The Vinny and the Scouts Appreciation Thread

[freddyg12]

Originally Posted by Bill B

I hope you are right about this. What I can't understand about this is from a financial standpoint I would think that not having to spend huge amounts on signing bonuses and getting better on field success from unheralded free agents and draft picks would actually be more enticing to most business owners - what is it about trying to go out and buy the biggest free agents? Yeah it may create a offseason excitement and help in the sales of jerseys/merchandise, but I would think most Redskin fans really care about the Lombardi Trophy and as this year is proving your chances of success improve when you take the less heralded approach. Look at this season's big spender if you need a stark reminder - the San Francisco 49ers - all the money spent and what was their great record - a pathetic 5-11 - records speak for themselves and buying a championship is an approach that keeps failing - when are teams going to finally realize this?

I think the Danny probably sees his free agents signings the same way he did hiring people to work for him before he owned the Skins. As a young guy who was making money in an era when corporate benefits were waning & transience was more common than loyalty, he understands that today's best workers know their value & want to be well paid. His philosophy was never bad in theory, but hasn't worked in football for a no. of reasons. He's had his own learning curve to go through & hopefully he's learned enough to build a consistent winning team.

[Defensewins]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

With what this team has accomplished and how they have done it, I really don't see much room for bitching and complaining.

Let's give credit where it's due.

I am all for giving credit to where it is due, but lets not forget this success seems small coming behind 6 or 7 years of some really poor talent evalution of lower round picks and free agents. I do not think there is anything wrong with pointing out how bad the drafting lower round picks and free agents (non-drafted) players has been. I mean really bad. It is not "bitching and complaining" when I am merely giving a different view point.
I give most of the credit to the new found success of finding hidden gems to Gibbs and not Cerratto. The success started when Gibbs and co, arrived. Cerrato has his own track record before Gibbs got here and it is not pretty.
We had the highest payroll $ and one of the lower performing teams.
The proof was on the field every Sunday. I do not care how talented our team appeared on paper.

[skinsnut]

I give the front office major credit since Gibbs came back....
Look at this and smile:

Free agent grabs:.
Smoot, Andre Carter, Griffin, Randel El, Springs, Washington, Frost, Fletcher, Randy Thomas, Brunell (playoffs), Collins (playoffs)
(Yes, we had 3 screw ups...Archuletta, Brandon Lloyd and Duckett but I'd take 3 vs all these good moves any day)

Trades:
Portis, Moss

Top picks have been solid:
Cooley, Campbell, Sean Taylor, Rodgers, Landry, McIntosh

and the last few years (last 2 in particular) with low rounds and undrafted free agents/CFL castoffs..etc:
Lorenzo Alexander, Golston, Heyer, Anthony Montgomery, Chris Wilson, Shuisham, Sellers

The only thing missing is success in the mid-rounds of the draft.

Just think of our roster 4 years ago with Spurrier.....what a turnaround!

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Defensewins

I am all for giving credit to where it is due, but lets not forget this success seems small coming behind 6 or 7 years of some really poor talent evalution of lower round picks and free agents. I do not think there is anything wrong with pointing out how bad the drafting lower round picks and free agents (non-drafted) players has been. I mean really bad. It is not "bitching and complaining" when I am merely giving a different view point.
I give most of the credit to the new found success of finding hidden gems to Gibbs and not Cerratto. The success started when Gibbs and co, arrived. Cerrato has his own track record before Gibbs got here and it is not pretty.
We had the highest payroll $ and one of the lower performing teams.
The proof was on the field every Sunday. I do not care how talented our team appeared on paper.

Ok then, should I change this thread title to "Is it time to stop harping on Desmond Howard and give Gibbs credit for his personnel evaluation skills?"

[skinsnut]

Originally Posted by Defensewins

I am all for giving credit to where it is due, but lets not forget this success seems small coming behind 6 or 7 years of some really poor talent evalution of lower round picks and free agents. I do not think there is anything wrong with pointing out how bad the drafting lower round picks and free agents (non-drafted) players has been. I mean really bad. It is not "bitching and complaining" when I am merely giving a different view point.
I give most of the credit to the new found success of finding hidden gems to Gibbs and not Cerratto. The success started when Gibbs and co, arrived. Cerrato has his own track record before Gibbs got here and it is not pretty.
We had the highest payroll $ and one of the lower performing teams.
The proof was on the field every Sunday. I do not care how talented our team appeared on paper.

Keep in mind...someone has to COACH the players....do you think HEYER would be successful without BUGES?
What about Montgomery and Golston?

Its the combination of a solid coaching staff's influence on who to target combined with daily work....especially with "less talented" players.
Spurrier did not have that ability...nor did Norv or Marty.
Spurrier makes his players look worse, Norv can only make his offensive players play to their potential and Marty....well....he likes to punt a lot.

[skinsnut]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Ok then, should I change this thread title to "Is it time to stop harping on Desmond Howard and give Gibbs credit for his personnel evaluation skills?"

I would agree with that...not only is Gibbs pretty good....but based on the last 2 years, he is getting better and better.

[Defensewins]

Originally Posted by skinsnut

Keep in mind...someone has to COACH the players....do you think HEYER would be successful without BUGES?
What about Montgomery and Golston?

Its the combination of a solid coaching staff's influence on who to target combined with daily work....especially with "less talented" players.
Spurrier did not have that ability...nor did Norv or Marty.
Spurrier makes his players look worse, Norv can only make his offensive players play to their potential and Marty....well....he likes to punt a lot.

Yes I agree. But is it not the the job and responsibility of the Owner and Front Office to hire the coaching staff as well as draft the players?
So either way the Owner and FO made some decisions that did not work out and cost us some poor seasons.

[skinsnut]

Originally Posted by Defensewins

Yes I agree. But is it not the the job and responsibility of the Owner and Front Office to hire the coaching staff as well as draft the players?
So either way the Owner and FO made some decisions that did not work out and cost us some poor seasons.

True...the best move the front office ever made was this.

They heaviliy recruited and rehire Joe Gibbs and have let him heavily influence most FO decisions

[Defensewins]

Originally Posted by skinsnut

True...the best move the front office ever made was this.

They heaviliy recruited and rehire Joe Gibbs and have let him heavily influence most FO decisions

I am glad we agree.
That was the point I was trying to make on my 1st post on this thread. I credit Gibbs with our new found success, not so much Cerratto.

[70Chip]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I especially want us to recognize the work of the scouts for going out there and finding these guys. Like Bo Schembechler's son finding Anthony Montgomery, or Terry Ray for Chris Wilson, etc. Scouting can be a thankless job but it's so key to a team's success.

I wish my name was Shemy Shembechler. Don't you almost have to join a Polka band with a name like that? Aren't you given one of those little Shriner parade cars (w/ hat) at birth?