PFT Rumor - Joe Gibbs is Coming Back

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by skinsguy

BINGO!!!! And nobody with a good reputation in the NFL is going to want to come to Washington and put up with that unless they are desperate for work.

I think you guys are being very presumptous that "no one" will come here. I wouldn't be so quick to think that. Snyder has brought a lot of "no ones" here.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

The minute Joe Gibbs decides to return to Redskins Park there will be a presser about the presser; an annoucement about the annoucement. Dan Snyder will then craft same weird, pseudo "president/executive" title for Joe Gibbs that gives the impression that Gibbs is fully vested, but not too involved. Standing side by side at the podium, Gibbs and Snyder tell the press that Gibbs' role will be the architect orchestrating everything from the background, yet delegating to his hand picked head coach and newly minted GM. Following the presser every Redskin interview will be consumed with what they think about the legendary Joe Gibbs coming back to the franchise that is now --and finally -- moving in the right direction. The players follow the script, toe the company line, and are effusive with praise about the entire move. Then we all live happily ever after.

I hate to be Debbie Downer, I really do, but the more I think about Joe Gibbs coming back, in any capacity, the more I don't like it and I'm against it happening. First of all, if Gibbs' family is his priority then, with all due respect, he shouldn't come back to football. Isn't that why he retired the first and second time around? My fundamental question is, and what every Redskin fan should be asking, has that reason changed now that the Redskins are sinking - once again? I'm simply tired of a bunch of off season hype, recycled bodies and ideas, and half-assed results or better yet, no results at all.

For nearly a decade Dan Snyder has been successful at prying away just about every big name and no name free agent, and several coaches to come to Washington. There's no doubt he's a very savvy and results oriented business man. But somewhere in the NFL, right now, there's an active head coach and GM combo that have been laboring in the shadows for years. Now Mr. Snyder needs to go out and find the next Joe Gibbs; find the next Bobby Beathard!

To me this is nothing more than Danny's version of Jerry Jones building that huge complex down in Texas. Great for PR and revenue, but little has changed on the field. We as fans are tired of big flashy titles and the ghosts of past Super Bowls lurking around this franchise. I wish Dan Snyder would tend to his business and let Joe Gibbs tend to his.

A couple of questions

1. What's wrong with enlisting Gibbs to help him find the next Beathard and the next Gibbs?

2. Given the choices who would you most trust (least not trust?) to head up our football operations-Gibbs, Cerrato, or Shanahan?

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

A couple of questions

1. What's wrong with enlisting Gibbs to help him find the next Beathard and the next Gibbs?

2. Given the choices who would you most trust (least not trust?) to head up our football operations-Gibbs, Cerrato, or Shanahan?

I asked the same question to him and he said Cerrato. I'm sure he's alone in those thoughts.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

A couple of questions

1. What's wrong with enlisting Gibbs to help him find the next Beathard and the next Gibbs?

2. Given the choices who would you most trust (least not trust?) to head up our football operations-Gibbs, Cerrato, or Shanahan?

1. Why didn't he do it when he was here during his second stint? He was here four years. He had ample time to either pluck his successor from the ranks or drop some reliable names on Danny. Neither happened. If they didn't deem it important then, what has changed now?

2. I gotta tell you, and this shocks me that I'm even saying this, but Cerrato. I think when you look at the players that Gibbs selected and the ones that Vinny drafted, I really think it's pretty close. I'm talking purely from a talent evaluation standpoint. So then you have to look at the intangibles. Obvisouly Gibbs brings much more to the table in that department. But since he'll supposedly be playing a limited role, how much will his influence actually impact what goes on in the lockerroom or the football field? I fear not very much. Gibbs' influence is best felt and demonstrated up close and personal. That's his magic. Always has been, always will be. He took that same magic to NASCAR and made it work.

Shanahan? Eh, I'm totally indifferent to him one way or another. Take him or leave him.

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

1. Why didn't he do it when he was here during his second stint? He was here four years. He had ample time to either pluck his successor from the ranks or drop some reliable names on Danny. Neither happened. If they didn't deem it important then, what has changed now?

2. I gotta tell you, and this shocks me that I'm even saying this, but Cerrato. I think when you look at the players that Gibbs selected and the ones that Vinny drafted, I really think it's pretty close. I'm talking purely from a talent evaluation standpoint. So then you have to look at the intangibles. Obvisouly Gibbs brings much more to the table in that department. But since he'll supposedly be playing a limited role, how much will his influence actually impact what goes on in the lockerroom or the football field? I fear not very much. Gibbs' influence is best felt and demonstrated up close and personal. That's his magic. Always has been, always will be. He took that same magic to NASCAR and made it work.

Shanahan? Eh, I'm totally indifferent to him one way or another. Take him or leave him.

Honestly it really shouldn't matter. We would hope whoever Gibbs would choose as GM and coach would have the full influence with what happens on the football field and the locker room.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by skinsguy

Honestly it really shouldn't matter. We would hope whoever Gibbs would choose as GM and coach would have the full influence with what happens on the football field and the locker room.

So wait a minute, it seems to me the crux of this argument is that Gibbs will somehow lure a coach and GM here that Snyder can't? Yet Snyder is still owner, has final say, and signs the paychecks? Huh?

This makes absolutely no sense to me. None.

[redsk1]

I keep hearing Doug Williams name in posts. He's been a personel exec at TB since 2004. What exactly are his qualifications? TB hasn't been very good for awhile now. I don't recall their drafts being that great. What's so special about Doug Williams? Is it just the name?

