Legalize it!

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by Hog1

Unfortunatley, you and those like you are paying the price for those that are not.

Sorry, but I am missing your point here. Can you explain.
Also, keep in mind, that while I smoked a lot in college, that was over a decade ago, and when I graduated, I stopped smoking for about 7 years. In the past 4 years I have smoked maybe 30-35 times.

On another note, years ago, I knew a cop that lived in a typical subdivision. He had a "faux" corn field in his backyard that hid a respectful Mary J field in the center, for his own use. He used to store the harvested "product" in tennis ball cans. At one time I counted how many he had. 176 FULL tennis ball cans of POT. What a trip

How did he not get caught...the only people that I have known that tried to grow it, say it smells very badly around it and it's like a bullseye for the cops.

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by 724Skinsfan

I take it you have no children? If not, I guess your free to do what you want and accept the risks.

Yes, that is true...after my daughter died is when I picked it up again.

Trust me, the risks are extremely minimul

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by jsarno

Yes, that is true...after my daughter died is when I picked it up again.

Trust me, the risks are extremely minimul

I'm really sorry to hear about your daughter.

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

I'm really sorry to hear about your daughter.

Thanks man...I kinda had a "midlife" crisis around then...that's when I sold my ATV, bought a motorcycle, started travelling the world, and just living for my wife and 2 basset hounds.

[Schneed10]

Reasons why you're a moron for smoking pot:

- Inhibit's a woman's ability to get and stay pregnant.

- Has been shown to shrink your testicles and reduce your sperm count.

- Hampers memory and hampers your brain's ability to function (no surprise here).

- Smoking marijuana is not at all medically necessary to derive the medicinal benefits from THC. Canniboids can be synthetically generated in the form of pills and vaccines, generating the same positive effects on the brain and aiding in cancer treatment, reducing stomach problems such as nausea and vomiting, and reducing stress and anxiety. In other words, if you have stomach problems or are stressed, don't smoke weed and make yourself dumber and sterile, go see an effing doctor moron.

- Using it on the long term makes you dumber.

- Pot works to treat glaucoma, but not as well as other drugs do. So if your eyes are bothering you, see an effing doctor.

[MTK]

Those are some questionable sources there Schneed, I see lot's of 'it may do this, or it may do that' and not many hardline conclusions.

The truth is there aren't many long-term clinical trials out there to back any of this up.

Here are some myths and realities regarding marijuana use:

Marijuana Overdose

There is no existing evidence of anyone dying of a marijuana overdose. Tests performed on mice have shown that the ratio of cannabinoids (the chemicals in marijuana that make you high) necessary for overdose to the amount necessary for intoxication is 40,000:1.

For comparison's sake, that ratio for alcohol is generally between 4:1 and 10:1. Alcohol overdoses claim approximately 5,000 casualties yearly, but marijuana overdoses kill no one as far as any official reports.

Brain Damage

Marijuana is psychoactive because it stimulates certain brain receptors, but it does not produce toxins that kill them (like alcohol), and it does not wear them out as other drugs may. There is no evidence that marijuana use causes brain damage. Studies performed on actual human populations will confirm these results, even for chronic marijuana users (up to 18 joints per day) after many years of use.

In fact, following the publication of two 1977 JAMA studies, the American Medical Association (AMA) officially announced its support for the decriminalization of marijuana.

In reality, marijuana has the effect of slightly increasing alpha-wave activity in your brain. Alpha waves are generally associated with meditative and relaxed states, which are, in turn, often associated with human creativity.

Memory

Marijuana does impair short-term memory, but only during intoxication. Although the authoritative studies on marijuana use seem to agree that there is no residual impairment following intoxication, persistent impairment of short-term memory has been noted in chronic marijuana smokers, up to 6 and 12 weeks following abstinence.

What other myths have been going around about smoking a doobie ?

Heart Problems

It is accepted in medical circles today that marijuana use causes no evident long-term cardiovascular problems for normal persons. Marijuana smoking, however, does cause changes in the heart and body's circulation characteristic of stress, which may complicate preexisting cardiovascular problems like hypertension, cerebrovascular disease, and coronary atherosclerosis. Marijuana's effects on blood pressure are complex and inconsistent as of yet.

