Redskins "Low-balling" Hall (Allegedly)

[redskinjim]

we need to keep him whatever it takes give him the money vinny you ignorant peabrain

[SouperMeister]

While I want Vinny to re-sign Hall, I want it to be at a discount. He doesn't deserve anything that remotely approaches Asante Samuel money - he's not that good. And anyway, that's the price Hall must pay for being a knucklehead in Atlanta. He is somewhat of a risk, so I see this as a reasonable first offer. The minute the Danny overpays someone, we're quick to jump all over the FO. This type of prudence is a nice change if we can bring Hall in at a good value.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by redskinjim

we need to keep him whatever it takes give him the money vinny you ignorant peabrain

Of course, if we give him whatever it takes and he tanks then you'll just call cerrato an ignorant peabrain for signing Hall

[44ever]

He definatly is no Asante. So dont compare them. But he is the guy with the youth and the skills that the Redskins need. I don't think he would lay down after being paid. Why would he? That can be said of any player. I'm not sure why were afraid of him. He's also not afraid to come off his man to make or assist in tackles. Personally I like what I see from Hall. Offer him 14M Sign him and move on.

[Hog1]

Perhaps an easier question might be. If we do not do a deal with him, who will we look to the will be a better fit/value, etc?

[44ever]

Originally Posted by Hog1

Perhaps an easier question might be. If we do not do a deal with him, who will we look to the will be a better fit/value, etc?

Hog. The thing is Hall wants to be a Redskin he has said that many times. I don't see anyone else out there with his potential (available). Now some will argue this I'm sure but it's my opinion. He has a quickness and agressivness to him that reminds me of a young Deion Sanders. Before you say "what" he's no Deion. I grew up with Deion same town and played schoolyard football with him many times. So I know what a young Deion played like up close.

This guy with the right coaching can be something great.

[Hog1]

Originally Posted by 44ever

Hog. The thing is Hall wants to be a Redskin he has said that many times. I don't see anyone else out there with his potential (available). Now some will argue this I'm sure but it's my opinion. He has a quickness and agressivness to him that reminds me of a young Deion Sanders. Before you say "what" he's no Deion. I grew up with Deion same town and played schoolyard football with him many times. So I know what a young Deion played like up close.

This guy with the right coaching can be something great.

That having been said, I would consider you an authority on Deion! I am in agreement with you as I personally do not know of anyone else who gets me very excited.....that we can get a deal done with.....that ALREADY is acclimated to the team?
Get a "good" deal done....move on to "the line"

[SOUL-SKINS]

To me keeping Los and signing Hall is as important as our Oline and Dline problems at this point.

[44ever]

Originally Posted by Hog1

That having been said, I would consider you an authority on Deion! I am in agreement with you as I personally do not know of anyone else who gets me very excited.....that we can get a deal done with.....that ALREADY is acclimated to the team?
Get a "good" deal done....move on to "the line"

I don't know about a authority but I can certainly recognize the similarities.

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by 44ever

Hog. The thing is Hall wants to be a Redskin he has said that many times. I don't see anyone else out there with his potential (available). Now some will argue this I'm sure but it's my opinion. He has a quickness and agressivness to him that reminds me of a young Deion Sanders. Before you say "what" he's no Deion. I grew up with Deion same town and played schoolyard football with him many times. So I know what a young Deion played like up close.

This guy with the right coaching can be something great.

Orrrr he could just be saying that repeatedly in public because he knows our track record for overpaying players.

When I think of Hall and Deion the first similarity that comes to mind - they are both terrified of contact.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

FINAL Redskins Defensive Individual Statistics and Awards - Hog Heaven

Or

FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS: Football analysis and NFL stats for the Moneyball era - Authors of Pro Football Prospectus 2008


Basically:

Redskins DeAngelo Hall = one of the best seasons of the year
Raiders DeAngelo Hall = one of the worst seasons of the year
Actual DeAngelo Hall = somewhere close to the average of the two results

Hall was OUTSTANDING during his 4 years in Atlanta.
DeAngelo Hall
He was also selected to the pro-bowl in 2005. If anything, his career shows that he was horribly misused in Oakland, a place where almost no players excel (remember how bad Randy Moss was there?). To say that the real Hall is just the "average" of his performance with two different teams in 2008 is to ignore the entire body of work in his 5 year NFL career.

In addition to being an excellent starting corner in this league, Hall is also durable. He has only missed 2 games in the past 4 years - one was in 2005 and the other was this year, as he was transitioning between two teams. He came to our team and picked up the defense very quickly. By the end of the season, he was our #1 CB and arguably playing better than any redskins cornerback since champ bailey.