He's drafted Gaines Adams, Talib (good pick), Josh Freeman-the jury is still out in the last few years.

We've all talked about not bringing in someone just b/c he's got a name. Seems like they are younger and more talented guys out there. Thoughts.

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by redsk1

I keep hearing Doug Williams name in posts. He's been a personel exec at TB since 2004. What exactly are his qualifications? TB hasn't been very good for awhile now. I don't recall their drafts being that great. What's so special about Doug Williams? Is it just the name?

He's drafted Gaines Adams, Talib (good pick), Josh Freeman-the jury is still out in the last few years.

We've all talked about not bringing in someone just b/c he's got a name. Seems like they are younger and more talented guys out there. Thoughts.

I agree with you. I, unfortunately don't know enough about up and coming GMs in the NFL to know who else would be the better choice. I definitely would hope for a younger Bobby Beathard type though.

[SFREDSKIN]

Originally Posted by skinsguy

I agree with you. I, unfortunately don't know enough about up and coming GMs in the NFL to know who else would be the better choice. I definitely would hope for a younger Bobby Beathard type though.

Eric DeCosta or Brian Gaines are your young Beathards.

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN

Eric DeCosta or Brian Gaines are your young Beathards.

So there are two names we can work with. Who else?

[SmootSmack]

Well the X factor I guess is Cerrato. Guys like Fassel and Gregg Williams (and who knows who else) couldn't work with Snyder if Cerrato was the third person in the triumvirate. Snyder made the decision to stick with Vinny and it seems to have backfired. Not that Williams or Fassel necessarily would have been the right choice. Anyhow, I suspect no one (except maybe LaVar) would have an issue working with Snyder if Gibbs was the other guy in the equation.

Again, I don't think Gibbs will come back when all is said and done but I think he could be an asset. He does have that ability to influence up close and personal, but he also is a skilled CEO who knows how to step up and properly delegate and reward.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Well the X factor I guess is Cerrato. Guys like Fassel and Gregg Williams (and who knows who else) couldn't work with Snyder if Cerrato was the third person in the triumvirate. Snyder made the decision to stick with Vinny and it seems to have backfired. Not that Williams or Fassel necessarily would have been the right choice. Anyhow, I suspect no one (except maybe LaVar) would have an issue working with Snyder if Gibbs was the other guy in the equation.

Again, I don't think Gibbs will come back when all is said and done but I think he could be an asset. He does have that ability to influence up close and personal, but he also is a skilled CEO who knows how to step up and properly delegate and reward.

The thing I'm against the most about all of this is the fanfare that comes along with the move. It's just impossible to know that Joe Gibbs is somewhere in the building and not think Super Bowl. All the pieces have to be perfectly aligned and snyched for that to be a healthy environment. And the last thing this organization needs is for there to be a disconnect between top brass and the guys playing between the white lines on Sunday.

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

The thing I'm against the most about all of this is the fanfare that comes along with the move. It's just impossible to know that Joe Gibbs is somewhere in the building and not think Super Bowl. All the pieces have to be perfectly aligned and snyched for that to be a healthy environment. And the last thing this organization needs is for there to be a disconnect between top brass and the guys playing between the white lines on Sunday.

I have a feeling that disconnect has already been disconnected long before this conversation ever came up.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Well the X factor I guess is Cerrato. Guys like Fassel and Gregg Williams (and who knows who else) couldn't work with Snyder if Cerrato was the third person in the triumvirate. Snyder made the decision to stick with Vinny and it seems to have backfired. Not that Williams or Fassel necessarily would have been the right choice. Anyhow, I suspect no one (except maybe LaVar) would have an issue working with Snyder if Gibbs was the other guy in the equation.

Again, I don't think Gibbs will come back when all is said and done but I think he could be an asset. He does have that ability to influence up close and personal, but he also is a skilled CEO who knows how to step up and properly delegate and reward.

Seems like the problem was that all the potential options (after Schwartz pulled his name) were very flawed.

Snyder had good options, but he took a very long time in the process, losing some of the better names while waiting for different names.

Sadly, the same indecisiveness may have cost us a chance to salvage the season. The Detroit loss was bad, but we followed it up with a disappointing 1-2, which could have been 3-0 if we had taken a different organizational approach and gave Zorn the vote of confidence when it was appropriate.

Would it have mattered if we were 4-2, but go out this week and lose to the Eagles because they are a better team? I don't think so. This is not a good enough team to make the playoffs. But management really, really made this a bigger mess by waiting. Again.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Seems like the problem was that all the potential options (after Schwartz pulled his name) were very flawed.

Snyder had good options, but he took a very long time in the process, losing some of the better names while waiting for different names.

Sadly, the same indecisiveness may have cost us a chance to salvage the season. The Detroit loss was bad, but we followed it up with a disappointing 1-2, which could have been 3-0 if we had taken a different organizational approach and gave Zorn the vote of confidence when it was appropriate.

Would it have mattered if we were 4-2, but go out this week and lose to the Eagles because they are a better team? I don't think so. This is not a good enough team to make the playoffs. But management really, really made this a bigger mess by waiting. Again.

I agree. And it's why I have lost confidence in DS finally. He just can't make good football decisions. Maybe he is TOO CLOSE emotionally to the Redskins. He tried to be patient for whatever reason. Be it image-related or simply that he thought Zorn just needed time. Either way it was a bad decision. One in a long line of them. I don't lack confidence that DS wants to win more than anything. I doubt his ability to make the right decisions to do so. Wanting and doing are very different things.