Updated: Discuss our Backup QB Situation (formerly Byron Leftwich)

[REDSKIN1]

How many QB's have we give up on in the first few years and they left to be successful on other teams? Frerotte-Green......Campbell?????

[MTK]

Originally Posted by REDSKIN1

I disagree, I don't think Jason has been given ample time to prove his worth. This will only be his third season as the starter and the first time in a system where someone isn't changing the playbook and trying to change the way he drops back and throws the ball. You have to take in consideration the fact that Jim Zorn came in and not only changed the playbook but also the way he wanted Jason to play the position. I think that this year he will show marked improvement.

I agree, but a lot of people don't want to hear stuff like that. They want results yesterday and have become so accustomed to change at the QB spot it just doesn't feel right to stick with one guy for more than a couple of seasons.

[Dirtbag59]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Don't worry about the article. Wilson's source is Michael Lombardi, who had graded Andrew Walter out higher than Jason Campbell when he worked for the Raiders in 2005.

That's pretty much all you need to know about that one.

Well that's not the craziest evalutation in terms of scouting. I mean JC is hands down better then Walter on his worst day in the pro's then Walter is on his best day. However you have to remember that Walter was thought to be a lock for the first round before the 2004 college football season began so I can concieve the possibility that a scout might have graded a guy like Walter over Campbell who at the time was projected to go to the Browns in the early 2nd (Campbell that is) while Walter was flirting with the possibility of being a late second round pick.

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

When, and if, Davis, Kelly, and Thomas come around I wonder what sort of effect that would have on Campbell.

I wonder what it's like for a 6'5" guy to throw to 6'3" guys versus 5'10 guys

Grrrrr more Upside talk, but at least it's concerning 2nd round picks and not some obscure 7th round pick that's going to save our D-Line.

The great thing though about player development, when it works, is that it ends up looking like you got brand new players in the offseason. However unless we get an O-line then the effect those three have on the offense is going to be limited . That is unless JC can summon the Ben Rothesberger in him and extend plays like Big Ben which ironically wouldn't be the worse thing if we end up not getting any new big uglies this offseason, which with Vinny at the healm is a distinct possibilty.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

I agree, but a lot of people don't want to hear stuff like that. They want results yesterday and have become so accustomed to change at the QB spot it just doesn't feel right to stick with one guy for more than a couple of seasons.

Well said. Also worth noting we haven't really had someone who could develop a QB the way Zorn has proven he can. I've got relative confidence in Jason's natural abilities and talent, i've got near total confidence in Zorn's ability to develop his QB.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by Dirtbag359

The great thing though about player development, when it works, is that it ends up looking like you got brand new players in the offseason. However unless we get an O-line then the effect those three have on the offense is going to be limited . That is unless JC can summon the Ben Rothesberger in him and extend plays like Big Ben which ironically wouldn't be the worse thing if we end up not getting any new big uglies this offseason, which with Vinny at the healm is a distinct possibilty.

Don't say that man... don't even think like that.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Don't worry about the article. Wilson's source is Michael Lombardi, who had graded Andrew Walter out higher than Jason Campbell when he worked for the Raiders in 2005.

That's pretty much all you need to know about that one.

Not sure if you know this or not but Andrew Walter is the all time leading passer in Pac Ten history. That's a pretty strong resume considering some of the QB's that have played in the Pac Ten. He had a way better college career than JC did. Lombardi knows his stuff and coming out of college I could've easily saw why people had Walter graded higher than JC.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

Not sure if you know this or not but Andrew Walter is the all time leading passer in Pac Ten history. That's a pretty strong resume considering some of the QB's that have played in the Pac Ten. He had a way better college career than JC did. Lombardi knows his stuff and coming out of college I could've easily saw why people had Walter graded higher than JC.

Off the top of my head, I did not know that, but I remember hearing it from multiple sources.

Most draft analysts did have them ranked together as second round prospects, but the league guys did seem to convincingly prefer Campbell to Walter. Lombardi's opinion seems to be in the vast minority here.

Also, using hindsight, totally incorrect. My problem is more how he's posturing this today, as opposed to objectively grading Campbell, he seems to be hoping that he fails so he doesn't have to explain his evaluation of the two guys in the future. Not dissimilar to the reason I dislike Blache. Being wrong is one thing. Lombardi should just admit it, move on, forget about it. Don't let it affect his evaluations in the future.

But I can see, statistically, how Walter and Campbell actually had similar draft profiles (and how Walter was significantly more productive at the same level), in context of conference. Good point.

