Vinny tips his hand on the final 53

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Fletch has not had the best preseason, but I think it's way too early to assert that he's lost a step. Orakpo does get sealed really easily against the run, and it will probably take 10-12 games to get that ironed out completely. McIntosh is the big question mark.

I have this nagging fear that Fletch will be afflicted with Cris Dishman Syndrome (Dishman, you may not recall, was one of the league's premiere corners in 1997 and then just dropped in 1998)

I do have question marks about Rocky

Love what Orakpo has done, but he is a rookie in a new position

Glenn and Henson (assuming one makes the team) are two more rookies

Chris Wilson to me is still looking like a pass rusher. Dropping back in coverage as a linebacker? He's not there yet

Robert Thomas, assuming he makes the team, is a 1st round bust. I think he can contribute but he is what he is

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I have this nagging fear that Fletch will be afflicted with Cris Dishman Syndrome (Dishman, you may not recall, was one of the league's premiere corners in 1997 and then just dropped in 1998)

Interesting. My only remote recollection of Dishman as a player is from his post-Washington years, in KC and Minnesota. So I PFR'ed him and found some similarities with him and Fletch.

Both posted near-career highs in AV (approximate value) in year n, but I think what seperates Dishman from Fletcher is that his performance in that one year (1997) appears to have been completely out of line with the rest of his career. When he did fall, it was just a little bit past (age-adjusted?) his former productivity. Probably felt like he just got worse overnight, but I imagine that part of that was his unexpected improvement in 1997.

On the other side, one of Fletcher's top comparables through 11 NFL seasons just happens to be Michael Barrow--the year he signed in Washington. Though its worth saying that Fletcher has been a better player throughout his career.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Interesting. My only remote recollection of Dishman as a player is from his post-Washington years, in KC and Minnesota. So I PFR'ed him and found some similarities with him and Fletch.

Both posted near-career highs in AV (approximate value) in year n, but I think what seperates Dishman from Fletcher is that his performance in that one year (1997) appears to have been completely out of line with the rest of his career. When he did fall, it was just a little bit past (age-adjusted?) his former productivity. Probably felt like he just got worse overnight, but I imagine that part of that was his unexpected improvement in 1997.

On the other side, one of Fletcher's top comparables through 11 NFL seasons just happens to be Michael Barrow--the year he signed in Washington. Though its worth saying that Fletcher has been a better player throughout his career.

Some dude once said "STATS ARE IMPORTANT, BUT NOT THE ONLY FACTOR!!!"

Seriously though, Dishman's stats are misleading because, as you're aware, sometimes the best corners have the least impressive stats. Do you think Larry Brown had two interceptions in the Super Bowl against the Steelers because he was some phenom CB...or because he was lined up on the other side of Deion Sanders?

Granted, CD was initially brought here to be a nickel back (and insurance in case Tom Carter left, which he did), but still the drop off was pretty ugly

Interesting side note, a couple of players who played opposite Dishman in Houston and had some good seasons playing opposite him-Steve Jackson and Jerry Gray. I think Gray played just one season in Houston, but Jackson played his whole career in Houston/Tennessee

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Some dude once said "STATS ARE IMPORTANT, BUT NOT THE ONLY FACTOR!!!"

Seriously though, Dishman's stats are misleading because, as you're aware, sometimes the best corners have the least impressive stats. Do you think Larry Brown had two interceptions in the Super Bowl against the Steelers because he was some phenom CB...or because he was lined up on the other side of Deion Sanders?

Granted, CD was initially brought here to be a nickel back (and insurance in case Tom Carter left, which he did), but still the drop off was pretty ugly

Interesting side note, a couple of players who played opposite Dishman in Houston and had some good seasons playing opposite him-Steve Jackson and Jerry Gray. I think Gray played just one season in Houston, but Jackson played his whole career in Houston/Tennessee

I used AV because it (tries) to use unit performance as a base, and divide the credit according to the playing time in the unit. As it goes (and I've yet to verify this elsewhere) Washington probably had excellent pass defense in 1997, but dropped off in 1998 significantly, with Dishman being an obvious example.

There is, of course, a reason the A is for approximate. I'm completely bastardizing the purpose of the stat.

And Al Davis agrees with me that Larry Brown was actually a phenom cornerback, and not some scumbag graduate of Prime U! (Completely kidding. Except the Davis part.)

[BigHairedAristocrat]

On ESPN980, theyre speculating Cartwright and/or ARE will be the surprise veteran cut(s) Vinny and Zorn said may be made.

ARE isnt cuttable until next offseason from a cap perspective (about 4M then), but he's certainly not cuttable now. Besides, it wouldnt even make sense to cut him from a playing perspective, as there arent really any other receivers battling for the 5th WR spot with Mitchell.

Cartwright, on the other hand, makes some sense. My bold prediction is that he is cut and Mason AND Dorsey/Aldridge make the roster in his place, OR Aldrige makes the roster and we go with 10 OL instead of 9, with (E) Williams making the squad as the 10th OL and backup center. Yes, I know montgommery is a backup C/G but I think the skins want to keep two guys who can play center on our roster so they can compete to replace Rabach next year.

[wilsowilso]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

On ESPN980, theyre speculating Cartwright and/or ARE will be the surprise veteran cut(s) Vinny and Zorn said may be made.

ARE isnt cuttable until next offseason from a cap perspective (about 4M then), but he's certainly not cuttable now. Besides, it wouldnt even make sense to cut him from a playing perspective, as there arent really any other receivers battling for the 5th WR spot with Mitchell.

Cartwright, on the other hand, makes some sense. My bold prediction is that he is cut and Mason AND Dorsey/Aldridge make the roster in his place.

