Supreme Court Upholds Health Care Mandate

[Alvin Walton]

Welcome to this socialist nation.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by Alvin Walton

Welcome to this socialist nation.

Police protection, fire departments, and public schools are a lot more socialist than the Affordable Care Act. Should we do away with these socialist realities?

[Alvin Walton]

Originally Posted by Lotus

Police protection, fire departments, and public schools are a lot more socialist than the Affordable Care Act. Should we do away with these socialist realities?

You're comparing apples and oranges.
Who says private fire protection would not work?
And their are plenty of private schools that work.

Lets have the govt run all theme parks too and grocery stores and professional sports and stuff.
Lets make the govt really big.....

[Giantone]

Originally Posted by Alvin Walton

You're comparing apples and oranges.
Who says private fire protection would not work?
And their are plenty of private schools that work.

Lets have the govt run all theme parks too and grocery stores and professional sports and stuff.
Lets make the govt really big.....

....the sky is falling,the sky is falling.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by Alvin Walton

You're comparing apples and oranges.
Who says private fire protection would not work?
And their are plenty of private schools that work.

Lets have the govt run all theme parks too and grocery stores and professional sports and stuff.
Lets make the govt really big.....

You missed my point.

We already have socialist entities in our midst: Medicare, law enforcement, fire protection, public schools, post office, etc. Most people seem to like these things, too.

In comparison, the Affordable Care Act is really not very socialist. It does not pool tax money to provide a public service like these other entities do. There is an expansion of Medicare, sure, but it's not like the ACA invented Medicare.

So arguing against the ACA because it is "socialist" actually is a non-argument, regardless of the popularity of this argument. The ACA is actually less socialist than many things that are already in our midst and that most people accept.

[Chico23231]

Rather make an attempt to restructure healthcare and try something new than sit back like a bunch of dipshits on the right and do nothing. Anybody who has a clue knows rising healthcare costs over the last ten years and with massive aging population, something needed to been now. Yet the right bitches and moans and offers no plan. Please check the figures on health care spending by this country over the last 10 years, do you think we need to do something?

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

Rather make an attempt to restructure healthcare and try something new than sit back like a bunch of dipshits on the right and do nothing. Anybody who has a clue knows rising healthcare costs over the last ten years and with massive aging population, something needed to been now. Yet the right bitches and moans and offers no plan. Please check the figures on health care spending by this country over the last 10 years, do you think we need to do something?

This plan has been tried by Mass. and they pay the highest premium IN THE COUNTRY for health ins. This is not new its just a bad plan.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by firstdown

This plan has been tried by Mass. and they pay the highest premium IN THE COUNTRY for health ins. This is not new its just a bad plan.

They are also one of the states with the highest cost of living. Your point?

News Headlines



Let's delve further into your claim about the health insurance and see what we can find. Oooo...lookie here. I want you to read the whole article so that why you won't be propagating misleading info.

Does Massachusetts Have the Nation’s Highest Health Insurance Premiums? It Depends. - Health Stew - Boston.com

Some things help to explain the difference. Massachusetts health insurance tends to include lower deductibles and other kinds of cost sharing which are much higher in most other states, a difference that inflates MA premiums as compared with those in other states. Massachusetts has the highest proportion of physicians, nurses and many other health professional categories than all other states. And our costs have always been the highest, not just since the Massachusetts health reform law passed in 2006. But still, guilty as charged.

There are other key differences, and the most important one is income. Massachusetts had the 4th highest median household income among the 50 states in 2010 (after Maryland, New Jersey, and Connecticut). That accounts for a big part of the difference. The raw (unadjusted) premiums shown above don't take into account ability to pay. For example, assume Ms. M lives in Massachusetts and has $100 in income and health insurance premiums costing $20. Then assume Mr. A lives in Arkansas, has income of $50, and health insurance premiums costing $15. Even though Mr. A pays less, he is paying 30% of his income and Ms. M is paying 20% of hers. Who is worse off? I think Mr. A from Arkansas.

Checkmate.

[firstdown]

[QUOTE=NC_Skins;923060]They are also one of the states with the highest cost of living. Your point?

News Headlines



Let's delve further into your claim about the health insurance and see what we can find. Oooo...lookie here. I want you to read the whole article so that why you won't be propagating misleading info.