Hormones

Chronic marijuana use has not been found to alter testosterone or other sex hormone levels. In contrast, heavy alcohol use is known to lower these same testosterone levels.

Reproductive Damage

No trustworthy study has ever shown that marijuana use damages the reproductive system, or causes chromosome breakage. Studies of actual human populations have failed to demonstrate that marijuana adversely affects the reproductive system. Claims that marijuana use may impair hormone production, menstrual cycles, or fertility in females are both unproven and unfounded.

The Immune System

Studies in which lab rats were injected with extremely large quantities of THC (the active compound in marijuana) have found that marijuana (in such unrealistically huge quantities) does have an "immunosuppressive effect" in those lab rats, in that it temporarily shuts off certain cells in the liver called lymphocytes and macrophages. These macrophages are useful in fighting off bacterial, not viral, infections.

But this is only for the duration of intoxication. There also exists some evidence that marijuana metabolites remain in the lungs for up to seven months after smoking has ceased, possibly affecting the immune system of the lungs (but not by turning the cells off).

This said, doctors and researchers are still not sure that the immune system is actually negatively affected in realistic situations since there are no numbers to support the idea. In fact, three studies showed that THC might have actually stimulated the immune system in the people studied.

Cancer

Smoking marijuana has the potential to cause both bronchitis and cancer of the lungs, throat, and neck, but this is generally no different than inhaling any other burnt carbon-containing matter since they all increase the number of lesions (and therefore possible infections) in your airways.

The Gateway Effect

Marijuana use has not been found to act as a gateway drug to the use of harder drugs. Studies show that when the Dutch partially legalized marijuana in the 70's, heroin and cocaine use substantially declined, despite a slight increase in marijuana use.

If the stepping stone theory were true, use should have gone up rather than down. In reality, it appears that marijuana use tends to substitute for the use of relatively more dangerous hard drugs like cocaine and heroin, rather than lead to their use.

Thus, oftentimes strict marijuana laws themselves are the most significant factor involved in moving on to harder drugs like cocaine. Such is the case in Nevada and Arizona, the states toughest on marijuana use.

The potential benefits

Because smoked marijuana contains a variety of combustion compounds, it can damage the lungs and possibly the immune system. Several health committees recommended the development of an inhalation device that delivers pure THC -- the active ingredient in marijuana -- to the lungs. Such a device has not yet been created.

There is some evidence -- but no scientifically valid studies -- that marijuana is useful in treating some forms of epilepsy and spasticity caused by multiple sclerosis.

Some studies show that smoked marijuana is effective for some patients in relieving nausea caused by cancer and chemotherapy.

There is evidence that marijuana may improve the appetite and help patients gain weight. This could be lifesaving for AIDS patients who develop wasting , a severe weight-loss condition.

Smoking marijuana is effective in lowering pressure inside the eyeballs of some patients with glaucoma. A word of caution, however: the drug also drops blood pressure, and this could compromise blood flow to the optic nerve and damage vision.

So there you have it. For additional information on the benefits of marijuana, I highly recommend the book The Benefits of Marijuana : Physical, Psychological, and Spiritual by Joan Bello.

[Beemnseven]

My thing is, I don't care what its effects are. It could be the most dangerous substance on the face of the earth. If people want to destroy themselves with it, or any other drug, they should be free to do so.

We know injesting rat poison or antifreeze will "eff" you up -- but should it be illegal to injest? Should it be illegal to kill yourself?

The only caveat to that is, no one should be responsible for saving you from your self-induced destruction. I realize we're not at that point yet, and in this society measures are set up to be taken to care for those that injure themselves by their own actions. So any decriminalization of drugs should introduced simultaneously with legislation to remove the burden on the rest of society to help people out of their own "moronic" actions.

[Hog1]

The only experience I have with long term effects of heavy use. I personally know three people (former friends of mine) who for years pretty much, smoke out every day. After years of doing this...............that's all they want to do. No real jobs, or other positive things in their lives. Not going to be. Very similar to long term alcoholism.

[Schneed10]

Matty, those were articles quoting scientific studies published in periodicals like the New England Journal of Medicine. It doesn't get any more authentic.