Did they really say ARE was a roster cut possibility? How do some of these people even have jobs? As you pointed out it's not at all possible because of the salary cap ramifications so why would they even say it?

[SFREDSKIN]

Originally Posted by wilsowilso

Did they really say ARE was a roster cut possibility? How do some of these people even have jobs? As you pointed out it's not at all possible because of the salary cap ramifications so why would they even say it?

We cut Jason Taylor didn't we and took a cap hit? Why not ARE?

[wilsowilso]

Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN

We cut Jason Taylor didn't we and took a cap hit? Why not ARE?

Do you really need an answer to this question?

[SFREDSKIN]

Originally Posted by wilsowilso

Do you really need an answer to this question?

Have Vinny answer that question he's the one that does the cuts, not me.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by wilsowilso

Do you really need an answer to this question?

I think he's being sarcastic. [EDIT].... Nevermind. Lol

[KI Skins Fan]

Too much player versus player rather than roles we need filled in this discussion. I'd like to talk about things this team needs and if we can get some of those things out of the people who are currently on our roster or if we need to go outside of the organization and pick up or trade for some new players to fill those roles. The following list of roles is not necessarily in order of importance to the success of the team.

Offensive Tackle - Frankly, I just can't fathom how Vinny can believe that we're OK at that position. It's a near certainty that Chris Samuels is going to miss some time with his bad knee and right now it looks like they're counting on Mike Williams and Jeremy Bridges as the backups at OT. Bad move. I don't think Williams is ready to play yet and Bridges is really a G. We need to make a trade, if possible, or pick up a veteran OT for insurance.

Punt Returner - If Dorsey can catch the ball and not fumble, then we need to keep him as our PR. He has a chance to break a couple and to consistently give us better field position than you-know-who. I don't think of him as a RB but rather as a PR/KR. There are ways to fit him into the roster. For example, some people think that there is a final roster spot at DE that is up for grabs between Wynn, Buzbee, and Jackson. Why? Jarmon, Orakpo, Alexander, and Wilson can all play DE, so there's room for Dorsey.

Fullback - Somebody has to back up Big Mike, so either Eddie Williams or Todd Yoder must be on the roster (unless Rock is moved back to FB, which is unlikely). Any roster that doesn't have either Williams or Yoder on it isn't going to fly. Both of them block and catch. Neither of them is a runner. Yoder also plays TE. Pick one.

Running Back - Betts, Mason, and Rock are essentially the same style of RB. Keeping all three doesn't make sense. The two things we could really use at RB are a goal line and short yardage specialist and a change of pace/breakaway threat. Alridge might make sense on this roster as the change of pace back and I'd have no problem cutting both Mason and Rock if we could replace them with Alridge and a dependable short yardage specialist.

Placekicker - Oh, Jeez, Not Suisham again! And the other guy hasn't even been able to beat out Suisham. I have little confidence in either of these guys and our kickoffs are still coming up short. I hope Vinny is keeping an eye out for someone who can do the job.

Third String QB - Really, who the hell cares? We're not going to be counting on either of these guys, so choose your favorite or we can pick up someone else.

I feel pretty good about the rest of the roles on the team.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by KI Skins Fan

Too much player versus player rather than roles we need filled in this discussion. I'd like to talk about things this team needs and if we can get some of those things out of the people who are currently on our roster or if we need to go outside of the organization and pick up or trade for some new players to fill those roles. The following list of roles is not necessarily in order of importance to the success of the team.

Offensive Tackle - Frankly, I just can't fathom how Vinny can believe that we're OK at that position. It's a near certainty that Chris Samuels is going to miss some time with his bad knee and right now it looks like they're counting on Mike Williams and Jeremy Bridges as the backups at OT. Bad move. I don't think Williams is ready to play yet and Bridges is really a G. We need to make a trade, if possible, or pick up a veteran OT for insurance.

I think a veteran o-lineman can be picked up once things shake up after roster cuts. Although other than trading a current player, I would not really trade any draft picks for a back up lineman. I'm sure once teams trim down their rosters, we can pick up a lineman for depth.

Originally Posted by KI Skins Fan

Third String QB - Really, who the hell cares? We're not going to be counting on either of these guys, so choose your favorite or we can pick up someone else.

I feel pretty good about the rest of the roles on the team.

Agreed!!

[BigHairedAristocrat]

I dont think they know JACK about the Salary Cap.

Theyre also speculating Anthony Montgommery could be cut to make room for Dixon. I hadnt thought about that, but i'd certainly hope we'd try to trade Monty before just cutting him. That said, Monty has always struggled with consistency and Dixon won't last 10 minutes on the practice squad. He's younger, has played very well for a rookie and the coaches are impressed with his work ethic. The more i think about it, the more i like the idea.

Fans calling in are speculating its Collins (which would be a good idea from a long-term perspective but completely moronic in the short term), Betts (too good in pass protection to cut for me), and Sellers (he's unhappy with his contract and getting up there in years... still, who could replace him?), and Todd Yoder (we could go with only two TEs) to make room for another player and keep a TE on the PS.

[SmootSmack]

This may have been posted already

Redskins Insider - Making a Case for Rock Cartwright

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

This may have been posted already

Redskins Insider - Making a Case for Rock Cartwright

I'm just going to go ahead and quote myself here

"The thing that people don't realize [about teams] is that people play four and five positions," Smith said. "A guy has a position on a kickoff, a kickoff return, a punt and a punt return; that's four spots. When I lose a guy, I lose a guy at four spots.

"It may take one guy to fill all those four. It may take four guys to fill all four. That's the difference. It's not like when you lose a fullback and say, 'Well, we'll just go to another formation.' In this case, you can lose four slots, which is critical. So you need guys that are versatile like Rock, who can do a lot of things and play a lot of places."