Campbell Questions

[SouperMeister]

Originally Posted by Chief X_Phackter

Yes...he also missed a wide open Cooley for a sure touchdown yesterday too. He really needs to shore up that part of his game. One of the reasons he was drafted was his ability to throw the long ball with accuracy, but I haven't seen that materialize with any sort of consistency yet. Once he gets that down, he will be dangerous...Chances are next year will be his true breakout year providing we have any money to give him some weapons to work with. He's getting better every week.

With Moss, ARE, and Cooley, he has the weapons, he just has to be allowed to utilize them. These last two weeks, we've finally seen the reigns lifted. If we could add a tall WR for a modest price in free agency, that might be the only missing piece for the red zone passing game.

[Cowell]

Originally Posted by SouperMeister

With Moss, ARE, and Cooley, he has the weapons, he just has to be allowed to utilize them. These last two weeks, we've finally seen the reigns lifted. If we could add a tall WR for a modest price in free agency, that might be the only missing piece for the red zone passing game.

The Jaguars Reggie Williams. I was watching the Jacksonville / San Diego game yesterday and he had a pretty good game. I know, he really isn't consistent but he is big and probably won't ask for a lot considering he barely made the team this year.
I'm not sure if it's his contract year though...

[offiss]

Originally Posted by BleedBurgundy

How do you improve a QB's accuracy though? Just reps? I didn't know if that was something it improves or not. I mean, McNabb has been in the league how long now and he still throws 4 or 5 bounce passes per game.

What he needs to do is recognize the route and the defense quicker, I think by the time he realizes whats happening down field he is a little behind, that could be from lack of experience, the more he plays the slower the game will become for him, the sooner he should start recognizing coverages, the quicker he can get the ball out, I think that is his problem right now, I think he can throw the ball accurately but he's a little behind in his mind right now, he needs to anticipate when a receiver is about to break open and get rid of it, that will allow him to lead the WR, not wait until it happens because then there is usually a safety closing in which may cause him subconsciously to throw behind the wr. He also needs to survey the field better when his primary is covered.

His deep ball needs a lot of work!

The good thing is he's being allowed to throw, we now can see him start to develop, he had a nice game yesterday but he still threw an inexcusable INT that cost us the game, Dallas couldn't cover our WR's yesterday, if he stayed patient, and smart we win that game late.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by offiss

What he needs to do is recognize the route and the defense quicker, I think by the time he realizes whats happening down field he is a little behind, that could be from lack of experience, the more he plays the slower the game will become for him, the sooner he should start recognizing coverages, the quicker he can get the ball out, I think that is his problem right now, I think he can throw the ball accurately but he's a little behind in his mind right now, he needs to anticipate when a receiver is about to break open and get rid of it, that will allow him to lead the WR, not wait until it happens because then there is usually a safety closing in which may cause him subconsciously to throw behind the wr. He also needs to survey the field better when his primary is covered.

His deep ball needs a lot of work!

The good thing is he's being allowed to throw, we now can see him start to develop, he had a nice game yesterday but he still threw an inexcusable INT that cost us the game, Dallas couldn't cover our WR's yesterday, if he stayed patient, and smart we win that game late.

That int really hurt. If I'm correct he had El open to his left and from what I heard yesterday on the Riggo show CP rolled right and no one covered him and he could have walked into the endzone.

[BleedBurgundy]

I understand him not seeing the whole field yet. I think that def comes with time. I'm more concerned with seeing things that you can't coach. I can't remember seeing a qb who was inaccurate in the early stages of their career become accurate later on. Not saying it doesn't happen, just saying I don't remember it. As several others have already noted, the timing will come. But accuracy and timing are different. He's nowhere near as innacurate as some other qbs in the game but he does seem to deliver it a little high (could be that our receivers accentuate this with their lack of height.)

[SC Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by Chief X_Phackter

Yes...he also missed a wide open Cooley for a sure touchdown yesterday too. He really needs to shore up that part of his game. One of the reasons he was drafted was his ability to throw the long ball with accuracy, but I haven't seen that materialize with any sort of consistency yet. Once he gets that down, he will be dangerous...Chances are next year will be his true breakout year providing we have any money to give him some weapons to work with. He's getting better every week.

