T.O. Thoughts

hurrykaine · 02-07-2005, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FRPLG

Yeah i really don't think race has anything to do with it. Favre is held up like he's a warrior god for whatever reason but I am sure it has nothing to do with the fact that he is white.

I'm with you in that I don't see any media backlash against TO or even Moss having to do with racism.

The Brett Favre deal is something different though. Sure, he's a tough guy, and has been christened a warrior since he's the brave sturdy southern boy from Mississippi who braved the cold at Lambeau and led his team to victory almost all the time - but the reason Favre, and Greenbay are idolized and idealized so much is cuz they're the original success story of the league - Lombardi, and his 5 championships in the 60s. In this league, it has become anathema to criticize the Packers, any of their players, or their fans since they represent how pro-football started out..,old-school, blue collar, small-town, hardworking people coaching, playing, and most importantly, watching the game. The NFL wants to be seen as preserving that tradition. All the other NFL success stories have been in bigger cities...Dallas, Pitt, DC, NY, San Fran, LA (Rams), and now Boston. Though Pittsburgh is now a big city, it still has those same blue-collar roots, and the Steelers organization and their fans are pampered in much the same way as Green Bay.

The bottom line is that the GB fans deserved all they got from Moss - it is an unforgivable double standard to condone the GB fans mooning of the visiting team's bus, but penalize players that harmlessly stick it to the GB fans.

I idolize TO for desecrating the Star in Texas stadium. He is a true warrior for the way he played yesterday, but he does need to get that stick out of his ass and get over his persecution complex - no one's criticizing him for yesterday's performance...every member of the media I heard was lauding his effort.

FRPLG · 02-07-2005, 04:40 PM

From what I have seen just about everyone is praising his effort...just not a lot since they didn't win. I think it would be different if they has won. And forgice me if I am being naive here but I don't see any of this having to do with race. There may be institutional racism still lurking throughout the league but I really don't think the media cares if a guy is white black or purple as long as he makes a good story. Maybe TO forgot the two weeks everyone spent reporting on him before the superbowl.

BrudLee · 02-07-2005, 04:48 PM

It occurs to me that Owens has the reputation he has because he couldn't care less what you or I think of him. His (non-football) actions are those of a man who is beyond self-centered. Every thing he does and utterance he makes has to be viewed through the egomaniacal T.O. prism to make sense.

That being said, what he did yesterday had nothing to do with the glorification of T.O., and everything to do with helping his team win. When the game is being played, he is the best receiver in the game, and one of the best players in the game.

This could be the most memorable athletic achievement in my lifetime. This was Jack Youngblood meets Willis Reed - with the added feature of a very good performance. The Eagles lost, and I'm glad, but T.O. did more to keep them in that game than McNabb and Westbrook combined - and he did so at great jeopardy to his career. I think Curmudgeon has set the bar a little high if he wants his "warriors" to equal this feat.

jbcjr14 · 02-07-2005, 04:48 PM

TO, hate em, but you gotta respect his will and desire to play the game.

MTK · 02-07-2005, 05:01 PM

I agree 110% with what TO said, if that was someone like Favre that did that the media would definitely be eating it up.

Instead it's TO and he had to deal with people doubting what his motivations for playing were. I gained a ton of respect for TO yesterday.

JoeRedskin · 02-07-2005, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

I agree 110% with what TO said, if that was someone like Favre that did that the media would definitely be eating it up.

Instead it's TO and he had to deal with people doubting what his motivations for playing were. I gained a ton of respect for TO yesterday.

Yeah, if it had been Farve, the media would have been eating it up. BUT, at least part of the reason for that is that Farve, generally, has never been so arrogant as to not give credit to teammates or opponents and has never flinched from taking the blame when he deserved it.

Owens gets his motivations doubted because of his past behavior. His showboating activities and "look at me!!!" style do not evidence an "I am just trying to help the team" type of athlete. Rather, they, quite naturally, create the impression of an athlete who is more concerned with himself than the team.

If he is doubted, then it is because his past actions have built the chain of doubters link by link. (with apologies to Dickens).

PSUskinsfan11 · 02-07-2005, 05:22 PM

I RESPECT T.O. for playing the way he did yesterday but the whole race issue is awful. If Farve was acting like a piece of shit all the time and then played with the injuries and deaths he went through he would not be praised as much as he has been. Farve is a class guy so the media embraces it when he does things like that where as no one cares about an asshole without the super bowl vistory. Just like to add to whoever said no redskin on the roster has played like a "warrior" Fred Smoot playing with a borken sternum, when he was puking on the sidelines after plays because of the pain that is pretty damn "warrior" like to me especially someone of his size.

firstdown · 02-07-2005, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

I agree 110% with what TO said, if that was someone like Favre that did that the media would definitely be eating it up.

Instead it's TO and he had to deal with people doubting what his motivations for playing were. I gained a ton of respect for TO yesterday.

