the new health care?

[70Chip]

Originally Posted by saden1

If the opposition is going to be delivered by racist xenophobic anti-Semites there's nothing to worry about. Ugly people are rarely attractive to all the people. Let the games begin or should I say resume.

Keep accusing your opponents of ant-semitism as you sell out the Jews in Israel to the filthy and corrupt Arab gangsters that run Hamas. Even your pinup Jon Stewart will turn on you. The game is well on you and the morons in the White House will not win. As I've said before (to borrow an Obamian phrase) this is our country and we will not give it over to your sorry likes without blood being spilled.

[Schneed10]

The partisan divide in this country is sickening. What's worse is that many so-called intelligent people in this thread play right into it; supporting their side unconditionally in everything, blaming the other side for inflammatory tactics, harping on personal things that have nothing to do with the issues: like Clinton's blowjob from Monica and Sanford's affair.

Set that absurd bullshit aside, for the love of God. Evaluate everything objectively, no matter which side champions it. Only then are you being open enough to make decisions/cast your vote for the betterment of society. When you go along with this partisan drivel, all you do is succumb to your ego and pride. Let it go, sometimes the folks you voted for are right, sometimes they're not, who cares.

You don't have to agree with everything your party says; to do so only confirms that you're not using your brain.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

The partisan divide in this country is sickening. What's worse is that many so-called intelligent people in this thread play right into it; supporting their side unconditionally in everything, blaming the other side for inflammatory tactics, harping on personal things that have nothing to do with the issues: like Clinton's blowjob from Monica and Sanford's affair.

Set that absurd bullshit aside, for the love of God. Evaluate everything objectively, no matter which side champions it. Only then are you being open enough to make decisions/cast your vote for the betterment of society. When you go along with this partisan drivel, all you do is succumb to your ego and pride. Let it go, sometimes the folks you voted for are right, sometimes they're not, who cares.

You don't have to agree with everything your party says; to do so only confirms that you're not using your brain.

Very well said.

[mredskins]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

The partisan divide in this country is sickening. What's worse is that many so-called intelligent people in this thread play right into it; supporting their side unconditionally in everything, blaming the other side for inflammatory tactics, harping on personal things that have nothing to do with the issues: like Clinton's blowjob from Monica and Sanford's affair.

Set that absurd bullshit aside, for the love of God. Evaluate everything objectively, no matter which side champions it. Only then are you being open enough to make decisions/cast your vote for the betterment of society. When you go along with this partisan drivel, all you do is succumb to your ego and pride. Let it go, sometimes the folks you voted for are right, sometimes they're not, who cares.

You don't have to agree with everything your party says; to do so only confirms that you're not using your brain.

Nice post! I agree it would be hard to find someone that all their ideas fit in one political box.

I am a democrat but try breaking into my house and I will show you where I stand on gun control.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

The partisan divide in this country is sickening. What's worse is that many so-called intelligent people in this thread play right into it; supporting their side unconditionally in everything, blaming the other side for inflammatory tactics, harping on personal things that have nothing to do with the issues: like Clinton's blowjob from Monica and Sanford's affair.

Set that absurd bullshit aside, for the love of God. Evaluate everything objectively, no matter which side champions it. Only then are you being open enough to make decisions/cast your vote for the betterment of society. When you go along with this partisan drivel, all you do is succumb to your ego and pride. Let it go, sometimes the folks you voted for are right, sometimes they're not, who cares.

You don't have to agree with everything your party says; to do so only confirms that you're not using your brain.

true dat

These threads are just a reflection of political talk in general these days. Everyone has a line drawn in the sand. It's silly really because both sides are pretty much guilty of the same damn things in one way or another.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

true dat

These threads are just a reflection of political talk in general these days. Everyone has a line drawn in the sand. It's silly really because both sides are pretty much guilty of the same damn things in one way or another.

This is what I keep saying. And it floats right up to the politics. The two-party system is just too restrictive in handling the complexities of a nation like ours. It fosters bad ideas and is largely responsible for the mess we're in now.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

This is what I keep saying. And it floats right up to the politics. The two-party system is just too restrictive in handling the complexities of a nation like ours. It fosters bad ideas and is largely responsible for the mess we're in now.

It's really a difficult line. I believe in the two party system far more than the fragmented European style systems. But, without doing a historical essay and research, I think that since the nationalization of politics through a powerful media, the 2 party structure has been able to squash any grass root movements that might have risen to challenge them. I think back to the support that Perot received, and feel that in the 1800's that same movement would have had the opportunity to rise up and replace one of the two mainstreams. this is kind of how we kept new ideas percolating with out having our government sorta fall apart when one coalition or another decided to leave.

I hope historians will be able to look back at this period and really evaluate the good and bad effects of the media. I know we are too enmeshed in the now to get an objective view of it.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

The partisan divide in this country is sickening. What's worse is that many so-called intelligent people in this thread play right into it; supporting their side unconditionally in everything, blaming the other side for inflammatory tactics, harping on personal things that have nothing to do with the issues: like Clinton's blowjob from Monica and Sanford's affair.

Set that absurd bullshit aside, for the love of God. Evaluate everything objectively, no matter which side champions it. Only then are you being open enough to make decisions/cast your vote for the betterment of society. When you go along with this partisan drivel, all you do is succumb to your ego and pride. Let it go, sometimes the folks you voted for are right, sometimes they're not, who cares.

