Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Redskins vs. Dolphins)

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

I don't think there's a coaching staff out there who would look good with this roster. There are legitimate criticisms: Whiffing on McNabb, thinking that Beck or Grossman had a chance to be effective... but even then you have to ask what the options were. Kevin Kolb? Throwing every draft pick you have at the Bengals for Carson Palmer? I just don't know.

I still maintain that what we're seeing now is a natural progression for a franchise in the state that it's in. A 3-13/4-12 type season was bound to happen after 12 years of incompetence and dysfunction. There isn't a collection of front office or coaching professionals that I know of who would have fared any better at this point.

But we were a 6 win team last year with even less of Mike's personnel moves on the team. It's a clear regression. We have the worst offense in the national football league.

[SirClintonPortis]

Originally Posted by GMScud

I agree with your disagreement. We have a bevy of young draft picks in the fold, and another chunk of picks upcoming in this years draft. We're in good shape with the salary cap, and we don't have a lot of money tied up in older players right now. We're getting younger.

However, I'm beginning to lean towards Mike Shanahan not really being too much of a positive right now. Hiring Kyle is looking like a mistake, and he's totally wet the bed at the QB position. But I do think there is reason for optimism in the coming seasons IF IF IF we land a blue-chip QB.

Kyle's brain is still in Houston and his playcalling still reflects that at times.

But at the same time, one aspect of the Redskins offense is difficult to pin on him, at least imo. That aspect is the red zone offense. Most of our redzone scores have either been passes or 1 yard TD runs. A lack of a big possession receiver like Colston or Burress and an Oline that doesn't emphasize pure strength is going to result in that under most coordinators, imo.

[mredskins]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I disagree...but this is the smackdown thread and you're entitled to your opinion.

but honestly just in the time that this site has been up and I have been here for quit awhile, have we seen a new coach come in and nothing changes. I hope it does but history tells me not to hold my breath.

And let me add I was not looking for a Super Bowl run or a playoff run this year, I would have just like to seen us won more games than last year, doesn't look like at it at this point.

[Beemnseven]

On Matt Hasselbeck -- would the results be any different? He still would have sub-par protection from the O-line, no running game, and absolutely zilch from the receivers.

Substitute any QB you want; Carson Palmer, Kevin Kolb, Matt Moore, ... Then you ask yourself if any of these guys are the QB of the future for this team? If anybody else were remotely more effective, wouldn't that just mask the true state of this team?

[SmootSmack]

I think the notion that Mike isn't involved at all in the offense is flawed. He is very involved, but it's Kyle's offense to run. And it will run just fine with a competent and consistent QB. Beck is neither, Grossman is just one of the two.

Selecting a QB (at least one) is of utmost importance. Doesn't necessarily mean a first rounder. They could go the Bengals 2011 draft route.

[mlmpetert]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I think the notion that Mike isn't involved at all in the offense is flawed. He is very involved, but it's Kyle's offense to run. And it will run just fine with a competent and consistent QB. Beck is neither, Grossman is just one of the two.

Selecting a QB (at least one) is of utmost importance. Doesn't necessarily mean a first rounder. They could go the Bengals 2011 draft route.

But thats true with any offense.

I know youre a big Kyle Shanahan fan, but how would you rank his play calling and game planning? I guess i dont really know what you see in him.

[SouperMeister]

Originally Posted by mlmpetert

But thats true with any offense.

I know youre a big Kyle Shanahan fan, but how would you rank his play calling and game planning? I guess i dont really know what you see in him.

Papa John's should affectionately rename their Monday special "The Kyle" - a plain cheese pizza since they almost never have to throw in free toppings on account of our no-show offense.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by SouperMeister

Papa John's should affectionately rename their Monday special "The Kyle" - a plain cheese pizza since they almost never have to throw in free toppings on account of our no-show offense.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by mlmpetert

But thats true with any offense.

I know youre a big Kyle Shanahan fan, but how would you rank his play calling and game planning? I guess i dont really know what you see in him.

Well that's why QB is so important. Someone has to be able to execute the game plan and we don't have that person. Put Aaron Rodgers here and put John Beck in Green Bay and they're not 9-0 and we're not 3-6.