[skinsfan69]

If I remember correctly ( and maybe someone can confirm this) the only reason Walter fell in the draft was because he had a shoulder injury his senior year. Otherwise he would've been a high first round draft pick.

[irish]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

Zorn was specifically brought in to develop JC; he only got the HC job because no one else (other than Fassel) wanted it. So the assumption is he would be let go if Campbell failed. If Zorn really beleives he can mold Campbell into the next Matt Hasslebeck, then his fate is tied to Campbells and this is his make or break year as coach. If Campbell succeeds, Zorn will stay. If he doesnt, theyre both gone.

On the other hand, Zorn is in a very tough situation if he doesnt believe in Campbell. At the end of a failed 2009 season, he cant get away with saying "well, i gave it two years, and Campbell didnt work out. now let me use my own guy." Snyder is not that patient. On the flip side, its hard to "give up" on Campbell after just one year in the WCO, considering all the FO invested into drafting Campbell in the first place.

So in the end, Zorn really has only two options if he wants a third year:

1) Work his magic with Campbell and turn him in to a pro-bowl caliber WCO QB by the end of this season; thereby letting the FO know Campbell is the franchise QB and that Zorn succeeded where most said he would fail; OR

2) Convince the FO sometime between now and the beginning of the season that his system works, but Campbell is going to hold it back: Hes a good QB, but isnt adapting in the system. The fans love Brennan and he's the kind of QB Snyder would love - he'd sell jerseys... but hes just not ready yet. So in that scenario, the FO must make the decision on what to do with Campbell.
(a) If they decide to keep him, Zorn can always say "i told you so" at the end of the season if Campbell doesnt work out (in a very nice way, of course). With Brennan primed and ready to go, Zorns got himself his third year.
(b)If they trade Campbell and start someone else in 2009, Zorns still essentially bought himself a 3rd year reguardless of how the team does in 2009, with Brennan as the starter in 2010.

Zorn was brought here as offensive coordinator not QB coach. As an ex QB he would of course work with JC but its a myth that he was brought here specificall to work with JC. JC just doesnt see the field good enough to ever be more that a borderline NFL QB.

[irish]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

I agree, but a lot of people don't want to hear stuff like that. They want results yesterday and have become so accustomed to change at the QB spot it just doesn't feel right to stick with one guy for more than a couple of seasons.

JC has been in the NFL what 5 years and a starter for 2. I'm tired of hearing all this different system stuff. He had more time in Zorn system than Flacco and Ryan (both true rookies) had in theirs. JC has had plenty of time, the best the Skins can hope for is that he will improve a little next year but to expect him to be a pro bowler in 4 years is unrealistic, he will never develop to that level.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by irish

Zorn was brought here as offensive coordinator not QB coach. As an ex QB he would of course work with JC but its a myth that he was brought here specificall to work with JC. JC just doesnt see the field good enough to ever be more that a borderline NFL QB.

Yes, you're entitled to your opinion, but it's still total bullshit that you would say this.

You have no idea if this is true. It's just the only thing you cling to in the hopes that you might be right about Campbell.

I actually think seeing the field is one of his biggest strengths. But what do I know, I've only looked at every play this season twice plus. Clearly, your shot-in-the-dark assumptions are more accurate than this.

[Bushead]

Originally Posted by irish

Zorn was brought here as offensive coordinator not QB coach. As an ex QB he would of course work with JC but its a myth that he was brought here specificall to work with JC. JC just doesnt see the field good enough to ever be more that a borderline NFL QB.

How can people say this? I watched every game this year, but I wouldn't assume Portis took the wrong hole, or that the W Receivers weren't getting open, or that Jason Campbell cannot read the field. The reason: BECAUSE THERE IS NO WAY IN HELL WE KNOW.

How can you tell that kind of thing from a broadcast on T.V. anyways? Your never able to see the whole field to begin with.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Bushead

How can people say this? I watched every game this year, but I wouldn't assume Portis took the wrong hole, or that the W Receivers weren't getting open, or that Jason Campbell cannot read the field. The reason: BECAUSE THERE IS NO WAY IN HELL WE KNOW.

How can you tell that kind of thing from a broadcast on T.V. anyways? Your never able to see the whole field to begin with.

Well, if the point of posting is to say that Jason Campbell is bad, you're not going to point to something that actually happens, obviously. You have to sound convincing without actually knowing what you are talking about.

Geez.

[53Fan]

Well maybe if Zorn did'nt have JC bend his knees he could see the field better! This stuff about Campbell is getting ridiculously funny.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by 53Fan

Well maybe if Zorn did'nt have JC bend his knees he could see the field better! This stuff about Campbell is getting ridiculously funny.

the JC bashing is crazy.