Does Massachusetts Have the Nation’s Highest Health Insurance Premiums? It Depends. - Health Stew - Boston.com




Checkmate.[/QUOTE

Well I guess you can also explain why the Mass. healthcare cost are increasing faster then the national average.

[NC_Skins]

Originally Posted by firstdown

Well I guess you can also explain why the Mass. healthcare cost are increasing faster then the national average.

In case you missed it one more time. Far and away better than most states it seems, but you GOPers like to try and use numbers to skew things.



Nice try. (not really)

[Giantone]

Wonkbook: Some very good news for Obamacare



Wonkbook: Some very good news for Obamacare
Obamacare got some very good news on Thursday.
In 2009, the Congressional Budget Office predicted that a medium-level “silver” plan — which covers 70 percent of a beneficiary’s expected health costs — on the California health exchange would cost $5,200 annually. More recently, a report from the consulting firm Milliman predicted it would carry a $450 monthly premium. Yesterday, we got the real numbers. And they’re lower than anyone thought.
As always, Sarah Kliff has the details. The California exchange will have 13 insurance options, and the heavy competition appears to be driving down prices. The most affordable silver-level plan is charging $276-a-month. The second-most affordable plan is charging $294. And all this is before subsidies. Someone making twice the poverty line, say, will only pay $104-a-month.
Sparer plans are even cheaper. A young person buying the cheapest “bronze”-level plan will pay $172 — and that, again, is before any subsidies.
California is a particularly important test for Obamacare. It’s not just the largest state in the nation. It’s also one of the states most committed to implementing Obamacare effectively. Under Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger — remember how that really happened? — California was the first state to begin building its insurance exchanges. The state’s outreach efforts are unparalleled. Its insurance regulators are working hard to bring in good plans and make sure they’re playing fair. If California can’t make the law work, perhaps no one can. But if California can make the law work, it shows that others can, too.
And perhaps others will. We’re beginning to see competition drive down proposed rates in some exchanges around the country. Remember Maryland, where CareFirst grabbed headlines with a shocking 25 percent proposed increase in rates? More plans have streamed in with lower bids. Kaiser Permanente, for instance, is only increasing its rates next year by 4.3 percent — a modest increase that will make CareFirst’s proposal almost impossible to sustain. My guess is when the exchange actually opens in October, CareFirst will have dropped its price substantially. If they don’t, then Kaiser and others will grab all the market share.

[Giantone]

More Good News on the Health Care Mandate.

Thanks To Obamacare, Major Insurers Have To Give Back $36 Million To California Small Businesses | ThinkProgress

"On Tuesday, Golden State small businesses and their employees got some great news: two of the state’s largest insurers will have to give them over $36 million in insurance rebates because of an Obamacare consumer protection.

The health law forces insurers to spend at least 80 percent of the premiums they charge on paying for actual medical services, rather than administrative overhead or profits. That means more money for ordinary consumers — and less for profitable insurance companies.

The so-called “80/20 rule” put $1.5 billion back into Americans’ pockets in 2011 alone. The average rebate was $151 per family across all insurance markets, and in states where insurers blatantly gouged prices, average rebates topped a whopping $500 per family.

Now, the benefits for Californians with small business health plans are beginning to materialize. Blue Shield of California will be forced to pay back $24.5 million in rebates. Anthem Blue Cross will have to pay back another $12 million.

While cheering the latest numbers as a victory for California small businesses and their employees, consumer advocates argue that the insurance industry should try harder to proactively lower costs for companies and individuals.

“Health insurers should work to cut upfront premiums rather than reimburse consumers afterward,” said Jon Fox, consumer advocate at the California Public Interest Research Group Education Fund, in an interview with the Los Angeles Times. “Millions of dollars in rebates are a clear sign that health insurers are overcharging consumers.” "

[saden1]

I expected the the conservative court to strike down the individual mandate but I guess Robert was in legacy protection mode. It wasn't all good news though, the chief justice parsed the law such that the feds can't tell states "take xxxx action or else we won't give you monies."

Regardless, I can't wait to hear Romney dance his way around the issue. You guys sent the only guy who can least talk about Obamacare with a knife to a gun fight.

[12thMan]

The Court did the right thing.

[NC_Skins]

CNN wasn't the only news outlet with egg on their face.