Your Thoughts on the D-line...

[SmootSmack]

Nice thread.

My thoughts are that OL and LB will, and should, be higher priorities this off-season. Here's my take on each player

Daniels/Griffin: I'm lumping them together because at this point they're one and the same for all intents and purposes. A couple of aging veterans (PD more so) who are valuable locker room guys and not everydown run-stoppers. I think one of them is gone and in the end it will be Phillip Daniels.

Anthony Montgomery: Next to DeAngelo Hall, re-signing this guy to a long term contract should be a priority. We can build a defensive line around this guy.

Kedric Golston: He probably plays above his talent level. He's best served as a back-up, but we haven't had the luxury of consistently playing him as a back-up. I'd bring him back because he's young and provides depth.

Andre Carter: Until his restructuring, I thought 2009 would be his last year with the team. Now I'm not as sure. I was a big proponent of signing him as I thought he would add the missing pass-rusher we needed. When he's good, he's very good but it's not often enough. He's not a one man show, like some other dominant DEs. He needs help to be successful. If we can provide that for him somehow, he can be a 10+ sack guy again.

Jason Taylor: I think last year was an unfortunate fluke health-wise. He showed though in the few games that he was healthy how disruptive a force he can be. He's not getting any younger so that has to be taken into consideration. There's been a lot of speculation of playing him at linebacker and if the season started today I'd say he's the starting WLB (with Rocky moving to the strong side). I think he and AC can be effective on the field together, just not at opposite ends of the same line.

Lorenzo Alexander: If nothing changed between now and the start of the season personnel wise I'd start this guy next to Montgomery. That's as much an indictment of the lack of quality along the interior as it is a testament to Alexander's hard work and underrated skills. I was very impressed with him last year and think he's a solid 3rd DT.

DeMetric Evans: Here's another overachiever who has been a solid part of this team for a while now and has stepped in admirably when needed. That said, I'd let him go. He's a 30-year old jack of all trades, master of none and it's time to start cutting the cords on some of those guys.

Chris Wilson: He may be better suited to be a linebacker. But he really needs to show he can excel as a situational pass-rusher this spring/summer or he could be gone.

Rob Jackson: Whatever it is the team sees in him, I'm not seeing it. Not yet at least.

Alex Buzbee: I know the team is very high on him as a pass-rushing specialist. If he's back from his knee injury he becomes the White N.D. Kalu right away.

Ryan Boschetti: He'll be cut..and probably back again in October

Free Agents: On the DL, there's really no one out there that's really worth bringing in so I think we look elsewhere, which leaves the draft (because I doubt we're making any trades)

Draft: In my perfect world we somehow are able to get an OL and still somehow add Tyson Jackson who gives you basically a young Phillip Daniels that can play DE and DT, and add Connor Barwin who would be a DE/LB freak of nature. Other names to consider are SenDerrick Marks, Dorell Scott as possible DTs, and a guy who is flying under the radar it seems-Paul Kruger at DE.

At the end of the day, I think the changes are minimal for 2009. I think we may add a player but really it will be a reshuffling of the players we already have.

[53Fan]

Originally Posted by The Goat

... I've seen a handful of mocks that have us taking Orakpo @ 13. I don't understand this. Nagging knee injuries forced him to miss time the last two years and his size doesn't permit him to be a monster run-stopper @ LDE. I tend to agree w/ GTripp that the only d-linemen worth the 13th overall is Raji and yeah it looks like he'll be long gone.

I agree about Raji but don't overlook Peria Jerry. He is rising fast and is a force in the middle. He is double teamed alot and at times triple teamed. He would certainly help free up our D-ends.

[Dirtbag59]

Originally Posted by 53Fan

I agree about Raji but don't overlook Peria Jerry. He is rising fast and is a force in the middle. He is double teamed alot and at times triple teamed. He would certainly help free up our D-ends.

I never trust guys that rise to fast. Dewayne Robertson being the poster boy for coming out of nowhere. Still your post takes the cake. I've now heard about this Jerry guy enough that I guess it's worth my time to take a look at him. At the very least his measureables remind me of Trevor Laws.

[53Fan]

Originally Posted by Dirtbag359

I never trust guys that rise to fast. Dewayne Robertson being the poster boy for coming out of nowhere. Still your post takes the cake. I've now heard about this Jerry guy enough that I guess it's worth my time to take a look at him. At the very least his measureables remind me of Trevor Laws.