I think KS is inconsistent and I think it's in large part to a) not having a QB he's comfortable with and b) not settling on a secure rotation (though some of those decisions may not be entirely his own).

But I see an offense that gets guys open. That has the potential to move down the field with relative ease, yet there's no conductor for this symphony.

I don't think he has to what it takes, not yet at least, to be a head coach so I wouldn't hope he become our next head coach. But I think he has what it takes to coordinate an offense.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Well that's why QB is so important. Someone has to be able to execute the game plan and we don't have that person. Put Aaron Rodgers here and put John Beck in Green Bay and they're not 9-0 and we're not 3-6.

I think KS is inconsistent and I think it's in large part to a) not having a QB he's comfortable with and b) not settling on a secure rotation (though some of those decisions may not be entirely his own).

But I see an offense that gets guys open. That has the potential to move down the field with relative ease, yet there's no conductor for this symphony.

I don't think he has to what it takes, not yet at least, to be a head coach so I wouldn't hope he become our next head coach. But I think he has what it takes to coordinate an offense.

I see that he gets guys open, too. But someone who designs nice pass plays is a "play designer," not "offensive coordinator." To be the latter also requires play calling and scheming which is suitable to your talent.

I am not on the "fire Kyle" bandwagon. But to me, this year he has been a great play designer but poor offensive coordinator.

[mlmpetert]

Originally Posted by Lotus

I see that he gets guys open, too. But someone who designs nice pass plays is a "play designer," not "offensive coordinator." To be the latter also requires play calling and scheming which is suitable to your talent.

I am not on the "fire Kyle" bandwagon. But to me, this year he has been a great play designer but poor offensive coordinator.

This is the way i see Kyle too; more as a play designer and not a complete coordinator.

Because Kyle doesnt game plan to exploit an opponent’s weaknesses, and combined with our offensive play and some of the questionable play calling weve seen i think its fair to assume that Kyle also doesnt call plays based on our own teams strengths and weaknesses. Its almost like we could only see Kyles offense come to full fruition if he was in a highly talented vacuum, like coaching the probowl or playing Madden. But while his offensive philosophy make work in vitro when you take it out in the field it seems to stumble.

I agree that the QB is the most important player on the field and that if we were able to switch Grossman for Aaron Rodgers our offense would instantly look better and Greenbay’s would immediately be worse. But I think Green Bay would do things differently with Grossman under center to mitigate the drop-off in talent, while I see Kyle calling the same players with Rodgers that he has with McNabb/Grossman/Beck/Grossman. NFL rosters and positions are dynamic and I think the best coordinators are too.

Im not on the fire Kyle bandwagon either, but i am for Mike taking controll over the offense and/or demanding that Kyle do things differently.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by Lotus

I see that he gets guys open, too. But someone who designs nice pass plays is a "play designer," not "offensive coordinator." To be the latter also requires play calling and scheming which is suitable to your talent.

I am not on the "fire Kyle" bandwagon. But to me, this year he has been a great play designer but poor offensive coordinator.

Practical brilliance at work here Lotus, although I think you give Kyle too much credit as a play designer as we've faced some truly awful defenses and been totally unable to execute one big play...shit even the lowly Rams guided by a backup QB can manage that one big play a game where you sit up and yell. Not Kyle though.

I think it's also worth mentioning the Texans' offense has improved since he left. Kyle is a playbook guy at best.

[skinsfan69]

More smack needs to go to MS and KS. Do either of these clowns know how to have the team run a hurry up offense? I just don't get it. Really starting to lose all faith in MS.

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

More smack needs to go to MS and KS. Do either of these clowns know how to have the team run a hurry up offense? I just don't get it. Really starting to lose all faith in MS.

A hurry up offense? You want us to go 3 and out quicker and provide even less of a breather for the D?

There isn't a coach alive today you'd have faith in with the time so far allowed to rebuild this team.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

A hurry up offense? You want us to go 3 and out quicker and provide even less of a breather for the D?

There isn't a coach alive today you'd have faith in with the time so far allowed to rebuild this team.

Jim Schwartz.