I don't know how recent your information is, but those periodicals have published very recent studies showing that THC inhibits pregnancy and reduces sperm count in tests on animals. The author of the study was Jairo Garcia, Associate Professor and Director of the Fertility Clinic at Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine, the finest medical school in the country. I think it's pretty reliable information.

[MTK]

There are many studies that point to both sides of the coin, but ultimately I don't know that any hard conclusions can be drawn as to whether smoking pot is really damaging, benign, or somewhere in-between. When there is so much doubt and conflicting research, I don't see how you can draw a line in the sand and say smoking makes you a moron. Seems like a pretty closed-minded view if you ask me.

Long-term and even daily marijuana use doesn’t appear to cause permanent brain damage, adding to evidence that it can be a safe and effective treatment for a wide range of diseases, say researchers.

The researchers found only a “very small” impairment in memory and learning among long-term marijuana users. Otherwise, scores on thinking tests were similar to those who don’t smoke marijuana, according to a new analysis of 15 previous studies.

In those studies, some 700 regular marijuana users were compared with 484 non-users on various aspects of brain function — including reaction time, language and motor skills, reasoning ability, memory, and the ability to learn new information.

“We were somewhat surprised by our finding, especially since there’s been a controversy for some years on whether long-term cannabis use causes brain damage,” says lead researcher and psychiatrist Igor Grant, MD.

“I suppose we expected to see some differences in people who were heavy users, but in fact the differences were very minimal.”

The marijuana users in those 15 studies — which lasted between three months to more than 13 years — had smoked marijuana several times a week or month or daily. Still, researchers say impairments were less than what is typically found from using alcohol or other drugs.

“All study participants were adults,” says Grant, professor of psychiatry and director of the Center for Medicinal Cannabis Research Center at the University of California, San Diego School of Medicine.


“However, there might be a different set of circumstances to a 12-year-old whose nervous system is still developing.”

Grant’s analysis, published in the July issue of the Journal of the International Neuropsychological Society, comes as many states consider laws allowing marijuana to be used to treat certain medical conditions. Earlier this year, Maryland became the 10th state to allow marijuana use to relieve pain and other symptoms of AIDS, multiple sclerosis, cancer, glaucoma, and other conditions — joining Alaska, Arizona, California, Colorado, Hawaii, Maine, Nevada, Oregon, and Washington.

Medicinal marijuana is available by prescription in the Netherlands and a new marijuana drug is expected to be released in Great Britain later this year. In the U.S. and elsewhere, Marinol, a drug that is a synthetic form of marijuana and contains its active ingredient, THC, is available by prescription to treat loss of appetite associated with weight loss in AIDS patients.

Grant says he did the analysis to help determine long-term toxicity from long-term and frequent marijuana use. His center is currently conducting 11 studies to determine its safety and efficacy in treating several diseases.

“This finding enables us to see a marginal level of safety, if those studies prove that cannabis can be effective,” Grant tells WebMD. “If we barely find this effect in long-term heavy users, then we are unlikely to see deleterious side effects in individuals who receive cannabis for a short time in a medical setting, which would be safer than what is practiced by street users.”

Grant’s findings come as no surprise to Tod Mikuriya, MD, former director of non-classified marijuana research for the National Institute of Mental Health Center for Narcotics and Drug Abuse Studies and author of The Marijuana Medical Handbook: A Guide to Therapeutic Use. He is currently president of the California Cannabis Medical Group, which has treated some 20,000 patients with medicinal marijuana and Marinol.

“I just re-published a paper of the first survey for marijuana toxicity done in 1863 by the British government in India that was the most exhaustive medical study of its time in regards to possible difficulties and toxicity of cannabis. And it reached the same conclusion as Grant,” Mikuriya tells WebMD.

“This is merely confirming what was known over 100 years ago, as well as what was learned by various government findings doing similar research — marijuana is not toxic, but it is a highly effective medicine.”

In fact, marijuana was available as a medicinal treatment in the U.S. until the 1930s.

Lester Grinspoon, MD, a retired Harvard Medical School psychiatrist who studied medicinal marijuana use since the 1960s and wrote two books on the topic, says that while Grant’s finding provides more evidence on its safety, “it’s nothing that those of us who have been studying this haven’t known for a very long time.

“Marijuana is a remarkably safe and non-toxic drug that can effectively treat about 30 different conditions,” he tells WebMD. “I predict it will become the aspirin of the 21st century, as more people recognize this.”