Yeah I hear you Dirtbag but he was very well thought of to begin with. He's just becoming even more impressive now as he's being looked at more closely.

[MTK]

Personally I hope we can keep Evans, I'd rather keep him and dump Daniels.

[dmek25]

i think my outlook on our line, and the front office outlook are totally different. the skins have gotten to a point that they really have little flexibility in what they can do. Daniels and Griffith have long out lived their shelve life. probably should have been gone 2 seasons ago. Alexander probably couldn't make another N.F.L roster. like others have stated, Golston is simply a back up. any younger talent would help immediately. but the skins front office seems to like Daniels, and his smaller salary.

[#56fanatic]

I am really not trying to be an ass, but how many times can we discuss the some old things over and over. Go back and look at how many D-line threads we have had over the year....

that being said....Dont put all our money into Haynesworth or Peppers. It would be a mistake this franchise has made time and time again. Peppers will 30 and at the back end of his prime, and Haynesworth has had past dedication issues, which may surface again after the huge payday. I say you draft which ever is there at 13, or trade down and get a couple of more picks (which I would rather us do). We can fill with quality players in FA, not supposed superstars.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by #56fanatic

I am really not trying to be an ass, but how many times can we discuss the some old things over and over. Go back and look at how many D-line threads we have had over the year....

that being said....Dont put all our money into Haynesworth or Peppers. It would be a mistake this franchise has made time and time again. Peppers will 30 and at the back end of his prime, and Haynesworth has had past dedication issues, which may surface again after the huge payday. I say you draft which ever is there at 13, or trade down and get a couple of more picks (which I would rather us do). We can fill with quality players in FA, not supposed superstars.

Thanks for being an ass.

#1 it's the offseason, and #2 if you stick around here long enough believe me you're going to see repeated topics.

And #3 if you don't like a thread, why comment at all?

[MTK]

It's important to keep Golston and Montgomery because they are valuable rotation guys but honestly I was pretty disappointed in Monty last year. I was expecting him to blossom and instead he seemed to take a step backwards.

[53Fan]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

It's important to keep Golston and Montgomery because they are valuable rotation guys but honestly I was pretty disappointed in Monty last year. I was expecting him to blossom and instead he seemed to take a step backwards.

I'm not taking up for Monty but he was injured at the beginning of the year and Golston got the nod over him. But I agree, it's time for him to step up and make an impact. With his size and strength he needs to step his game up a couple of notches or is he always going to be the sleeping giant?

[Gmanc711]

Overall I'm much more concerned offensivley, than defensivley at all positions including the line...but looking just at the dline at this point.....

Keeping Evans/Golston/Montgomery are priorities to me.

At this point, I think having Griffin, Daniels, Taylor makes our team better next season, but in the long run, I think they'll all be gone anyways before we make any realistic impact in the playoffs....

I just want to get younger and faster at the defensive end position & bigger at the D. Tackle position...

I will say I'm very suprised we extended Andre Carter....I thought he's been ok, but nothing spectacular here.

[SBXVII]

So here's what it looks like to me;
1. We don't have the CAP room to get any superstars in FA(hanesworth, Suggs).
2. There is only one outstanding DL in the draft and he will be gone.
3. We can cut the 30 yr olds and get same talent out of the younger ones.
4. Any cheap FA's will be no better then what we have.
5. Anyone taken in the draft probably will not be an impact immediatly.

So basically....we are left with two choices. Keep what we have until 2010 when cap goes bye bye and hope we are 4th ranked D again and build up or Offense so it can score points or dump some of the older players and pray the younger ones step up and can be a 4th ranked D again. Hope or pray we get a diamond in the rough who can start immediatly on Defense. ....am I correct?

I don't think our D was bad considering it was 4th ranked but it did not look exciting. It did not look like a dominant 4th ranked team. It looked like a team that got lucky sometimes to get to be 4th ranked. It looked like it struggled all season at different spots but namely DE and DT. No pass rush. A nice pass rush creates turn overs by forcing the QB to throw early for interceptions, get sacked, or create fumbles. With out it we put alot of pressure on our CB's and Safeties to perform above par. From what I keep hearing we either need a sub par back field but a great DL; ie Giants, Eagles, Dallas or a sub par DL that will hold the line and stop the run with an excellent back field. Well if we sign Hall we are partially on our way to having the excellent back field. Springs can't stay healthy long enough during the season to be worth the money we are paying him. Smoot has slowed. I like Rogers but he's wanting a payday I believe and some think he's not a top notch CB. I like also and think he gets the job done. Whether tackling the WR or batting the ball away he not as bad as some in the league.

