Mike Shanahan

[SolidSnake84]

I don't think Shanahan has done a GREAT job. I think he has done a better job than anyone before him in the sense that he is trying to build a young core group of players who can be dominate for years to come. I think in all fairness he needs to be given one more year to see for sure. This team, as it stands right now, may best case scenario go 8 and 8 next year. We are lacking a franchise QB, and i think that right there makes any other personnell moves null and void until we find him.

One more year for Shanahan with a real QB before we can judge. If we get a QB we could be 10 and 6 or better....

[Beemnseven]

Statistically speaking, the '09 defense was top ten. But that was deceiving. And yardage doesn't tell the whole story. That team couldn't stop anyone when it absolutely had to. It couldn't get consistent pressure on the quarterback and it couldn't get turnovers.

For years this team hung on to players one year too long. In the end, Shanahan probably handled that precisely the right way.

[JWsleep]

Ok, fellas. We can't go back in time. Forget the "magic" 09 defense already.

All this speculation about what a "better" coach could do with our powerhouse team of recent past is crap. I think all these guys are great coaches, but what is Belicheck without Brady? Peyton without Brees? Not as good, oddly enough.

Until we have a serious QB in this town we're not going anywhere. This offseason is make or break for MS because he has to solve this problem. He is going to have to hitch his fortune to an untested rookie and a decent free agent vet (not Rex, please!). If we still have the sort of hopeless QB situation we have now after NEXT season, I doubt the Danny will wait.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by JWsleep

Ok, fellas. We can't go back in time. Forget the "magic" 09 defense already.

All this speculation about what a "better" coach could do with our powerhouse team of recent past is crap. I think all these guys are great coaches, but what is Belicheck without Brady? Peyton without Brees? Not as good, oddly enough.

Belichick won 13+ games with Cassell.

Does Cassell = Flyn?????

[GTripp0012]

To me, it's not nitpicking to say that the 09 and 2011 defenses are statistically similar. I didn't think the 2009 defense was very good. We played six awful offenses in a row to begin that season. And even during that stretch, the defense was hit and miss. The 2009 defense contributed to the amazing streak the Redskins are showing to not handle rookie passers. It couldn't cover receivers. It had the ability to rush the passer and play adequate run defense, which made it a very good defense in terms of getting three and outs, but it had no dimensions to it to stop passers if the opposing quarterback was worth his salt. To me the struggles of the 2009 offense overshadowed the weaknesses of the defense. If that 2009 defense was league average, I think they win 7 games that year.

But it's also not wrong to point out where the 2011 defense failed. It was our best unit for sure between the offense and special teams, but many of its best players were wildly inconsistent (Landry - health, Kerrigan - performance, Bowen and Cofield - lack of domination), and the biggest issue with the 2011 defense is: I'm not sure where you go from here.

Like even the best of the Gregg Williams years, there were some really questionable personnel decisions in building this defense. Why did Rocky McIntosh play more snaps than Keyaron Fox? Because they technically play different positions in the defense? That's a design flaw. Why use Reed Doughty at all if he's going to be so limited as to be an obvious target for an opposing offensive coordinator. Design flaw. A whole season with DeAngelo Hall covering the other team's top target? Design flaw. Misunderstanding the career value of O.J. Atogwe as a free safety? Inexcusable design flaw.

The Redskins defense was at least average this season because it had so many good players to overcome all those flaws. Josh Wilson had a great year. LaRon Landry was very good when healthy. Fletcher is a stud. Perry Riley was a revelation that strengthened the run defense from a weak unit into a strength, giving us depth at ILB going forward. Cofield was quite good most of the year on the nose and is still learning the nuances of his position. Bowen showed a lot of potential (maybe empty potential, but you can see the ability to live up to that huge contract). Chris Neild came on at just the right time early in the season to avoid a year on the PS. Kerrigan was a rookie, and was at least in the running for DROY in most seasons (not this one). Rob Jackson proved himself a better pass rushing option than Lorenzo Alexander.

The 2011 Redskins defense overcame a lot of ills to improve on last year's defense. But you could argue that you take two of those many performances out of this defense and it would have failed to improve on last year, because they didn't really correct the issues that were wrong with the 2010 defense. They just increased the quantity of high-caliber performers.

And the biggest difference from the Blache days is that they improved on gameday in their entire operation. We're not in the 18th century anymore.

With consistently better talent evaluation, this can be an elite unit. But unless they make the right decision on Landry, Hall, Atogwe, McIntosh, Carriker, and most importantly Fletcher, I can't expect the unit to get a lot better. They gave it their all this year, used tons of creative coverages and a couple of nice blitzes, and the elite offenses in this league still pretty much had their way with it.

