Campbell's numbers dont lie

[skins89moss]

Originally Posted by JWsleep

Silly debate right now. He's not Brady, but it seems clear that he's not the root of our problems right now. He can certainly be better, but I would say the trend is positive on JC--he's gotten better, even if he's not lighting up the scoreboard.

THings that are more serious, IMO:

1. Where the fuck is our running game????
2. Why can't our D get off the field--that supposed to be our strength. ToP was brutal yesterday
3. D can't generate TOs
4. Play calling.
5. Brutal game-losing penalities
6. Consistent execution on EVERY play, JC included.

He's our best QB at present. Fix these other issues, and we'll win some games.

I agree with you we have to be concerned with the Lack of Running game and poor 3rd down defense.

[skins89moss]

[QUOTE=skinsfan69;598877]They're all good. But their teams don't avergae 13 points a game either. Like I said. JC has to take some of the blame for that. But it's not all on him either.[/QUOTE
The thread was Campbell's numbers don't lie. It wasn't about blaming him it merely pointed out that his stats are decent compared to other good QB's in the NFL.

[skins89moss]

Originally Posted by GMScud

People that think Collins would do a better job than Campbell right now are smoking something. For starters, Collins' mobility resembles that of an 80 year old woman, and our O-line leaks like an old faucet. Against a half decent pass rush, Collins may leave the field in an ambulance.

They still remember when Collins won a few games that got us to the playoffs and we lost to the Seahawks. If Collins has to play we are up a creek without a paddle. He has no arm strength to throw the ball deep , I guess thats ok since we dont go deep much. I do no this he is fragile as a bull in a china shop. A career backup vs JC please you people must be on a real Hatters trip on JC.

[skins89moss]

Originally Posted by CultBrennan59

I'll also go out on a limb here and say this.
Zorn gets fired and Mike shannanhan is our new HC. Campbell doesn't get resigned and goes to minnesota. We get a draft pick in the top ten. We do what ever we can to get sam bradford. Our OL next year will be. Donald Penn (of Tampa bay) at LT, Derrick Dockery LG, Draft pick at C (Mike Pouncey of Florida), Jahri Evans (of New Orleans) RG, Stephon Heyer at RT (or Samuels if we keep him). Our DL will be Orakpo at RE, Griffin, haynesworth, Jarmon at LE. Our LB's will be mcintosh, fletcher, and either a draft pick, or a FA. Our corners will be one of the crappy ones now, and a FA like dunta robinson. And I say that Shannahan asks for a new GM, and Vinny gets positioned down from GM, to like a smaller position.
I'm a very optimistic person, but I just see no way we win games with an offense that can't score in the red zone. Our defense is OK, they could be better if the offense stays on the field longer. I'm not as confident saying this, but I think LaRon could be trade bate for a high draft pick. And I forgot to mention that Greg Blache will either Resign or be fired.

Wow you went out on a limb for these statements: Are you in a high profile position or something where your reputation may take a hit if your wrong?

[skins89moss]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

See this is the reason why Jason Campbell needs to go to another team, you got the f'ing owner wanting to ship him out town and stupid fans that are making up reasons to hate him and lay the blame solely on him.

As I said, I wish Campbell was a terrible QB so these morons had something to complain about.

See JarMarcus Russell for terrible in Websters. Raiders fans would love to trade us for JC for Russell.

[bigant]

stop it he stinks,who cares what the numbers say,in big spots he is a dear in headlights enough said,.......

[MTK]

Love the ol "deer in the headlights" cliche. Like that's not played out. What the hell does that even mean? I guess when you can't rag on completion %, yards per attempt, total yards, QB rating, you know stuff like reality, that one is always good to pull out of the hat. That and heart. Another one of those cliched intangibles.

[Green1]

Originally Posted by Patfisher37

We have playmakers my friend. We probably have the best Tight End in the league, we have an explosive Wide Receiver who can still run, we have a decent slot receiver who can't return a punt for a yard but can still catch the ball and we have, decent running backs.

What more do you need, the guy just doesn't have what it takes to be a winner. How many years of mediocrity can we take from the QB position, I bet Collins can get in there and at least provide a more consistent performance.

Did you hear Cooley today. They have not consistency on Offense! That on the QB!

He's not bad, but this game is a game of momentum and mental toughness and if you can't give your team the confidence to make some tough throws and stretch the field, then nobody is going to believe in you.

This teams problems are from the shoulder pads up!

Consistency on O is the job of the person calling the plays Zorn

[Green1]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Love the ol "deer in the headlights" cliche. Like that's not played out. What the hell does that even mean? I guess when you can't rag on completion %, yards per attempt, total yards, QB rating, you know stuff like reality, that one is always good to pull out of the hat. That and heart. Another one of those cliched intangibles.

Your right. QBs always have heart when the team wins and none when the team loses.

[Green1]

Let me ask you guys something: If your boss was trying to replace you. I think you would try to perform tasks exactly the way he wanted you to, so if the plan doesn't work he can't blame you. JC is going through that right now.