His past is the only reason people doupted his motivations. I have always respect the mans tallent now I respect his heart to play and win.

saden1 · 02-07-2005, 05:02 PM

WTF? This has nothing to do with race. A lot of people can't stand TO because he is an obnoxious, vain individual and quite a showboat. Still, what he did yesterday was just shy of amazing. TO works hard and he wants to win. I respect him for that. Without him the game would have been a blowout. Mr. Flinchall and Stinkston would have defiantly stunk up the joint.

JoeRedskin · 02-07-2005, 05:30 PM

As to Skins warriors - Didn't Coles pop a dislocated finger back into its socket and then go out and play. Nobody found out until later 'cause he didn't want to make a big deal about it and didn't want to be taken out of the game.

And just for some reference, Jack Youngblood's comment on Owens injury was something like "6 weeks? Shoot, you could recover from an amputation in that time."

firstdown · 02-07-2005, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

As to Skins warriors - Didn't Coles pop a dislocated finger back into its socket and then go out and play. Nobody found out until later 'cause he didn't want to make a big deal about it and didn't want to be taken out of the game.

And just for some reference, Jack Youngblood's comment on Owens injury was something like "6 weeks? Shoot, you could recover from an amputation in that time."

I remember a game Darrell Green ran to the sidelines after a play held up his hand and and a finger was pointing backwards. The coaching staff popped it back into place and I don,t think he missed a play.

itvnetop · 02-07-2005, 05:35 PM

TO has always impressed me with his play, desire to win, and work ethic. His antics on the field (showboating, dancing, etc) shouldn't command as much attention as it does- not everyone has the same personality and the league is much more interesting with him in it. The NFL may say that it's bad for football, but they're laughing their way to to the bank with all publicity he garners.

He may be a cocky and arrogant guy on the field, but I've never once heard a negative thing about him off the field. In an era where professional players are in the middle of murder scenes, drug deals, and sexual assaults, why is TO the poster boy for being a "bad boy"? Because he's not setting an example for "good sportsmanship"? I think the league has bigger fish to fry than a guy with funny dances.

bedlamVR · 02-07-2005, 06:32 PM

S.C. - any player for any team would have moved heaven and earth to play in the superbowl . I think your glass half empty approch to the Redskin is getting a little old and your disparaging opinion of our roster is getting disrespectful when you say you cannot think of any player wanting to play as much as T.O. . This year alone you have Coles playing with dislocated fingers, his toe problems, you have Thomas comming back from injury for a team no where near the playoffs and it is not just the Redskins last year the browns had one of thier QBs playing with a broken leg who just didn't want to come off the field and replaced they finished worse than us last year record wise.

T.O. is bitching and whinning because he is not being refered to as a warrior like Farve because he came back to play pretty ineffectivly throughout he was covered by a third string rookie for most of the game from a broken leg 7 weeks earlier. Not taking anything away from his recouperative abilities and his desire to play in possibly the biggest game of any players life but i have to say huh ? A warrior asks for no praise, never searches for glory expects nothing but to give his best and that is why T.O isn't refered to as a warrior and it is nothing to do with him being black .. it is to do with him being a showboating egomaniac in the press.

saden1 · 02-07-2005, 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bedlamVR

S.C. - any player for any team would have moved heaven and earth to play in the superbowl . I think your glass half empty approch to the Redskin is getting a little old and your disparaging opinion of our roster is getting disrespectful when you say you cannot think of any player wanting to play as much as T.O. . This year alone you have Coles playing with dislocated fingers, his toe problems, you have Thomas comming back from injury for a team no where near the playoffs and it is not just the Redskins last year the browns had one of thier QBs playing with a broken leg who just didn't want to come off the field and replaced they finished worse than us last year record wise.

LOL….that’s all I’ve got to say.

Monk-Fan · 02-07-2005, 07:03 PM

I have to say that TO really showed a warriors spirit out there last night, although i dont like him he did play well. As far as the race card goes you cant dismiss it as not being a factor to some degree. NFL fans look at him and think "Typical black man", its sad people still think like that but that is the reality. He is 100% correct in making the comparison between him and Favre. If Favre was cocky the media would label him as confident and a fierce competitor that is able to back up what he says. That is the simple truth.

02-07-2005, 04:48 PM	#3
BrudLee Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Rehoboth Beach, DE Posts: 3,494	It occurs to me that Owens has the reputation he has because he couldn't care less what you or I think of him. His (non-football) actions are those of a man who is beyond self-centered. Every thing he does and utterance he makes has to be viewed through the egomaniacal T.O. prism to make sense. That being said, what he did yesterday had nothing to do with the glorification of T.O., and everything to do with helping his team win. When the game is being played, he is the best receiver in the game, and one of the best players in the game. This could be the most memorable athletic achievement in my lifetime. This was Jack Youngblood meets Willis Reed - with the added feature of a very good performance. The Eagles lost, and I'm glad, but T.O. did more to keep them in that game than McNabb and Westbrook combined - and he did so at great jeopardy to his career. I think Curmudgeon has set the bar a little high if he wants his "warriors" to equal this feat. __________________ There's nowhere to go but up. Or down. I guess we could stay where we are, too.

