Meet The Candidates: 2012 GOP Thread

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

Keep in mind, I'm stating how I think the Rs will attack Obama on National Security, not that I think it's the best way to go. Precisely because of some counter-arguments that are opened up, specifically like the one you just mentioned.

If it's me running the R campaign, I give credit to Obama for success against Al Qaeda and mention that he's taken plays from the conservative playbook in the War on Terror....and I make it a point to call it that, I point to defense cuts, and point to his limited foreign policy experience in 2008. Then I quickly move on to the poor economy, tax & spend, etc.

True....sidenote with GOP candidates, Im glad Cain is coming back and showing good numbers, not cause i agree with what he is saying, but since the beginning hes been the only one offering tangeble solutions to issues. I thought the R would lean towards more style than substance with with Bachman and Perry. I think that really says people are listening and expecting real solutions this time. So this should wake up the Rs as well as Obama. Its a good sign.

[12thMan]

Obama: 2012 Is Like Basketball, and I Don’t Miss Clutch Shots - ABC News

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

Obama: 2012 Is Like Basketball, and I Don’t Miss Clutch Shots - ABC News

He better hope the economy doesn't continue to give him this:

President Obama Injured In Pick-Up Basketball Game - Business Insider

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

He better hope the economy doesn't continue to give him this:

President Obama Injured In Pick-Up Basketball Game - Business Insider

LOL...that's funny. A buddy works at the WH and I've been dying to ask him who popped Obama in the lip, but we usually stay away from politics.

[12thMan]

So wait, you and SligginSammy have a bet, right? $100? LOL...I can't wait to see who pays up.

[mlmpetert]

I like Obama's foreign policy more than Mitt's, but its the lesser of 2 evils for me as i think they are both pretty bad. I think the problem Obama has is that he has really upset a part of his base by entering into new wars. He has also given off the perception that he is siding with Palestinians’ which hurts his Jewish support.

Also Romney, in particular, will attack Obama on the popular opinion that Obama is and has been publically apologizing for what he views as America's past sins. A lot of Obama's apology tour was exaggerated and in some cases in line with past Presidents, but some of it was very questionable.

Apologies Not Accepted - Investors.com

Like past presidential elections I think America blindly votes for one person or political party over another, although I think the 2008 elections were of particular ignorance. Democrats, Independents and even many Republicans didn’t want a neo-con or anything that reminded them of Bush. After 12 years of Bush and 8 years of Clinton the thought of Hilary seemed better suited for a empire and not a republic. A young, very well educated and incredible articulate speaker that seemed to truly want to transform the way things are done in Washington, paired with the insider Biden who could administer those changes seemed appealing to everyone, policy issues aside. That combined with someone who wanted to end 7 long years of what seemed like a misguided war was a big part of the reason Obama, the brand, became extremely desirable.

A lot of the things that made his brand so popular a few years ago are completely gone. Its not just that people feel like Obama didn’t live up to his hype and they were somewhat short changed, it’s that a lot of people feel that Obama sold out and they were cheated. Obama has no hope whatsoever in energizing those people like he did in 2008, however, many people are energized to vote against anyone who isn’t named Obama. More votes in 2008 may have been cast in ignorance then any prior election, but the amount of people blindly voting for anything but Obama in 2012 may be just as bad.

I don’t think Obama or saden1 has a chance.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by mlmpetert

I like Obama's foreign policy more than Mitt's, but its the lesser of 2 evils for me as i think they are both pretty bad. I think the problem Obama has is that hes really upset a part of his base by entering into new wars. He also has made the public perception that he is siding with Palestinians’ has also hurt a lot of his Jewish support.

I will also add something i think Romney, in particular, will attack Obama on is the popular opinion that Obama is and has been publically apologizing for what he views as America's past sins. A lot of Obama's apology tour was exaggerated and in some cases in line with past Presidents, but some of it was very questionable.

Apologies Not Accepted - Investors.com

Like all presidential elections I think America blindly voted for one person or political party over another, although I think the 2008 elections were of particular ignorance. Democrats, Independents and even many Republicans didn’t want a neo-con or anything that reminded them of Bush. After 12 years of Bush and 8 years of Clinton the thought of Hilary seemed better suited for a empire and not a republic. A young, very well educated and incredible articulate speaker that seemed to truly want to transform the way things are done in Washington, paired with the insider Biden who could administer those changes seemed appealing to everyone, policy issues aside. That combined with someone who wanted to end 7 long years of what seemed like a misguided war was a big part of the reason Obama, the brand, became extremely desirable.

A lot of the things that made his brand so popular a few years ago are completely gone. Its not just that people feel like Obama didn’t live up to his hype and they were somewhat short changed, it’s that a lot of people feel that Obama sold out and they were cheated. Obama has no hope whatsoever in energizing those people like he did in 2008, however, many people are energized to vote against anyone who isn’t named Obama. More votes in 2008 may have been cast in ignorance then any prior election, but the amount of people blindly voting for anything but Obama may be just as bad.

I don’t think Obama or saden1 has a chance.

You raise some fair points. But your statement about Obama's brand being gone is largely media driven and way off the mark. Are Obama supporters as enthusiastic as they were in '08, I don't think so. However the grassroots remains solid. Even in the best of economic times, no policy (foreign or domestic) is without flaws and has the luxury of hindsight. Every president could have done things better or differently. For me, Obama has been largely as advertised. He said change would be difficult, he's been pragmatic, and not overly partisan. For people that would like to see more conservative policies coming out of the White House, well, vote your guy into office. It's really that simple.

