Raheem Morris

punch it in · 10-23-2012, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RGIII

Williams should've been thinking in that situation, "I can't allow my slow ass to get burned in this situation so, let me back the **** up".

The playcall by Haslett determines whether you are 10 or 25 yards off the line of scrimmage. Nobody is arguing that Williams made a bad read which got him in a position to get burned. I am saying that in that part of the game you dont call for a package that even makes that possible.

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mooby · 10-23-2012, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by punch it in

You play prevent there. Safetey all the way back. Thats it. If we played them tomorrow and it wound up the same way - that is exactly what we do.

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If you play prevent you might as well allow them to waltz down the field into field goal range. The call was correct, the talent was inadequate. Haslett called for double teams on Cruz and Nicks, and unfortunately the safety assigned to the double team on Cruz just so happened to be Madieu Williams, who is too old to cover a guy like Cruz. Williams was about 12 yards behind the line, and they did a great job putting two guys on his side of the field, which made him hesitate long enough before he was extremely late getting back to cover Cruz. Eli threw a perfect ball and that's all it takes. Sometimes it's not what the coach calls, it's about the talent on the field.

imaskin4life · 10-23-2012, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mooby

If you play prevent you might as well allow them to waltz down the field into field goal range. The call was correct, the talent was inadequate. Haslett called for double teams on Cruz and Nicks, and unfortunately the safety assigned to the double team on Cruz just so happened to be Madieu Williams, who is too old to cover a guy like Cruz. Williams was about 12 yards behind the line, and they did a great job putting two guys on his side of the field, which made him hesitate long enough before he was extremely late getting back to cover Cruz. Eli threw a perfect ball and that's all it takes. Sometimes it's not what the coach calls, it's about the talent on the field.

I would have rather had both safeties deep in zone coverage. I have a problem with ANY safety on our team being in man coverage with Cruz or their other WRs- even if its a double team. No safety runs with Cruz on the fly pattern. Keep the safeties BACK - they are too slow to be in man coverage.

At some point with all of these big plays on our secondary it would be nice if Haslett began to value the safety position helping with deep coverage. I am pretty sure we are one of the worst in the league in covering the deep pass.

Oh, and madieu williams sucks.

punch it in · 10-23-2012, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mooby

If you play prevent you might as well allow them to waltz down the field into field goal range. The call was correct, the talent was inadequate. Haslett called for double teams on Cruz and Nicks, and unfortunately the safety assigned to the double team on Cruz just so happened to be Madieu Williams, who is too old to cover a guy like Cruz. Williams was about 12 yards behind the line, and they did a great job putting two guys on his side of the field, which made him hesitate long enough before he was extremely late getting back to cover Cruz. Eli threw a perfect ball and that's all it takes. Sometimes it's not what the coach calls, it's about the talent on the field.

Well its not an automatic field goal first of all, and second of all we are acting like we didnt know Williams was old and slow until this play occured. Again - in this particular situation - Eli Manning and the Giants on a potential game winning drive, I think you have to swallow your pride a little bit and accept the fact that no matter what you call with our personnel that they are going to eat you up with 1:30 left. So - again - play it safe. Keep them out of the endzone at all costs, and take your chances on them getting into fieldgoal range - worse case scenario is OT. I understand what we did, I just dont agree with it. I am not usually conservative in thought when I watch the games - trust me. I was loving those 4th down calls - loving them. This last drive by the Giants I wanted conservative and didnt get it. They got burned. My wife for the first time in my life was watching and cheering for the Redskins and yelling GO GO GO when Moss caught that ball. I could not believe it. I stand by my original statement that if we could play that last sequence over agian there is no way Williams is not 25 yards off the line of scrimmage, and we are not going conservative. oh well. I still think we win the division so who cares.

Deivybaby · 10-23-2012, 02:20 PM

I got a question if Raheem Morris is gonna be our new DC why would he do a 3-4 D when he was more of a 4-3 tampa 2 coach?. We are just fooling our selves we would be in our 4th year with an inexperienced HC that would come into a new season with a unfamiliar system. I think we should go back to the 4-3 or hope a young hungry 3-4 DC is around Im still hoping Rex Ryan gets fired so we can go ahead and hire him.