[That Guy]

josh wilson had a great year? um... he gave up an awful lot of big plays just like hall, and he covered a lot of not #1s.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by That Guy

josh wilson had a great year? um... he gave up an awful lot of big plays just like hall, and he covered a lot of not #1s.

Yes, he did have a great year.

FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS: Innovative Statistics, Intelligent Analysis | An Early Look at 2011 CB Charting


Wilson was in the top 10. Guess who was in the bottom 3 once again?

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

Yes, he did have a great year.

FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS: Innovative Statistics, Intelligent Analysis | An Early Look at 2011 CB Charting


Wilson was in the top 10. Guess who was in the bottom 3 once again?

then why wasn't wilson on the top WRs? would they have just flipped stats at that point?

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by That Guy

josh wilson had a great year? um... he gave up an awful lot of big plays just like hall, and he covered a lot of not #1s.

Josh Wilson did have some negative moments but overall was solid IMO. I'm happy that we have him.

[Hog1]

Originally Posted by Lotus

Josh Wilson did have some negative moments but overall was solid IMO. I'm happy that we have him.

DEFINITELY!
AND he seemed to improve as the season wore on....

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by That Guy

josh wilson had a great year? um... he gave up an awful lot of big plays just like hall, and he covered a lot of not #1s.

Wilson was ok, D Hall was ok. You have to compare like this, it was a solid step down from Carlos. i think both start corners this year were pretty average, the positions in the secondary which were deplorable was our 3rd corner position and our safety coverage play. Lots of decisions to be made in the secondary. You can make a case for cutting Hall, but then you have another hole because no way in hell Barnes or Westbrook have the talent to step into a starters role.

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

Wilson was ok, D Hall was ok. You have to compare like this, it was a solid step down from Carlos. i think both start corners this year were pretty average, the positions in the secondary which were deplorable was our 3rd corner position and our safety coverage play. Lots of decisions to be made in the secondary. You can make a case for cutting Hall, but then you have another hole because no way in hell Barnes or Westbrook have the talent to step into a starters role.

unless you replace him with grimes, who's a FA

[ethat001]

Couple of points:

1) We can't judge our team on wins - yet. -- Ppl have said there has been no improvement over the past 2-3 years. However, I think the two big reasons were:
-- Quarterback MS made the choice to go with Rex & Beck & McNabb, so he deserves all the blame for this. But Rex had 20 interceptions and 5 fumbles playing only 13 games. No other QB in the LEAGUE turned the ball over more -- 1.9 turnovers per game! (Josh Freeman had 22 / 5 but in 15 games). Note that A.Rodgers had 40% more sacks, but NO fumbles and only 6 interceptions all year. Just saying.
-- Injuries - We were again devastated with injuries/suspensions to T.Williams,FDavis,C.Cooley,Moss,THightower,Landry, Jenkins,Hankerson.. Injuries are part of the game, and the Giants still made the playoffs with tons of injuries, I'm just saying our rebuilding/shallow roster cannot yet handle injuries to all of our top talent. My point here is --> our team is better than our record with a QB that doesn't turn the ball over almost 2 times a game & with above guys returning next year.

2) Our team is getting younger. MS has consistently gone after young talent, builiding for the future. Now we have younger players & better depth at most positions for the upcoming years. In the future, younger players should have less injuries, and the developing depth will help us better handle injuries when they inevitably come.

3) Good draft / FA moves. Kerrigan alone justifies the last draft, but all the rest were solid pickups. Couple of years of drafts like this and we'll be restocked. Cap space.

4) We play the best players, not the highest paid players. MS plays guys that play well regardless of their age/tenure/salary. P.Riley,Gomes, Helu/Royster, Hurt/W.Smith, Neild -- by playing these guys at times over the veterans, it motivates the ppl to play harder, knowing that if they play well or badly, they could get promoted or benched. Different philosophy than allowing Portis to not practice, etc.


It's absolutely clear they're going after a QB next year, they've said it. Many other teams are as well, so they'll have to be aggressive / lucky to get one. A good QB pickup will make this team a playoff contender for years to come, a great QB pickup will make us Super Bowl contenders in 2-3 years. We haven't seen many results, but I think we're headed in a good direction & we should be patient with the rebuilding process for another 1-2 years.

[skinsfaninok]

whats with the Locklear / Shanny beef?

[redsk1]

Mike Shanahan deserves alot of credit for one thing I haven't heard mentioned. Not drafting Blaine Gabbert. The jury is still out on BG but early results haven't been good. There were alot of people who thought we should...i think i did.