Don't fall into the trap of listening to everything the announcers said (even if Aikman is usually on point). Watching the particular play you mentioned Jason put the ball right where it needed to be, low where Cooley could make a play but the defenders (who were around him) could not. Bottom line, Cooley dropped that one. The overthrow to Moss might also be excused somewhat since the DE (maybe Ware, can't remember) was right on him. The INT was the killer but he knows he was wrong, said he was wrong, and he'll learn from it.

The most encouraging thing about JC is that, from everything we heard this offseason, he is a worker and you can even see him improving week to week during the season. He has improved his release and footwork from last year and I think he has also improved his downfield throws just from the beginning of the year (he hasn't had another deep shot to Moss yet, but the last real deep one he put up a few weeks ago was not as flat as it was against Philadelphia). He's not like some of these guys (Grossman, Eli, Carr, Leftwich, et al.) who don't seem to really work at their craft. Those guys were all high picks (and admittedly I haven't watched them extensively) but every time I see them they make the same errors in mechanics whenever things get mildly tough (Eli's patented eyes closed back footed falling down throw, Grossman's similarly wretched mechanics, Leftwich's deliberate and looping release). They don't seem willing to take coaching and get better, so far Jason looks like a different animal.

[dmek25]

why are some people enamored with a TALL receiver? what in the world does that have to do with accuracy? if the throw is on the money, it doesn't matter how tall the player is. Campbell has made great strides in his brief career. and any skins fan should be excited for what is about to come. the more he works with these guys, the more accurate he will become

[Stacks42]

To Campbells defense, he did throw the ball over 50 times. One pick out of 50+ throws 300+ yards is pretty good, on the other hand Romo should have had 3-4 picks.

[BleedBurgundy]

Originally Posted by dmek25

why are some people enamored with a TALL receiver? what in the world does that have to do with accuracy? if the throw is on the money, it doesn't matter how tall the player is. Campbell has made great strides in his brief career. and any skins fan should be excited for what is about to come. the more he works with these guys, the more accurate he will become

I'm not enamored with a tall receiver, I'm saying a smaller target is harder to hit. He seems a little high with his throws and I think with guys that are 6'3" instead of 5'10" he'd have a little more margin for error. It's not a shot at our receivers or campbell.

[SC Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by BleedBurgundy

I understand him not seeing the whole field yet. I think that def comes with time. I'm more concerned with seeing things that you can't coach. I can't remember seeing a qb who was inaccurate in the early stages of their career become accurate later on. Not saying it doesn't happen, just saying I don't remember it. As several others have already noted, the timing will come. But accuracy and timing are different. He's nowhere near as innacurate as some other qbs in the game but he does seem to deliver it a little high (could be that our receivers accentuate this with their lack of height.)

Football Outsiders (which I must admit can be kind of hit and miss with their predictions) argues that the most important predictors of future success for QBs drafted in the first two rounds (apparently it gets a little tougher from there due to various factors) and passing percentage and number of starts. Their predictive software loves Jason Campbell, though they had to temper some of those predictions when they took into account it was Jason's first year starting, because of those factors.

At Auburn Jason's stats were:

- 2001 - 9 games - 89/142 62.7%
- 2002 - 11 games - 94/149 63.1%
- 2003 - 13 games - 181/293 61.8%
- 2004 - 13 games - 188/270 69.6%

and that is playing the SEC ... I try not to get too geeked, but I love the guy.

[BleedBurgundy]

Originally Posted by SC Skins Fan

Don't fall into the trap of listening to everything the announcers said (even if Aikman is usually on point). Watching the particular play you mentioned Jason put the ball right where it needed to be, low where Cooley could make a play but the defenders (who were around him) could not. Bottom line, Cooley dropped that one. The overthrow to Moss might also be excused somewhat since the DE (maybe Ware, can't remember) was right on him. The INT was the killer but he knows he was wrong, said he was wrong, and he'll learn from it.

The most encouraging thing about JC is that, from everything we heard this offseason, he is a worker and you can even see him improving week to week during the season. He has improved his release and footwork from last year and I think he has also improved his downfield throws just from the beginning of the year (he hasn't had another deep shot to Moss yet, but the last real deep one he put up a few weeks ago was not as flat as it was against Philadelphia). He's not like some of these guys (Grossman, Eli, Carr, Leftwich, et al.) who don't seem to really work at their craft. Those guys were all high picks (and admittedly I haven't watched them extensively) but every time I see them they make the same errors in mechanics whenever things get mildly tough (Eli's patented eyes closed back footed falling down throw, Grossman's similarly wretched mechanics, Leftwich's deliberate and looping release). They don't seem willing to take coaching and get better, so far Jason looks like a different animal.