Also worth noting that Obama just raised $70 million dollars last quarter and 257,000 of those people were first time donors. That's a quarter of a million new supporters into the fold. Pretty incredible for someone who's brand is suffering. In my opinion those numbers are a good indicator of where he stands with his base of supporters. If Mitt Romney and the GOP are counting on voters abandoning Obama next year, they will most definitely be disappointed.

[12thMan]

ML, our troops will be home by year's end (knock on wood). So what new wars has Obama started?

[mlmpetert]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

ML, our troops will be home by year's end (knock on wood). So what new wars has Obama started?

Libya, Afghanistan and Yemen. Libya is all on Obama. Yemen is too, but only drones were used. We had a presence in Afghanistan pre-Obama but he sent 30k more troops. While troops are starting to come home (against the advice of generals) it will be at least another year before the entire surge he sent comes back, and after that another 75k will remain.

If Obama had limited his involvement to just Afghanistan he probably would easily be able explain himself as just finishing the job Bush had started and that he didn’t want to desert the Afghan people when they needed us most. But he decided that he wanted to get his hands dirty in Libya and Yemen, while ignoring Syria and other middle eastern countries.

Ill admit I have no idea what we are doing in Afghanistan or what 75k will do after we supposedly pull out, or the complications of the Arab Spring and general unrest in the middle east, but unfortunately the same is true for the majority of Americans. But our lack of current foreign policy understanding isn’t necessarily because we don’t care its more because its extremely difficult to understand. Which makes it extremely difficult to defend while extremely easy to criticize. Imo Obama’s screwed when it comes to his foreign policy.

And youre right his brand isn’t gone and he is still adored by many and will get a lot of votes, but there are a lot of people who voted for him and feel completely ripped off. I don’t think the republicans can win with anyone but i think they could win with Cain, Romney, Perry or Newt and maybe Paul or Bachman. Although I think that if Romney, and only Romney, gets the nomination Paul could end up running on a third party ticket and give the election to Obama a la Nader or Perot.

[SBXVII]

Honestly I'm not happy with any of the Republican candidates. I just went looking the other day at each candidate and after a short while gave up thinking our options are either Obama or trash. I'd have taken almost any of the candidates who have declined to run over the candidates who are on the table right now.

Which is why today I went looking and found this......

Petition to Draft Donald Trump for President 2012

and signed the Petition to the right. He did say if there were no decent options he would step up and run.

[SmootSmack]

You want a businessman...but you don't want Mitt?

[SBXVII]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

You want a businessman...but you don't want Mitt?

Personally no. It's my understanding he has endorsed Obama's health care plan. I don't like the plan, so ... I don't like him.

I know I won't find the "perfect" candidate but the health care topic is a biggie for me. I'll pass on Romney.

I do like the fact Cain has the Tea Party behind him but again he just doesn't stand out as Presidential material. I also don't like the whole 999 theory he has.

and lastly lets be honest, the Republican party will throw whoever they think has the best chance of winning against Obama. Common sense I know but the problem is they are letting all the best candidates walk away and simply giving the public crap. So now they are throwing the crap against the wall to see who sticks and then throw all their endorsements into crap, package it up with nice paper and throw a bow on it, leaving the voters to either pick crap vs. crap.

I feel sorry for the Republican party. I'm an Independant and vote for whom I think will be the best candidate, but Republicans must be scratching their heads like me wondering why they are letting better candidates simply opt out.

Bob McDonnell-Virginia
Jeb Bush-Florida
Donald Trump

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by SBXVII

I do like the fact Cain has the Tea Party behind him but again he just doesn't stand out as Presidential material. I also don't like the whole 999 theory he has.

Cain's 9-9-9 plan is just the first phase in moving to the FairTax system. If you haven't read about it, it's worth looking into. It will jump start the economy and reduce the IRS to a small fraction of what it is today. It removes the complexities of the tax code and closes virtually all tax loopholes.

I feel sorry for the Republican party. I'm an Independant and vote for whom I think will be the best candidate, but Republicans must be scratching their heads like me wondering why they are letting better candidates simply opt out.

I'd be comfortable with Romney or Herman Cain, both would do a good job as POTUS. I think Gingrich would do well as POTUS, but he could never win a general election.

[SBXVII]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

Cain's 9-9-9 plan is just the first phase in moving to the FairTax system. If you haven't read about it, it's worth looking into. It will jump start the economy and reduce the IRS to a small fraction of what it is today. It removes the complexities of the tax code and closes virtually all tax loopholes.

I'd be comfortable with Romney or Herman Cain, both would do a good job as POTUS. I think Gingrich would do well as POTUS, but he could never win a general election.

I guess I should look a little more into it but it didn't sound like a "Flat Tax" which I'm all for. Cut the IRS down to small fraction and make sure everyone pays their fair share. Everyone gets hit the same based off of what they earn. No loop holes.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by SBXVII

I feel sorry for the Republican party. I'm an Independant and vote for whom I think will be the best candidate, but Republicans must be scratching their heads like me wondering why they are letting better candidates simply opt out.

Bob McDonnell-Virginia
Jeb Bush-Florida
Donald Trump

I see this upcoming presidential election for the Republicans, the same way it was for the Democrats in 2004. They have an incumbent president that should be easy to beat, but they will put a candidate that the party will "settle for" and lose.