You don't have to agree with everything your party says; to do so only confirms that you're not using your brain.

S10, as a pioneer in calling idiots "idiots" I'm not sure what is meant by objective. When elected officials and "average" citizens talk about "death panel" provisions in the health care bill you got to start pointing fingers and proclaim "you're in idiot, you're an idiot, you too are an idiot, and you, and you, etc." Honestly, you can only be objective if the other side is coming from an objective position. Granted, the other side doesn't consider statists to be objective in matters dear to them.

Sanford's affair had everything to do with the issues, specially the issue of family values. If Sanford is going to run under the umbrella of being a righteous candidate who will uphold the "values" of this country and then f*cks around on his wife you got to call him out on that, especially with his hateration of gays. A similar case can be made against Clinton and his lying.

p.s. Obama is a jerk for wheeling and dealing behind the scenes with drug makers...80 billion in concessions my ass.

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by saden1

S10, as a pioneer in calling idiots "idiots" I'm not sure what is meant by objective. When elected officials and "average" citizens talk about "death panel" provisions in the health care bill you got to start pointing fingers and proclaim "you're in idiot, you're an idiot, you too are an idiot, and you, and you, etc." Honestly, you can only be objective if the other side is coming from an objective position. Granted, the other side doesn't consider statists to be objective in matters dear to them.

Or... instead of playing into the adversarial game which leads only to more fingerpointing and no real dialogue, you could try to rise above it and actually seek real solutions and find common ground with the non-idiots.

Perhaps, just perhaps, we don't need you to tell us what is idiotic but would prefer it if you tried to find intelligent solutions that would much be much more effective in highlighting the idiocy of idiots.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

Or... instead of playing into the adversarial game which leads only to more fingerpointing and no real dialogue, you could try to rise above it and actually seek real solutions and find common ground with the non-idiots.

You are 100% right. I need to improve in this regard.

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

Perhaps, just perhaps, we don't need you to tell us what is idiotic but would prefer it if you tried to find intelligent solutions that would much be much more effective in highlighting the idiocy of idiots.

I think I do a good job in this regard most of the time but sometimes you just have to let an idiot know he is an idiot.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by saden1

I think I do a good job in this regard most of the time but sometimes you just have to let an idiot know he is an idiot.

Now I have to say, I can't disagree with this!

I once wasted plenty of time in a thread chopping someone down for their absurd "foolproof" roulette system. Can't say I wouldn't do it again, either. Sometimes jacking someone up for being retarded is irresistable.

I would, however, do it more succinctly in the future. Because looking back, I wasted way too much of my time on that absurd discussion.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by saden1

S10, as a pioneer in calling idiots "idiots" I'm not sure what is meant by objective. When elected officials and "average" citizens talk about "death panel" provisions in the health care bill you got to start pointing fingers and proclaim "you're in idiot, you're an idiot, you too are an idiot, and you, and you, etc." Honestly, you can only be objective if the other side is coming from an objective position. Granted, the other side doesn't consider statists to be objective in matters dear to them.

Sanford's affair had everything to do with the issues, specially the issue of family values. If Sanford is going to run under the umbrella of being a righteous candidate who will uphold the "values" of this country and then f*cks around on his wife you got to call him out on that, especially with his hateration of gays. A similar case can be made against Clinton and his lying.

p.s. Obama is a jerk for wheeling and dealing behind the scenes with drug makers...80 billion in concessions my ass.

While I agree with the general principle; people who say retarded things deserve to be called retards, it does a disservice to the public to continue distracting from meaningful discussion by spending so much time and energy pointing and laughing at them.

They may deserve to be pointed and laughed at, but the far more effective thing to do is simply shake your head, ignore them, and continue on with meaningful and fruitful discussion.

It's like if you're sitting around having an intelligent conversation about Campbell's yards per attempt, whether it's caused by a poor offensive line or his own deficiencies, and some moron comes along and says "START COLT BRENNAN, CAMPBELL SUCKZ!! LOL!"

What do you do? Let the thread come to a grinding halt while taking up countless pages to drill him:? Or do you shake your head, dismiss his opinion, and continue on discussing the matter with intelligent people?

Now I get what you're saying, if politicians sink to that level then it starts a back and forth amongst our leaders (which is sad). But don't get sucked in, otherwise you spend way too much of your time giving idiots attention they don't deserve.

[JoeRedskin]

I agree with Schneed's and the other similar sentiments expressed - Clearly, the lines are drawn, the leadership on both sides drew them.

If either side had someone who would propose real ideas of reform and show the courage to take on the vested interests of the trial lawyers, the insurers, pharmaceutical companies, and doctors in an attempt to cut through the Gordian Knot that is healthcare in America today, THEN, maybe, we could resolve the issues.

As it is, to me, it looks our only options when it comes to actual health care reform are a bad plan or no plan.

Great.

[CRedskinsRule]

Saden,

Glad to see you are back. What ideas, or constructive dialogue themes, can we discuss? I would love to see the basic list, so we can discuss ways of making our country better, rather than moving back to the rhetorical debates.

Thanks in advance

[saden1]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

Saden,

Glad to see you are back. What ideas, or constructive dialogue themes, can we discuss? I would love to see the basic list, so we can discuss ways of making our country better, rather than moving back to the rhetorical debates.

Thanks in advance

I just got back from vacation in EU and D.C. area...I'll have them for you once I'm settled down, get what I've missed at work all sorted out and have some free to jot them down.