Conference Championship thread

[OmahaRedskins]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I feel like this is a Barry Bonds like situation. Bonds was so good. First ballot Hall of Fame before he got into the steroid game. He didn't need them

Patriots are so good, such a finely run organization and team that they didn't need this. Yes, every team (most teams) fudge the rules but it seems to be a bigger public issue with the Pats than with other teams.

Regardless, I think they still would have crushed the Colts and I'm rooting for them on Sunday

Sorry Smoot, but I have to disagree with you on one point. Barry was not a first ballot hall of famer before he got into the steroid game.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by OmahaRedskins

Sorry Smoot, but I have to disagree with you on one point. Barry was not a first ballot hall of famer before he got into the steroid game.

I'd argue he was close to it

[OmahaRedskins]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I'd argue he was close to it

I think it depends on when you think he started taking steroids.

[BaltimoreSkins]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I'd argue he was close to it

I think he was a shoe in nobody stole bases and hit for power in the same way he did early in his career. Look at the dichotomy between 1997 and 1998 statistically two different bonds.

[Lotus]

I think arguing about whether or not Bonds deserved the first ballot misses the point.

Belichick should be remembered for being the greatest coach ever. Instead he will be remembered as a cheater. He has no one to blame but himself, of course. What a shame.

[over the mountain]

The most common Pats fans response, in order:

1. weather - cold air makes the PSI go down

2. innocent until proven guilty - show me the proof or GTFO

3. not a big deal - like going 60 mph in a 55, or extra stick-um on a receivers gloves

4. everyone else is doing it - point to aaron rodgers comments or panthers heating their balls

5. mysterious ball goblin walking the sidelines with an invisibility cloak

------------------------

Can anyone else point to another team "cheating" on an organizational level?

We got a brutal 2 year penalty for cap shifting during the uncapped year. 33 mil taken away from us? thats a killer.

if true, the pats should lose some draft picks and cap room for a few years. it has to be comparable to our penalty if not greater. fining the owner or coach does nothing.

--------------------

student manager deflated balls at USC v Oregon.

USC fined for deflating footballs during game against Oregon

But in a general sense – just taking USC out of the equation – there are few college-football tricks more duplicitous and underhanded than tampering with the football itself. While USC attests that Lane Kiffin, his staff and the roster had no knowledge of the student manager's deflating tactics, the act reflects very poorly on the entire football program.

[OmahaRedskins]

Has anybody seen this post?

Brad Johnson paid a bribe to tamper with footballs at the Super Bowl | ProFootballTalk

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by OmahaRedskins

Has anybody seen this post?

Brad Johnson paid a bribe to tamper with footballs at the Super Bowl | ProFootballTalk

I can relate to this a little bit as I was a QB in HS. The new balls are very slick, much harder to grip and harder to spin, at least for me. Especially if you don't have real big hands. The refs would come to the games with brand new balls, maybe 4-5 of them and those were the ones to be used in the game. I would tell our manger to put the new balls back in the ball bag and play with our practice balls. Those balls were old, beat up but MUCH easier to grip and throw a spiral with. Back then it wasn't a big deal and they would let you play with whatever ball you wanted. Anyhow, the manger was responsible to rotating our practice balls during the games. Really not a big deal at all. My coach John Harvill would get on me about it and would say..."you should be able to throw any ball!"..but that wasn't the case. Hated new balls and never used them.

[skinsfan69]

What's the old saying..."If you ain't cheating, you ain't trying!" LOL....Seriously, deflated balls? I guess that deflated ball gave Blount an advantage while he was trampling the Colt defenders. Personally I think it was probably a mistake the ball boy made. Or maybe Brady told the ball boy to take some air out of the balls. Either way, the Pats are not going to tell the NFL anything. I'll be rooting for them to beat Seattle since Brady's been my fantasy QB for 11 years. I've always rooted for the bad guys since I was a kid.

[over the mountain]

Bonds was won ROY, 3 MVPs, 3 gold gloves and 3 silver slugger awards his first 5 or 6 seasons in the league ... not counting his steals. He, van slyke and bonilla we awesome together. their catcher was really good too.

** im pretty sure of the awards, i checked the net real quick but may be off a little bit **

[skinsfaninok]

The football things has happened forever it did for the bucs in 03. People just hate on NE because they win every yr. Didn't the saints cheat too?? All teams look for leverage apparently not our team but everyone else does. Gets old

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

The football things has happened forever it did for the bucs in 03. People just hate on NE because they win every yr. Didn't the saints cheat too?? All teams look for leverage apparently not our team but everyone else does. Gets old

If NE wins every year, why the f*ck would they do this?

Nation Can’t Wait To Hear Patriots Fans’ Excuses This Time | The Onion - America's Finest News Source

[skinsfaninok]

I don't mean win championships of course but they win the east ev yr man.

[JoeRedskin]

Sorry the "Everybody does it" defense does not fly with me either as a substantive defense to the violation or as a basis for substantial mitigation of the sanction. Maybe as mitigation on the first confirmed violation of cheating, but not the second. Everybody speeds, but, if I get nailed for multiple speeding tickets, I lose my license even if each infraction is small or causes no imminent injury/danger to others.

In light of the issue being more widespread (i.e. everyone DOES play fast and loose with this particular issue), I can see SOME minor mitigation to the sanction and will back off the forfeit. Other than that, yes, everyone tries to bend the rules to their advantage and we know we only catch one in ten (if that). Because of that, and to protect the integrity of the game - which would otherwise die the death of a 1,000 cuts, violations relating to competitive balance will be dealt with severely when teams are actually caught. Additionally, cheating on the competitive balance has at its core a deception - either on the refs, the other team or the fans. Because so much of our society is reliant on the need for honest dealings, violations involving dishonesty and deceptive dealings should always receive a higher penalty than merely accidental errors.

The penalty this time around should be a multiple of the prior cheating sanction (at least double but, IMHO, treble or quadruple) as it involves almost the exact same management team. Clearly, to the Pats, dishonesty is an acceptable method for gaining a competitive advantage - I strongly disagree. Until dissuaded of this belief, however, the current Patriot staff will continue to ignore the rules wherever possible relying on any penalty imposed when caught never being strong enough to significantly impact their ability to win.

Regardless of the penalty imposed this time, if Belichick gets caught again, he gets banned Pete Rose style. Let him know that as part of any sanction imposed this time around and hold him personally responsible for ensuring the honesty and integrity of his staff and players (No Henry II proclamations of "If only someone would rid me of this meddlesome priest" right before his knights ride off to kill the archbishop).

Belichick is a great coach. The Pats are a great team. They don't need to cheat. They did. Twice blatantly enough to be caught. Belichick's legacy is now in his own hands

[MTK]

Cheating is cheating. Always amazing to see people justify it.