But my advice to shanny is to be smart and not put his ego into this. It will get him fired not for the offense but the defensive mistakes hes done to this team and in Denver.

JoeRedskin · 10-23-2012, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RGIII

Williams should've been thinking in that situation, "I can't allow my slow ass to get burned in this situation so, let me back the **** up".

Yup. Somewhere is the breakdown and it shows Williams flat footed as Cruz blows past Wilson (who was clearly focused on taking out the short route). The moment Cruz had a step on Wilson, for Williams to be doing anything but flipping his hips and taking off downfield is mind boggling. Williams essentially waited until Cruz was at his level before he starts running downfield. With proper reaction, he has a 10 yard cushion and has a play on the ball. Sitting there watching a faster play run past you at full speed before starting your sprint is inexcusable.

He F'd up plain and simple.

REDSKINS4ever · 10-23-2012, 04:46 PM

There' been plays like that before. Does everyone remember the Monday Night Miracle in Dallas were Santana Moss got behind Roy Williams not once but twice? Madieu Williams seemed like he just froze or something and Cruz flew past him. You can't do that. Now Mike Shanahan is trying to downplay it in the media.

Cruz was the Giants most dangerous receiver. He's had receptions of 99 and 80 yards in his career. He even had over 1,500 yards receiving last year. How does the defense allow that to happen? I'm willing to forgive Williams and overlook his blunder only because he got a pick 6 against the Vikings.

Swarley · 10-23-2012, 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

The defense lost the game by giving up a 77 yd TD to Cruz. The offense contributed to this by turning the ball over 3 times, going 0-2 in the red zone, only getting three points off turnovers, and not scoring any points in the 3rd quarter.

The difference is the offense did what it had to when the game was on the line and when it mattered most, the defense did not. They crapped the bed.

Ruhskins · 10-23-2012, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swarley

The difference is the offense did what it had to when the game was on the line and when it mattered most, the defense did not. They crapped the bed.

If the offense had cut down on the mistakes early on, the game would not have been on the line. As I've said, I am not excusing the horrible defensive gaffe, but you can't beat the Giants or any good team by expecting offensive/defensive heroics in the 4th quarter.

JoeRedskin · 10-23-2012, 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

If the offense had cut down on the mistakes early on, the game would not have been on the line. As I've said, I am not excusing the horrible defensive gaffe, but you can't beat the Giants or any good team by expecting offensive/defensive heroics in the 4th quarter.

Well, we hoped for and got offensive heroics.

What we did not get was a defense, specifically a defensive secondary - specifically a safety, doing his job. Not heroics, just what he, as a safety, was supposed to do - guard against the deep pass. Expecting that of a safety in the last two minutes of a game is not expecting heroics; it is expecting players to do their jobs.

Ruhskins · 10-23-2012, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

Well, we hoped for and got offensive heroics.

What we did not get was a defense, specifically a defensive secondary - specifically a safety, doing his job. Not heroics, just what he, as a safety, was supposed to do - guard against the deep pass. Expecting that of a safety in the last two minutes of a game is not expecting heroics; it is expecting players to do their jobs.

I agree with your assessment of the safety, Williams f*cked up big time. The defense's job was to stop Manning and Co. from scoring and they didn't do the job. We have a subpar defense that will and has cost this team wins.

That being said, you beat good teams by limiting your mistakes or playing a mistake free football. You can't overlook all the mistakes the offense made in the first three quarters. The reason I keep banging this drum is that we are going to play another team that is notorious for comebacks late in the game.

Unfortunately, this team doesn't have the luxury of having a defense that will allow an offense to overcome earlier mistakes period. Would I want that? Hell yes. But that is not the reality, well not yet at least, because as many have pointed out this team has not reached its full potential. I think this team has the potential of having an offense like Manning's Colts or the Patriots of the past two years. An offense that can carry a crappy defense and win games against good teams.

CRedskinsRule · 10-23-2012, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by REDSKINS4ever

There' been plays like that before. Does everyone remember the Monday Night Miracle in Dallas were Santana Moss got behind Roy Williams not once but twice? Madieu Williams seemed like he just froze or something and Cruz flew past him. You can't do that. Now Mike Shanahan is trying to downplay it in the media.