02-07-2005, 04:48 PM	#4
jbcjr14 The Starter Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Austin, Texas Age: 56 Posts: 2,015	TO, hate em, but you gotta respect his will and desire to play the game. __________________ "Work Harder: millions on welfare are counting on you" - Obama 2009 address to Congress.

02-07-2005, 04:40 PM	#2
FRPLG MVP Join Date: May 2004 Age: 47 Posts: 10,164	From what I have seen just about everyone is praising his effort...just not a lot since they didn't win. I think it would be different if they has won. And forgice me if I am being naive here but I don't see any of this having to do with race. There may be institutional racism still lurking throughout the league but I really don't think the media cares if a guy is white black or purple as long as he makes a good story. Maybe TO forgot the two weeks everyone spent reporting on him before the superbowl.

02-07-2005, 05:01 PM	#5
MTK Hail Raiser Join Date: Feb 2004 Age: 53 Posts: 100,048	I agree 110% with what TO said, if that was someone like Favre that did that the media would definitely be eating it up. Instead it's TO and he had to deal with people doubting what his motivations for playing were. I gained a ton of respect for TO yesterday.

02-07-2005, 05:22 PM	#7
PSUskinsfan11 Impact Rookie Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: the port, PA Age: 41 Posts: 692	I RESPECT T.O. for playing the way he did yesterday but the whole race issue is awful. If Farve was acting like a piece of shit all the time and then played with the injuries and deaths he went through he would not be praised as much as he has been. Farve is a class guy so the media embraces it when he does things like that where as no one cares about an asshole without the super bowl vistory. Just like to add to whoever said no redskin on the roster has played like a "warrior" Fred Smoot playing with a borken sternum, when he was puking on the sidelines after plays because of the pain that is pretty damn "warrior" like to me especially someone of his size.

02-07-2005, 05:02 PM	#9
saden1 MVP Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Seattle Age: 46 Posts: 10,069	WTF? This has nothing to do with race. A lot of people can't stand TO because he is an obnoxious, vain individual and quite a showboat. Still, what he did yesterday was just shy of amazing. TO works hard and he wants to win. I respect him for that. Without him the game would have been a blowout. Mr. Flinchall and Stinkston would have defiantly stunk up the joint.

02-07-2005, 05:30 PM	#10
JoeRedskin Contains football related knowledge Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Second Star On The Right Age: 63 Posts: 10,401	As to Skins warriors - Didn't Coles pop a dislocated finger back into its socket and then go out and play. Nobody found out until later 'cause he didn't want to make a big deal about it and didn't want to be taken out of the game. And just for some reference, Jack Youngblood's comment on Owens injury was something like "6 weeks? Shoot, you could recover from an amputation in that time."

02-07-2005, 05:35 PM	#12
itvnetop Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Los Angeles, CA Age: 49 Posts: 3,007	TO has always impressed me with his play, desire to win, and work ethic. His antics on the field (showboating, dancing, etc) shouldn't command as much attention as it does- not everyone has the same personality and the league is much more interesting with him in it. The NFL may say that it's bad for football, but they're laughing their way to to the bank with all publicity he garners. He may be a cocky and arrogant guy on the field, but I've never once heard a negative thing about him off the field. In an era where professional players are in the middle of murder scenes, drug deals, and sexual assaults, why is TO the poster boy for being a "bad boy"? Because he's not setting an example for "good sportsmanship"? I think the league has bigger fish to fry than a guy with funny dances.

02-07-2005, 06:32 PM	#13
bedlamVR Special Teams Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 389	S.C. - any player for any team would have moved heaven and earth to play in the superbowl . I think your glass half empty approch to the Redskin is getting a little old and your disparaging opinion of our roster is getting disrespectful when you say you cannot think of any player wanting to play as much as T.O. . This year alone you have Coles playing with dislocated fingers, his toe problems, you have Thomas comming back from injury for a team no where near the playoffs and it is not just the Redskins last year the browns had one of thier QBs playing with a broken leg who just didn't want to come off the field and replaced they finished worse than us last year record wise. T.O. is bitching and whinning because he is not being refered to as a warrior like Farve because he came back to play pretty ineffectivly throughout he was covered by a third string rookie for most of the game from a broken leg 7 weeks earlier. Not taking anything away from his recouperative abilities and his desire to play in possibly the biggest game of any players life but i have to say huh ? A warrior asks for no praise, never searches for glory expects nothing but to give his best and that is why T.O isn't refered to as a warrior and it is nothing to do with him being black .. it is to do with him being a showboating egomaniac in the press.

02-07-2005, 07:03 PM	#15
Monk-Fan Special Teams Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Abilene, Texas Posts: 151	I have to say that TO really showed a warriors spirit out there last night, although i dont like him he did play well. As far as the race card goes you cant dismiss it as not being a factor to some degree. NFL fans look at him and think "Typical black man", its sad people still think like that but that is the reality. He is 100% correct in making the comparison between him and Favre. If Favre was cocky the media would label him as confident and a fierce competitor that is able to back up what he says. That is the simple truth.

T.O. Thoughts

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