Democratic Primary Push for White House

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by Giantone

I guess you know more than US Intel .

G1 are you gonna vote for a communist this coming election?

[Giantone]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

G1 are you gonna vote for a communist this coming election?

You mean like you did a few years ago voting for trump?

[SunnySide]

I dont think Trump "colluded" with Russia. I do think Russia initiated a social media blitz that was just parroting and creating an echo chamber for right wing conspiracies with the goal of (1) sewing dissention among americans (gee how is this thread playing out, lots of name calling, trench warfare and tribalism) and (2) get Trump elected bc hes easily manipulated.

Trump has though been the gullible fool being played by Russia and Putin. And SA and anyone else who wants to manipulate him by overly complimenting him.

Trump is still parroting this Crowd Strike election interference came from Ukraine and not Russia ... when the intelligence community says it was clearly Russia. I dont think trump did anything wrong w Russia in 2016 but he thinks if he admits Russia did a misinformation campaign to favor him in the election .. that somehow takes way from his "biggest electoral win since Reagan".

Trump is just a useful idiot, especially for someone like Putin.

edit - please note that me calling Trump an idiot is not an attack on any Trump supporter. I mean .. the guy is vain, dumb in a dangerous way bc he thinks hes the smartest person in every room and is a narcisstic pathelogical liar .. that got voted by conservatives to be president for only the 1/3 conservative part of our County.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by SunnySide

I dont think Trump "colluded" with Russia. I do think Russia initiated a social media blitz that was just parroting and creating an echo chamber for right wing conspiracies with the goal of (1) sewing dissention among americans (gee how is this thread playing out, lots of name calling, trench warfare and tribalism) and (2) get Trump elected bc hes easily manipulated.



Trump has though been the gullible fool being played by Russia and Putin. And SA and anyone else who wants to manipulate him by overly complimenting him.



Trump is still parroting this Crowd Strike election interference came from Ukraine and not Russia ... when the intelligence community says it was clearly Russia. I dont think trump did anything wrong w Russia in 2016 but he thinks if he admits Russia did a misinformation campaign to favor him in the election .. that somehow takes way from his "biggest electoral win since Reagan".



Trump is just a useful idiot, especially for someone like Putin.

I agree with this to the extent that you go, but I would add that the whole of our system has become useful idiots. Adam Schiff and Nancy Pelosi turn to rabid little puppies when they get a whiff of an antiTrump bone, true or not. They howl and yap, and the media play it up.

We now have 3+ years of Trump dealing with Russia and 30 years of Bernie's love of Russia. It is hard to see that Russia would prefer an administration that pushed for and sent lethal aid to Ukraine over a Biden administration that fought against it.

Common sense should point to the obvious reason Russia would support Trump and that is because they gain when our political house is fractured. And it is fractured because of the bizarre hatred and vindictiveness from both sides that they, the Russians, can - as you said - so easily manipulate.

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[SunnySide]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

I agree with this to the extent that you go, but I would add that the whole of our system has become useful idiots. Adam Schiff and Nancy Pelosi turn to rabid little puppies when they get a whiff of an antiTrump bone, true or not. They howl and yap, and the media play it up.

We now have 3+ years of Trump dealing with Russia and 30 years of Bernie's love of Russia. It is hard to see that Russia would prefer an administration that pushed for and sent lethal aid to Ukraine over a Biden administration that fought against it.

Common sense should point to the obvious reason Russia would support Trump and that is because they gain when our political house is fractured. And it is fractured because of the bizarre hatred and vindictiveness from both sides that they, the Russians, can - as you said - so easily manipulate.

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Agreed. The Syria withdrawl has been bothering me lately. I thoght we should have stayed at least as monitors to keep the Kurds from being crushed and the Dems and liberals were screaming how this is genocide for the US to pull out.

I was inundated with Syria refuge crisis articles and politicians taking turns talking into the microphone about the greatest humanitarian crisis of all time ...

Now you hear nothing. Idlib is now being fought over by Russia/Syria with Turkey probably backing off. This is causing 800k to 2 million people, families, being forced to evacuate and just walk towards the Turkey border where Turkey already has like 4 million syrian refugees in camps.

Where is the continued 24/7 coverage of this? where are those so concerned politicians now?

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by SunnySide

Agreed. The Syria withdrawl has been bothering me lately. I thoght we should have stayed at least as monitors to keep the Kurds from being crushed and the Dems and liberals were screaming how this is genocide for the US to pull out.

I was inundated with Syria refuge crisis articles and politicians taking turns talking into the microphone about the greatest humanitarian crisis of all time ...

Now you hear nothing. Idlib is now being fought over by Russia/Syria with Turkey probably backing off. This is causing 800k to 2 million people, families, being forced to evacuate and just walk towards the Turkey border where Turkey already has like 4 million syrian refugees in camps.