SOURCES: The Journal of the International Neuropsychological Society, July 2003. Igor Grant, MD, professor of psychiatry, University of California, San Diego School of Medicine; director, UCSD Center for Medicinal Cannabis Research Center. Tod Mikuriya, MD, president, the California Cannabis Research Medical Group, Oakland; former director of non-classified marijuana research, the National Institute of Mental Health Center for Narcotics and Drug Abuse Studies. Lester Grinspoon, MD, professor emeritus of psychiatry, Harvard Medical School, Boston; author, Marijuana: The Forbidden Medicine and Marihuana Reconsidered.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by Hog1

The only experience I have with long term effects of heavy use. I personally know three people (former friends of mine) who for years pretty much, smoke out every day. After years of doing this...............that's all they want to do. No real jobs, or other positive things in their lives. Not going to be. Very similar to long term alcoholism.

Are you assuming, however, that there is a causal relationship between your friends' laziness and weed? Maybe they were lazy to start with. I too know heavy users who are outstanding employees at various jobs. I also know a few alcoholics who are jorribly lazy and mean.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Reasons why you're a moron for smoking pot:

#1 - Inhibit's a woman's ability to get and stay pregnant.

If pot smokers are morons, wouldn't you want them to reduce the liklihood that they will produce and attempt to rear other morons?

Originally Posted by Schneed10

#2 - Has been shown to shrink your testicles and reduce your sperm count.

See my response to #1.

Originally Posted by Schneed10

#3- Hampers memory and hampers your brain's ability to function (no surprise here).

According to you, pot smokers are morons/losers to start with, so killing a few more brain cells isn't going to make society lose out on the next Einstein. Is it really a big deal is a guy who, according to you, is dumb and lazy, can't remember where he put his stash?

Originally Posted by Schneed10

#4 - Smoking marijuana is not at all medically necessary to derive the medicinal benefits from THC. Canniboids can be synthetically generated in the form of pills and vaccines, generating the same positive effects on the brain and aiding in cancer treatment, reducing stomach problems such as nausea and vomiting, and reducing stress and anxiety. In other words, if you have stomach problems or are stressed, don't smoke weed and make yourself dumber and sterile, go see an effing doctor moron.

Well since we've talked alot about health care costs and that many do not want to subsidize others' bad habits, pot sounds like a good cure. It doesn't cost the healthcare system a single cent.

Originally Posted by Schneed10

#5 - Using it on the long term makes you dumber.

See my response to #3.

Originally Posted by Schneed10

#6 - Pot works to treat glaucoma, but not as well as other drugs do. So if your eyes are bothering you, see an effing doctor.

See my response to #4.

PS - I know and like you Schneed, so it doesn't bother me when you talk about pot smokers being morons. I know that you are opinionated but mean no harm. But, I would appreciate it if you made your views known without saying "morons" etc. since a lot of people who read these posts don't know you as well as the rest of us do and could start a fight.

[Schneed10]

Yes there are a lot of health benefits, but you can just as easily take a pill or a shot containing the canniboids than smoke the stuff (which is bad for your lungs though not as bad as tobacco).

The canniboids still have the side effect on your sperm count and your short term memory. If anxiety is the problem, there are better medicines: Lexipro, etcetera. If nausea is the problem, there are canniboid pills.

Man, we have so many smart people on this site, but apparently not one doctor. I wish someone could come along and set us straight on this.

[ArtMonkDrillz]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Man, we have so many smart people on this site, but apparently not one doctor. I wish someone could come along and set us straight on this.

I wouldn't hold your breath. Even if one doctor came on here and said that pot is harmful another one could come along and say that it isn't, and vice versa.

Based on what you and Matty posted I think it's pretty clear that there is not a consensus on pot's effects.

[ArtMonkDrillz]

Also, I had a roommate in college that was pretty severely bi-polar. He was prescribed many different antidepressants, but he said nothing ever worked as good as smoking pot.
I don't think it was just the pot itself that allowed him to relax. I think the whole ritual of rolling a blunt and going out and smoking it alone made him feel better. I know that probably won't make sense for someone who has never smoked and thinks that marijuana is an evil weed, but I do think there is something to it.