I understand that you aren't ga-ga over Hall, but don't sell him short, either. If we extend him, we're not "taking a chance" on a guy whos play has been haphazard. Aside from half a season in Oakland, he's had a stellar career. If resigned here, we have every reason to expect him to be the best, most consistent, most durable cornerback we've had in years. When you have Shawn Springs, Fred Smoot, and Carlos Rogers on your roster, you can count on them either playing poorly in several games or missing large chunks of the season entirely due to injuries. With Hall, you can bank on having him start and play at a high level for every game for the duration of his contract. That "safety" is worth paying a little extra for, dont you think?

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by 44ever

He definatly is no Asante. So dont compare them. But he is the guy with the youth and the skills that the Redskins need. I don't think he would lay down after being paid. Why would he? That can be said of any player. I'm not sure why were afraid of him. He's also not afraid to come off his man to make or assist in tackles. Personally I like what I see from Hall. Offer him 14M Sign him and move on.

If youre referring to me, i didnt compare him to Asante in the sense of saying Hall was definitely just as good of a CB. I used the contract of several CBs and (to me), If Asante got 20M garaunteed, its not unreasonable to think Hall would deserve 16... (Assante and Gamble both benefit greatly from being on teams with a very good pass rush. It stands to reason Hall and our other CBs would get even better if we upgrade our front 7 in the offseason). I also think we would be getting a bargain if we could sign him for 14. Its a negotiation, so it seems reasonable to think that Hall wouldnt ask for 16 if it would really take 16 to make him happy. I'm hoping the two sides can reach an agreement and meet somewhere in the middle. But I hope the skins are willing to be flexible. Our CB situation is way too perilous for us to play hardball. We've got to be willing to budge some from 12.

[44ever]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

If youre referring to me, i didnt compare him to Asante in the sense of saying Hall was definitely just as good of a CB. I used the contract of several CBs and (to me), If Asante got 20M garaunteed, its not unreasonable to think Hall would deserve 16... (Assante and Gamble both benefit greatly from being on teams with a very good pass rush. It stands to reason Hall and our other CBs would get even better if we upgrade our front 7 in the offseason). I also think we would be getting a bargain if we could sign him for 14. Its a negotiation, so it seems reasonable to think that Hall wouldnt ask for 16 if it would really take 16 to make him happy. I'm hoping the two sides can reach an agreement and meet somewhere in the middle. But I hope the skins are willing to be flexible. Our CB situation is way too perilous for us to play hardball. We've got to be willing to budge some from 12.

Not at all in fact I agree with you 100% when it comes to Hall. All I'm saying is he doesn't need to be Asante to get paid what he's worth. And he's worth 16M

[Ruhskins]

I'm glad to see Vinny being careful with these negotiations. The Redskins have had many cap issues over the past years and have had a history of overpaying players and getting into huge contracts that financially cripple the team. I'm sure the Vinny haters are going to pounce if we do not get Hall (even though they are probably the same ones that complain about the huge signings and free agent spending). I do hope and I think we're going to get Hall signed.

I think if Hall takes a hometown discount, it would show that his attitude has changed. I mean Sean Taylor was not a model citizen, but he changed his ways. Let's hope the same thing is happening to Hall. Also, re-signing him to a reasonable price would help us in acquiring other players that are needed to fill the needs that the team has.

[KLHJ2]

My opinion (not that anybody cares) is that we obviouslly need to keep the guy. I do not know about that "at any cost" thing, but we almost cannot afford to lose him without picking up another CB else where.

Shawn Springs (as many have already pointed out) is past his prime and often injured. Many believe that he is the best corner on our team. Based on what exactly? Oh, congrats he locked down T.O. until he had to leave the game with an injury. Then Carlos picked up his slack. He is not worth his paycheck.

Carlos Rogers is (IMO) the best corner on the squad. He is even keel. He will defense any teams best reciever week in and week out. He will not get the intercecptios, but he rarely allows the big play either. The FO and others on this site should be ashamed for considering letting him go for draft picks. In reality you would not get more than 2 picks for the guy, and you would have to use one of them to attempt to replace him. It's not worth it.

Fred Smoot...I have a soft spot for Smoot, I really do. The reality is however that he is not the CB he used to be. The only reason that he should stay is because of depth and experience. I would hate to think what would happen if there wasn't a Fred Smoot to play in front of a Justin Tryon. Smoot may give up some plays at times but he unlike Springs can actually take the field most of the time. He can also be valuable to the team in terms of helping the younger guys out. He doesn't fly off to Texas in the middle of the week.

Justin Tryon...do not get me started. He has alot to learn and his youth alone gives him another shot at the squad in the offseason.

So as you can see if we do not keep Hall we are going to be in a world of hurt at the CB position. Especially if we trade Rogers. Everybody saw what our defense was like in the 4th quarter this past season...giving up big plays and not getting off of the field. We already have a suspect D line. If we compound that with a weaker secondary, then our defense will really be frustrating to watch when the game is on the line.