Where is the continued 24/7 coverage of this? where are those so concerned politicians now?

If the Obama Administration would have put up the No Fly Zone and armed Kurds...This would have been over 3-4 years ago and Syria would be having elections now.

[SunnySide]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

If the Obama Administration would have put up the No Fly Zone and armed Kurds...This would have been over 3-4 years ago and Syria would be having elections now.

I dont think even the mighty USA can go an unilaterally enforce a no fly zone in a foreign country .. restricting that country from flying in their own air space. Russia already buzzes our guys when we are flying in international air space.

No way Russia and Syria would have abided by it, creates way to many instances where "something" could happen. A no fly zone sounded nice but I dont think it would be realistic.

Arming the kurds - I feel like we did but said we were only sending defensive material and not tanks etc but we hooked them up as much as we could. They had those shoulder launcher things to take down helicopters and tanks. Turkey and the Kurds is a delicate relationship and I think we did have to balance helping the Kurds fight ISIS while also limiting the disdain from Turkey.

----------------

Middle east diplomacy? I dont think there are any "best case" scenarios re diplomacy. You could argue pros and cons for no fly zone or complete pull out or maintaining a monitor presence. All would be right but also wrong.

Damned if you, damned if you dont.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

...

Common sense should point to the obvious reason Russia would support Trump and that is because they gain when our political house is fractured. And it is fractured because of the bizarre hatred and vindictiveness from both sides that they, the Russians, can - as you said - so easily manipulate.

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Hmmm. CNN walking back reports. Note the last line

Russia is interfering in the 2020 election, intelligence officials say, but the US doesn't have evidence that it's aimed at reelecting Trump -- only sowing discord

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[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

Hmmm. CNN walking back reports. Note the last line




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Enemy of the people. Fucking pathetic

[Giantone]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

Enemy of the people. Fucking pathetic

Yes, trump is! Nice you see the light now!

[BaltimoreSkins]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

Hmmm. CNN walking back reports. Note the last line




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Who is at fault here CNN or the intelligence official? CNN reported a story and then when the source for the story was found to be unverified they walked it back. That sounds like journalism and not bias. Not sure why you are persecuting CNN here. I guess you would rather them continue pursuing a false story to fit your narrative?

[Giantone]

Originally Posted by BaltimoreSkins

Who is at fault here CNN or the intelligence official? CNN reported a story and then when the source for the story was found to be unverified they walked it back. That sounds like journalism and not bias. Not sure why you are persecuting CNN here. I guess you would rather them continue pursuing a false story to fit your narrative?

Notice they won't acknowledge that there is russian "interference" just want to attack CNN for something that might not be any of their(CNN) doing. It's a trump tacktick, attack the press and make them the enemy .....facts be damn!

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by BaltimoreSkins

Who is at fault here CNN or the intelligence official? CNN reported a story and then when the source for the story was found to be unverified they walked it back. That sounds like journalism and not bias. Not sure why you are persecuting CNN here. I guess you would rather them continue pursuing a false story to fit your narrative?

Cnn/all media ran with a leaked story from a classified briefing that was partisan and highly inflammatory, and other members form same briefing were saying it was not an accurate portrayal.

What I would rather, is that the NYT, especially, stop letting themselves be used as clear puppets for an even clearer disinformation agenda by leaks.

I would rather ALL the media, right and left, step back from the incessant frackas that allows Russia to sow discord with ease.

I would rather ALL politicians (Trump, Schiff, and Pelosi especially) stop feeding click bait and trolls.




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[Giantone]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

Hmmm. CNN walking back reports. Note the last line




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The sad part is that you are trying to make a case that there is a difference and one is lesser evil than the other.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by Giantone

The sad part is that you are trying to make a case that there is a difference and one is lesser evil than the other.

There is a HUGE difference between the initial report, and the actual report. From KGB times Russian inteligence has tried to sow discord in US politics. The internet, a willing media, and a defensive president have made their job easy as pie.

But even moreso the initial leak was clearly done for partisan effect to the detriment of our election stability. If the report as originally stated had been true broadcasting our knowledge of it to the world only hurts any ongoing intelligence efforts to protect our election.


Finally, there also is a huge underlying story that goes to the sainted credibility of the people giving these assessments. There was a train of discussion saying how bad it was for Trump to get upset about the delivery of this assessment but, in fact, the assessment as given was widely astray from the facts as we now know them. Taking it a step further in that direction, there was a huge uproar over Trump's Roger Stone tweet about the overreach of the sentence, and yet the Judge agreed with the revised sentencing agreement NOT the overreach. She had the discretion to assign any sentence, she obviously accepts the vedict Stone is guilty, and was aware of the bruhaha around the two guideline statements. By extension Trump was right that 7-9 years was overly harsh. In both cases outrage over Trump's actions were proven invalid as further facts or knowledge has come out

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