[Rajmahal33]

Stats are usually good indicators, but can be deceiving...

1) JC gets a high completion percentage b/c he throws short and/or safe passes. Usually this is a good thing, especially when nursing a lead, but as we all know, the redskins have not had this luxury for quite some time. A QB should take risk so in order to balance out the completions % stat, u must look at number of pass plays over 20 yards (a category which, JC has been very sub-par over his career). Also completing passes that are short of a first down on 3rd and long are about as good as incompletions and should be accounted for in such instances. The OP mentioned Chad Pennington (who has the highest completion % among active QB's), but who here really considers him to be an elite QB. His completion % is very much deceptive in the same way JC's is.

2) Lack of TD's by a QB is one of the 3 most important statistical categories. How can someone doing a statistical analysis of his play neglect this or offer to reconcile his deficiency in this category? It is an absolutely telling stat about the offensive production of the team of which JC should be the field general. It ultimately falls on his shoulders, more than any player, and if he can't at least average 2 TD's a game, you cannot make the assertion that he is anywhere near the top 10 statistically. Just think 2 TD's in a game for JC was actually a GOOD day for him, compared to what is expected of the other elites of the NFL (which would be an average-to-poor showing).

3) JC gets a decent amount of passing yards because of two reasons: (1) We have receivers who r great at getting YAC (which is partly to his credit for putting the ball where it needs to be but largely are a product of the receivers' (ARE, Moss, and Cooley) skill set); (2) Often times he is forced to get big yardage in the second half and at the ends of games b/c it is a close game or we are down and we need to throw to catch up. He tends to rack up yards against prevent defenses (which again is to his credit) but had he is largely responsible for putting the team in that come-from-behind mode in the first place. Think about a typical game for Manning, Brees, or Brady. They are racking up yards and completions throughout the game. I don't know if u guys have been watching the same skins that I have for the past 3 years but it seems like we have 1 or 2 drives in the first half and then go away for an extended period of time only to have to rally back late in the game. Good QB's don't put themselves in this position most of the times.

4) To go one step further great QB's have confidence in their play (and instill confidence in the coaching staff) to the point where they are being aggressive even with a small lead. Nobody has the type of confidence in JC to allow him to try to rack up yards late in a close game to put the game out of reach... why? Isn't this the same QB who has a great completion % and low INT rate? The stats say you should want him to throw it, but seldom do you see this.

Yes, we have had a great running game in the past, but you can't start nursing a lead halfway thru the 3rd quarter. Yes, we've had O-line injuries in the past, but which team hasn't? At this level you must be able to adapt. The bottom line is that JC doesn't have that killer instinct (or his coaches don't have faith that he does), but either way some of the blame for that falls on him. More importantly, this lack of execution/faith is reflected in his play even though it may be lost in his padded stats. Ultimately it comes down to W's and L's and as we all know JC has been an average QB by this most important metric...

[Green1]

Originally Posted by Rajmahal33

Stats are usually good indicators, but can be deceiving...

1) JC gets a high completion percentage b/c he throws short and/or safe passes. Usually this is a good thing, especially when nursing a lead, but as we all know, the redskins have not had this luxury for quite some time. A QB should take risk so in order to balance out the completions % stat, u must look at number of pass plays over 20 yards (a category which, JC has been very sub-par over his career). Also completing passes that are short of a first down on 3rd and long are about as good as incompletions and should be accounted for in such instances. The OP mentioned Chad Pennington (who has the highest completion % among active QB's), but who here really considers him to be an elite QB. His completion % is very much deceptive in the same way JC's is.

2) Lack of TD's by a QB is one of the 3 most important statistical categories. How can someone doing a statistical analysis of his play neglect this or offer to reconcile his deficiency in this category? It is an absolutely telling stat about the offensive production of the team of which JC should be the field general. It ultimately falls on his shoulders, more than any player, and if he can't at least average 2 TD's a game, you cannot make the assertion that he is anywhere near the top 10 statistically. Just think 2 TD's in a game for JC was actually a GOOD day for him, compared to what is expected of the other elites of the NFL (which would be an average-to-poor showing).

3) JC gets a decent amount of passing yards because of two reasons: (1) We have receivers who r great at getting YAC (which is partly to his credit for putting the ball where it needs to be but largely are a product of the receivers' (ARE, Moss, and Cooley) skill set); (2) Often times he is forced to get big yardage in the second half and at the ends of games b/c it is a close game or we are down and we need to throw to catch up. He tends to rack up yards against prevent defenses (which again is to his credit) but had he is largely responsible for putting the team in that come-from-behind mode in the first place. Think about a typical game for Manning, Brees, or Brady. They are racking up yards and completions throughout the game. I don't know if u guys have been watching the same skins that I have for the past 3 years but it seems like we have 1 or 2 drives in the first half and then go away for an extended period of time only to have to rally back late in the game. Good QB's don't put themselves in this position most of the times.