But if our back field has to be stellar Rogers may need to be replaced. He sometimes misjusdges and WR's get past him. Occassionaly. Hall is a risk taker and tries for the interceptions sometimes missing causing the WR to get past him. Which leaves our safeties. Hopefully they play lights out to pick up where our CB leave off.

All in all. I don't know what we should do. I have no clue as to what the coach's want to do. Where they see the problems are at. However I get the feeling Blache's scheme is not to far off Williams in that most of the pass rush comes from the LB's, CB's or Safeties. Are we going to see much of a difference this year from last year? Probably not. So I would think Zorn is happy with the 4th place finish and knowing we have beaten the NFC playoff teams. If we can keep it in that ball park and step up the offense to control the ball better and score points or be able to score more then the opponent we should be a better team and go farther. Just an assumption.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

It's important to keep Golston and Montgomery because they are valuable rotation guys but honestly I was pretty disappointed in Monty last year. I was expecting him to blossom and instead he seemed to take a step backwards.

Ditto on Monty. I haven't at all given up on this kid though and really hope he's the x-factor this season... added pressure up the middle will pay dividends for our DEs and hopefully for the addition at SLB.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Nice thread.

My thoughts are that OL and LB will, and should, be higher priorities this off-season. Here's my take on each player

I agree 100% and said expressed the same idea in another thread. Your player analysis for these guys was spot-on as well. a very nice read.

A few responses to some interesting points you brought up:

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Andre Carter: Until his restructuring, I thought 2009 would be his last year with the team. Now I'm not as sure.

For what its worth, cap-wise, the restructure actually makes it easier to cut him after 2009. It also reduces the cap hit for keeping him so if he suddenly starts performing at a higher level, we can keep him at a lower rate (short-term, atleast).

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Jason Taylor: I think last year was an unfortunate fluke health-wise. He showed though in the few games that he was healthy how disruptive a force he can be. He's not getting any younger so that has to be taken into consideration. There's been a lot of speculation of playing him at linebacker and if the season started today I'd say he's the starting WLB (with Rocky moving to the strong side). I think he and AC can be effective on the field together, just not at opposite ends of the same line.

a very very interesting idea... if we could restructure Taylor to lower his cap hit to 5.5M/year or less, i would be all for it. It would certainly allow us to postpone addressing LB for another year or two and focus more of our draft picks in 2009 and 2010 on the lines. However, if we cant get sign him to an extension with a lower cap figure, i think the cost vs. age vs. health vs. new position (4-3 OLB) makes keeping him too risky of an option.

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Lorenzo Alexander: If nothing changed between now and the start of the season personnel wise I'd start this guy next to Montgomery. That's as much an indictment of the lack of quality along the interior as it is a testament to Alexander's hard work and underrated skills. I was very impressed with him last year and think he's a solid 3rd DT.

If Griffin is on the roster and healthy, theres no way i'd start Alexander over Griff... but id certainly consider allowing him to compete with Monty for the role. On the flip side, if we decided to cut ties with Griff, id be very comfortable with giving Alexander a shot there. One other move id consider (if we are able to keep Evans, Monty, Griff, and Golston) is moving Alexander (gasp) back to offensive guard. He seemed to be doing well there when he was a flex player and we only moved him to DT because, at the time, we had more depth at guard. Now, things are completely reversed. I'm not sure if its something Alexander would even want to do, but id atleast explore the option if we felt Alexander could start at RG for us in 2009. Otherwise, we're best suited to keep him on defense.

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

DeMetric Evans: Here's another overachiever who has been a solid part of this team for a while now and has stepped in admirably when needed. That said, I'd let him go. He's a 30-year old jack of all trades, master of none and it's time to start cutting the cords on some of those guys.

This is the only place where i semi-disagree with you. If we cut Evans, who do we have to take his place opposite Carter? We certainly dont have anyone in-house who can do the job and the FA market for DEs is very slim this year. Cutting Evans almost necessitates we use our first pick in the draft on his replacement, and id rather see us use that pick on an OT. If Evans is wanting an obscene amount of money, of course we have to let him go. But he's certaily productive and versitile enough to warrant extending (if the price is right).

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

I agree 100% and said expressed the same idea in another thread. Your player analysis for these guys was spot-on as well. a very nice read.

Thanks. I put my heart into the post