Cruz was the Giants most dangerous receiver. He's had receptions of 99 and 80 yards in his career. He even had over 1,500 yards receiving last year. How does the defense allow that to happen? I'm willing to forgive Williams and overlook his blunder only because he got a pick 6 against the Vikings.

Didn't you kinda answer your own question? This was not a rookie with no talent. Cruz/Manning is a combination that is deadly in the closing minutes.

Swarley · 10-23-2012, 06:37 PM

You don't overlook them but keeping the Giants from scoring a TD with a little over a minute left would have never been a miracle. The defense helped bail the offense out of some of those mistakes but when they had to get just one more stop they folded like it was nothing.

btw just saw Mangini talk on Sportsnation about the Cruz TD and he said that the play call was the right one but Williams has to be able to recognize where Cruz is taking his route and pick up speed, not squat on the route. I'm sure most of us could already tell that was the issue but I thought people would be interested to know what Mangini said.

Ruhskins · 10-23-2012, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swarley

You don't overlook them but keeping the Giants from scoring a TD with a little over a minute left would have never been a miracle. The defense helped bail the offense out of some of those mistakes but when they had to get just one more stop they folded like it was nothing.

btw just saw Mangini talk on Sportsnation about the Cruz TD and he said that the play call was the right one but Williams has to be able to recognize where Cruz is taking his route and pick up speed, not squat on the route. I'm sure most of us could already tell that was the issue but I thought people would be interested to know what Mangini said.

Agreed, Williams is not a rookie, he needs to be able to recognize things like that.

Hog1 · 10-23-2012, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

Well, we hoped for and got offensive heroics.

What we did not get was a defense, specifically a defensive secondary - specifically a safety, doing his job. Not heroics, just what he, as a safety, was supposed to do - guard against the deep pass. Expecting that of a safety in the last two minutes of a game is not expecting heroics; it is expecting players to do their jobs.

A....Men!
How in the HELL can anyone justify letting Cruz(or anyone).......just run by in that situation...?....? Foul his ass....But DO something...

10-23-2012, 02:20 PM	#140
Deivybaby Registered User Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 129	Re: Raheem Morris I got a question if Raheem Morris is gonna be our new DC why would he do a 3-4 D when he was more of a 4-3 tampa 2 coach?. We are just fooling our selves we would be in our 4th year with an inexperienced HC that would come into a new season with a unfamiliar system. I think we should go back to the 4-3 or hope a young hungry 3-4 DC is around Im still hoping Rex Ryan gets fired so we can go ahead and hire him. But my advice to shanny is to be smart and not put his ego into this. It will get him fired not for the offense but the defensive mistakes hes done to this team and in Denver.

10-23-2012, 04:46 PM	#142
REDSKINS4ever Playmaker Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Washington, D.C. Posts: 4,105	Re: Raheem Morris There' been plays like that before. Does everyone remember the Monday Night Miracle in Dallas were Santana Moss got behind Roy Williams not once but twice? Madieu Williams seemed like he just froze or something and Cruz flew past him. You can't do that. Now Mike Shanahan is trying to downplay it in the media. Cruz was the Giants most dangerous receiver. He's had receptions of 99 and 80 yards in his career. He even had over 1,500 yards receiving last year. How does the defense allow that to happen? I'm willing to forgive Williams and overlook his blunder only because he got a pick 6 against the Vikings.

10-23-2012, 06:37 PM	#148
Swarley The Starter Join Date: Jan 2006 Age: 35 Posts: 1,092	Re: Raheem Morris You don't overlook them but keeping the Giants from scoring a TD with a little over a minute left would have never been a miracle. The defense helped bail the offense out of some of those mistakes but when they had to get just one more stop they folded like it was nothing. btw just saw Mangini talk on Sportsnation about the Cruz TD and he said that the play call was the right one but Williams has to be able to recognize where Cruz is taking his route and pick up speed, not squat on the route. I'm sure most of us could already tell that was the issue but I thought people would be interested to know what Mangini said. __________________ doing it all in the spirit of the salary cap!

Raheem Morris

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