4) To go one step further great QB's have confidence in their play (and instill confidence in the coaching staff) to the point where they are being aggressive even with a small lead. Nobody has the type of confidence in JC to allow him to try to rack up yards late in a close game to put the game out of reach... why? Isn't this the same QB who has a great completion % and low INT rate? The stats say you should want him to throw it, but seldom do you see this.

Yes, we have had a great running game in the past, but you can't start nursing a lead halfway thru the 3rd quarter. Yes, we've had O-line injuries in the past, but which team hasn't? At this level you must be able to adapt. The bottom line is that JC doesn't have that killer instinct (or his coaches don't have faith that he does), but either way some of the blame for that falls on him. More importantly, this lack of execution/faith is reflected in his play even though it may be lost in his padded stats. Ultimately it comes down to W's and L's and as we all know JC has been an average QB by this most important metric...

Faith in the QB? Zorn and the FO have been trying to get rid of Campbell since Zorn got here. JC in the no huddle(were he calls the plays) scores more when Zorn calls the plays. Check that STAT

[htownskinfan]

Originally Posted by Rajmahal33

Stats are usually good indicators, but can be deceiving...

1) JC gets a high completion percentage b/c he throws short and/or safe passes. Usually this is a good thing, especially when nursing a lead, but as we all know, the redskins have not had this luxury for quite some time. A QB should take risk so in order to balance out the completions % stat, u must look at number of pass plays over 20 yards (a category which, JC has been very sub-par over his career). Also completing passes that are short of a first down on 3rd and long are about as good as incompletions and should be accounted for in such instances. The OP mentioned Chad Pennington (who has the highest completion % among active QB's), but who here really considers him to be an elite QB. His completion % is very much deceptive in the same way JC's is.

2) Lack of TD's by a QB is one of the 3 most important statistical categories. How can someone doing a statistical analysis of his play neglect this or offer to reconcile his deficiency in this category? It is an absolutely telling stat about the offensive production of the team of which JC should be the field general. It ultimately falls on his shoulders, more than any player, and if he can't at least average 2 TD's a game, you cannot make the assertion that he is anywhere near the top 10 statistically. Just think 2 TD's in a game for JC was actually a GOOD day for him, compared to what is expected of the other elites of the NFL (which would be an average-to-poor showing).

3) JC gets a decent amount of passing yards because of two reasons: (1) We have receivers who r great at getting YAC (which is partly to his credit for putting the ball where it needs to be but largely are a product of the receivers' (ARE, Moss, and Cooley) skill set); (2) Often times he is forced to get big yardage in the second half and at the ends of games b/c it is a close game or we are down and we need to throw to catch up. He tends to rack up yards against prevent defenses (which again is to his credit) but had he is largely responsible for putting the team in that come-from-behind mode in the first place. Think about a typical game for Manning, Brees, or Brady. They are racking up yards and completions throughout the game. I don't know if u guys have been watching the same skins that I have for the past 3 years but it seems like we have 1 or 2 drives in the first half and then go away for an extended period of time only to have to rally back late in the game. Good QB's don't put themselves in this position most of the times.

4) To go one step further great QB's have confidence in their play (and instill confidence in the coaching staff) to the point where they are being aggressive even with a small lead. Nobody has the type of confidence in JC to allow him to try to rack up yards late in a close game to put the game out of reach... why? Isn't this the same QB who has a great completion % and low INT rate? The stats say you should want him to throw it, but seldom do you see this.

Yes, we have had a great running game in the past, but you can't start nursing a lead halfway thru the 3rd quarter. Yes, we've had O-line injuries in the past, but which team hasn't? At this level you must be able to adapt. The bottom line is that JC doesn't have that killer instinct (or his coaches don't have faith that he does), but either way some of the blame for that falls on him. More importantly, this lack of execution/faith is reflected in his play even though it may be lost in his padded stats. Ultimately it comes down to W's and L's and as we all know JC has been an average QB by this most important metric...

excellent post,I think you summed it up about JC

[Longtimefan]

Originally Posted by Green1

Every thread someone is calling for campbell to be benched but his numbers are great.
1. Rating: 92.5 Higher than Brady, Big Ben, C. Palmer, Cutler, and Rivers
2. 9th in passing yards: More that Rodgers, Ryan, Palmer, E. Manning, & Cutler
3. 5th in the Comp. Percent. 67.6%: Higher than everyone in the league except P. Manning, Brees, Big Ben, and Chad Penn.

So what else does he have to do to be considered a good QB. The Skins have a good QB, just bad playcalling, no running game, and no O-line. Get off campbell's back. He is doing more with less better than anyone in the NFL. Check the stats the STATS don't lie!

Needless to say his statistics are impressive. In the end however, he will be judged soley on wins & loses. Mr. Snyder may not be sympathetic towards statistics.

[Rajmahal33]

Originally Posted by Green1

Faith in the QB? Zorn and the FO have been trying to get rid of Campbell since Zorn got here. JC in the no huddle(were he calls the plays) scores more when Zorn calls the plays. Check that STAT

...against a prevent defense which hasn't successfully defended a lead in 19 games until, oh yea, THIS WEEK!