Hall of Fame Class of 2012

[SFREDSKIN]

Originally Posted by Leader In Sports

How can you say Martin and Bettis are a "weak class"?

I am also not a Parcells fan. Look when he had real success - he had the HC in NE on his staff. When Bill B wasn't there, Parcells was average at best.

Parcell belongs there, he beat the shit out of Bill Walsh more than once in the playoffs and almost killed Joe Montana.

[Leader In Sports]

Originally Posted by freddyg12

The Tuna won 2 super bowls in NY, went to another in NE, got the jets competitive, built a good team in Dallas that was competitive, & built a decent roster in Miami, though that's hard to see now.

I know Parcells had Belicheck for part of his career, but if you use that logic you can always downgrade anyone's success & Parcells had success w/out Belicheck.

Yes, his 2 Super Bowls in NY and 3rd in NE, who was by his side as DC? Belicheck. When Belicheck wasn't there - what did Parcells do? Bill B was HC in Cleveland from 91-95. How many Super Bowls did Parcells go to then?

He made the playoffs in Dallas but got no where. Miami wasn't any better. Parcells only real success happened not because of Parcells.

[Giantone]

Originally Posted by Leader In Sports

Yes, his 2 Super Bowls in NY and 3rd in NE, who was by his side as DC? Belicheck. When Belicheck wasn't there - what did Parcells do? Bill B was HC in Cleveland from 91-95. How many Super Bowls did Parcells go to then?

He made the playoffs in Dallas but got no where. Miami wasn't any better. Parcells only real success happened not because of Parcells.

Then why did'nt Belichick do well in Cleveland ?Your argument does'nt stand up ....at all.

[CrustyRedskin]

Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN

Parcell belongs there, he beat the shit out of Bill Walsh more than once in the playoffs and almost killed Joe Montana.

They knocked Montana out twice Burt got him once in 87 and Marshall in 90 they were both brutal hits. That Marshall hit would have sent me to ER.

Burt vs Montana - YouTube

Leonard Marshall knocking Joe Montana out! 1990...

[Leader In Sports]

Originally Posted by Giantone

Then why did'nt Belichick do well in Cleveland ?Your argument does'nt stand up ....at all.

If memory serves, Belichick was starting to get that team turned around and then Modell announced the move to Baltimore and it fell apart.

Even if my memory is off on that, Bill B had success without Parcells, but Parcells hasn't done squat without Bill B.

edit: Heck, how many playoff games has Parcells won without Bill B on his staff? I bet you they could be counted on 1 hand.

[MTK]

Parcells gets in and deservedly so. Just stop with the nonsense.

[Hog1]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

Parcells gets in and deservedly so. Just stop with the nonsense.

^^^^^^^^

[Leader In Sports]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

Parcells gets in and deservedly so. Just stop with the nonsense.

I agree Parcells will get in, but don't think it is nonsense. I actually got turned onto this fact from several former players who suggested I look it up.

[MTK]

It's nonsense.

[Leader In Sports]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

It's nonsense.

No disrespect intended, but I have stated some facts to back up my argument. While it is not a popular position, it is based in fact. Bill B was the DC of ever successful Parcells team. When Bill B was not on staff, Parcells teams were average to slightly above average.

Saying my position is nonsense without backing it up with facts is in fact "nonsense".

[MTK]

It reminds me of the take that Walsh only won because of Montana and Rice.

You can make these types of arguments all day with just about anyone. A little too nitpicky for me personally.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN

Bobby Beathard hands down!!

7 SB appearances with 4 different teams, responsible for 4 SB wins (Chiefs, Dolphins, Redskins 2x).

I agree. BB should get some serious consideration. That 81 draft might be one of the best of all time.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

Parcells gets in and deservedly so. Just stop with the nonsense.

Not so sure about that. To me he's on the fence.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by Leader In Sports

To illustrate your point, was anyone at the 49ers game where Chris Hanburger got his ring at half time and started off by thanking Snyder for the courtesy he had shown Chris?

DS has done a lot of GREAT things. A lot of nice charity stuff, he did a lot for #21's family by giving 500k to Sean's daughter, he's been great to some of the old Redskins, given money to Children's Hospital and so on. But he hasn't won and has also shit on the fans. Don't want to turn this into a Snyder bitch fest, but there's no comparison between Cooke and Snyder. Cooke will ALWAYS be loved by the fans. Not only cause he won but because of his charisma and personality.

[Leader In Sports]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

It reminds me of the take that Walsh only won because of Montana and Rice.

You can make these types of arguments all day with just about anyone. A little too nitpicky for me personally.

Well, Rice wasn't with Walsh for the first SB (I believe without looking up). Also, Walsh wasn't with 2 teams with Montana. Remember, Bill B was the DC of the Pats for 1 year, and that was THE year for them. Also, as soon as Bill B left the Giants for the Browns, the Giants did not go back to the big one.