I thought the exact same thing when I watched that play.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by SC Skins Fan

Football Outsiders (which I must admit can be kind of hit and miss with their predictions) argues that the most important predictors of future success for QBs drafted in the first two rounds (apparently it gets a little tougher from there due to various factors) and passing percentage and number of starts. Their predictive software loves Jason Campbell, though they had to temper some of those predictions when they took into account it was Jason's first year starting, because of those factors.

At Auburn Jason's stats were:

- 2001 - 9 games - 89/142 62.7%
- 2002 - 11 games - 94/149 63.1%
- 2003 - 13 games - 181/293 61.8%
- 2004 - 13 games - 188/270 69.6%

and that is playing the SEC ... I try not to get too geeked, but I love the guy.

When Dave Lewin wrote the QB projection system he found that QB success rate was about 60% GS and 40% completion percentage in college stats.

However, taking his original work, it seems that based on the failures of Vince Young, Tim Couch, and of Alex Smith (three guys that the system had highly rated), and the relative success of JP Losman (who didn't complete a great % in college), I've decided that the system is pretty accurate, but is more accurate if it is weighed higher in terms of games started.

A guy who starts 45 games and completes 58% of his passes is far more valuable in my opinion than a guy who starts 31 games and completes 65% of his passes. Games started always has to be the first thing a scout looks at when grading the top tier draft prospects.

Anyway, this only goes to show that Jason Campbell should be even better over time.

[Chief X_Phackter]

Originally Posted by SC Skins Fan

Don't fall into the trap of listening to everything the announcers said (even if Aikman is usually on point). Watching the particular play you mentioned Jason put the ball right where it needed to be, low where Cooley could make a play but the defenders (who were around him) could not. Bottom line, Cooley dropped that one. The overthrow to Moss might also be excused somewhat since the DE (maybe Ware, can't remember) was right on him. The INT was the killer but he knows he was wrong, said he was wrong, and he'll learn from it.

The most encouraging thing about JC is that, from everything we heard this offseason, he is a worker and you can even see him improving week to week during the season. He has improved his release and footwork from last year and I think he has also improved his downfield throws just from the beginning of the year (he hasn't had another deep shot to Moss yet, but the last real deep one he put up a few weeks ago was not as flat as it was against Philadelphia). He's not like some of these guys (Grossman, Eli, Carr, Leftwich, et al.) who don't seem to really work at their craft. Those guys were all high picks (and admittedly I haven't watched them extensively) but every time I see them they make the same errors in mechanics whenever things get mildly tough (Eli's patented eyes closed back footed falling down throw, Grossman's similarly wretched mechanics, Leftwich's deliberate and looping release). They don't seem willing to take coaching and get better, so far Jason looks like a different animal.

I wasn't speaking of the low throw at the five yard line or whatever it was. I'm talking about the double move Cooley put on the corner/safety and ended up with inside position on both, and JC threw the ball too far and too inside out of reach...was a sure touchdown if it was an accurate throw.

[SouperMeister]

Originally Posted by dmek25

why are some people enamored with a TALL receiver? what in the world does that have to do with accuracy? if the throw is on the money, it doesn't matter how tall the player is. Campbell has made great strides in his brief career. and any skins fan should be excited for what is about to come. the more he works with these guys, the more accurate he will become

Having a tall receiver is a HUGE advantage once you're in the red zone - he presents a much larger target, and can generally outjump pint-sized DB's on any high passes. The first TD to Owens is the kind of play that we just cannot run consistently well, hence, we bog down inside the 10 on numerous occasions. Even a good DB with size like Springs has no chance one-on-one against a bigger stronger man like TO on that play.

I'd argue that TO's size would have allowed him to get his hands on the pass that was too high for Moss at the end of the game.

[EternalEnigma21]

About the fumbles... I want him to correct them, but I'm also very very glad we don't have a qb who makes the pass rush one of his first reads during his progression... a la brunell/ramsey.

as he gets more experience he'll be getting rid of the ball faster and taking pressure off of our tackles, which should also help our running game...