gibbs is human and makes mistakes but he is the best thing that has happened to this team in a Decade and there is no one I can see to replace him with that would be any better.

He will be back next year as Coach and I want him back. After Coaching I "think" he was promised a part of the Team and the position of President of Football Operations or something like that. He ain't going anywhere.

Hail Skins
mike

[Paintrain]

My only question to the staunch Gibbs supporters is, if this was ANYONE else who has posted the record he has in the past 4 years, with the team playing like they do, making time management gaffes and with the current state and direction of the team, would you be be calling for a change-yes or no?

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

My only question to the staunch Gibbs supporters is, if this was ANYONE else who has posted the record he has in the past 4 years, with the team playing like they do, making time management gaffes and with the current state and direction of the team, would you be be calling for a change-yes or no?

I'll be honest....I'm not sure. In 2004 the defense was spectacular, but the offense and the record were putrid. In 2005, the offense was actually decent (ranked 11th), the defense was solid, and the record was very good. In 2006, we were simply all-around bad. In 2007, although the coaches have made some bad decisions, but I still feel that player execution (e.g., JC throwing untimely picks) has been less than ideal. I would keep the entire coaching staff intact and give them another year, hoping that JC's experience would bring good things and that we would not have so many injuries next season. If things didn't turn around in 2008, I'd probably want a new coach.

But, the fact is that our coach is Gibbs. What is our team without Gibbs? I don't know, but if it were not for him I might be a mod on Wizards board.

[redsk1]

I'm a big longtime JG fan. I've been critical of him but I was always positive about him turning this team around. A couple weeks ago i wanted him to come back for his 5 season too.

I've been pushed to the other side of the fence now and have to come to the realization that I'd like to see JG gone after this season. Not neccessarily b/c of the "2nd timeout" but b/c of the overall lack of any sort of balls.

You have a game where the bills have been successful moving the ball in the second half, playing against a team w/ a great fg kicker, and playing w/ a defense that it emotionally spent w/ many injuries. Oh yeah, and we've been averaging 2 yards a rush all game. Sooooo...why don't we actually try to WIN THE GAME instead of trying to run the clock down and have the bills use their timeouts. I am so sick of seeing this game over and over again. Its like groundhog day. I bought tix for $150/each, paid $8 for a beer , and so on to see a coach scared to lose.

Remind yourselves this is the Bills. We were at home. I'm not upset at the players as they were emotionally spent. I wanted us to win this game for them. I'm just sad that it didn't happen. As for the coaching staff...we've been seeing this for awhile now and it has to change. You can't win in the NFL. I think its time to move on.

[MTK]

Sorry if this has already been mentioned but what's up with the fact that Gibbs asked the ref if he could take back to back timeouts and the ref said yes??

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Sorry if this has already been mentioned but what's up with the fact that Gibbs asked the ref if he could take back to back timeouts and the ref said yes??

It's not the referee's job to educate a head coach on the rules.. It's like asking 'can I hold the DE if I get beat?' Sure you can hold him if you want, but I'm gonna flag you for holding.

Guys, no matter how we want to spin it, that was an unexcusable error. You have to know the rules, flat out.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

It's not the referee's job to educate a head coach on the rules.. It's like asking 'can I hold the DE if I get beat?' Sure you can hold him if you want, but I'm gonna flag you for holding.

Guys, no matter how we want to spin it, that was an unexcusable error. You have to know the rules, flat out.

The ref shouldn't have responded then. Just seems odd that he would say yes, a little misleading if you ask me. Coaches ask refs for clarification of the rules all the time. Don't get me wrong Gibbs is still responsible, but it's still worth discussing why the ref told him yes.

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

The ref shouldn't have responded then. Just seems odd that he would say yes, a little misleading if you ask me. Coaches ask refs for clarification of the rules all the time. Don't get me wrong Gibbs is still responsible, but it's still worth discussing why the ref told him yes.

I don't see why it's worth disucssing. It's not his job to educate coaches on the rules.. Asking for clarification is one thing, but asking on something absoulte is inexcusable.

Playing devils advocate, let's say Gibbs asked and the ref told him it was a penalty and he doesn't call it and Lindell missed the kick short. After the game, Gibbs says 'I was going to call the second timeout but the official reminded me it would be a 15 yard penalty so I didn't call it. Thanks to him, we probably won the game!' Can you imagine the firestorm coming out of Buffalo this morning? That's why the ref has to respond directly to the question asked, not offering anything more than 'yes, you can.'