BJ and the Bears

RedskinPete · 03-29-2004, 06:18 PM

It sounds like the Skins have a plan!!! The last ten years has been hell!!!! So what ever they do with the three picks they have I know the Redskins and Gibbs will get what they need!!! Beat Dallas!!! I am so tired of they winning ever game so now it's our time to run of some wins...Right?

SKINSnCANES · 03-29-2004, 06:19 PM

yea looks like they got the trade in before they had to pay the bonus so it didnt cost them anything. Appears Winslow might be in our future. They may want to trade down but since the Lions picked up Marion they might want to snag Winslow, trading down might be a bad idea.

Hail to the Redskins · 03-29-2004, 08:57 PM

Just a random thought...

I have some feeling inside me that this whole BJ was a little game involving Snyder and the league....

I think the Saints overpaid for Johnson, trying to "stick it" to Snyder and the 'Skins for playing the RFA game on the Jets last year...

So then Snyder PROBABLY got pissed, because he is one hell of a smart business guy and competitor and said, ok, you wanna play that game? We'll match that offer and deal him somewhere else BESIDES you and GET a draft pick in the process...

Anyone notice that of the 3 teams trying to trade for BJ, the Saints weren't mentioned??

Nice work FO... we ARE the official kings of the RFA game...

SmootSmack · 03-30-2004, 12:48 AM

nice observation Hail

RedskinPete · 03-30-2004, 01:24 AM

Snyders move on BJ's sign and trade could it be done again. Now that teams know the hole in thier deal. Can those holes be taken care of?

AnonEmouse · 03-30-2004, 06:16 AM

It could only be done again if a team makes an offer sheet w/o a signing bonus. It was a surprise the Saints didn't think of this when they made the offer (I thought there was one as nothing either way had been mentioned).

If clubs put a SB on the deal, the trading team must take the financial and cap hit on the bonus even if they are traded. Makes the deal very doubtful as they'll be paying cash to make the trade happen and creating dead space in to the bargain. Unless the trade is too good to turn down, I'd expect to see more SB's on offer sheets from here on out.

Beemnseven · 03-30-2004, 09:13 AM

Let's see, we lose a potential starting H-back in Bryan Johnson for a sixth round pick who's most likely headed for the practice squad?

I'm not as enthused about this deal as everyone else.

MTK · 03-30-2004, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

Let's see, we lose a potential starting H-back in Bryan Johnson for a sixth round pick who's most likely headed for the practice squad?

I'm not as enthused about this deal as everyone else.

We were going to lose him anyway Beems, and at the hefty contract the Saints offered him it put the Skins right up against the cap limit. At least they got something instead of nothing is the main point.

SKINSnCANES · 03-30-2004, 03:34 PM

Gibbs apparently has a plan. Was Rock at the minicamp? Anyone know how Gibbs plans to use him? I dont know if Rock would be as good of a blocker for Portis. If we had Winslow, a play action fake to Portis or Winslow out of the backfield would have defenses scambaling to decide who to cover

skinsfanthru&thru · 03-30-2004, 04:54 PM

plus a few reports r saying that Sellars did pretty well at the mini camp and could fill that role.

skinsfanthru&thru · 03-30-2004, 09:47 PM

I don't know if anyone has read this 2 or not but on espn's john clayton's quick hits, he talks about how the saints were willing to send a 5th round pick to washington for johnson but because of a rule stating that when a team matches an offer for a restricted player, they can't in turn trade said player to the team who offered the matched contract. Kinda sucks but I'm not sure how many spots different the two picks r. I'm just glad we got something for losing him.

joecrisp · 03-30-2004, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

We were going to lose him anyway Beems, and at the hefty contract the Saints offered him it put the Skins right up against the cap limit. At least they got something instead of nothing is the main point.

That's exactly why the trade made sense. Yes, it sucks that the Skins lost Johnson, but if they had retained him, it would have caused too many problems with this year's cap. They were able to get a small consolation prize out of the loss, at least.

In hindsight (which, as we all know, is always 20/20), the best thing for the Skins probably would have been to give Johnson the 1st-round tender, which would have cost them $1.115 million against this year's cap (assuming he wasn't signed to a long-term deal), instead of the $2.2 million cap charge he would have carried under the Saints' deal, which the Skins were forced to match. Though there was a good market for Johnson's services, there's no chance anyone would have sacrificed a 1st rounder for Johnson, so the Skins would have had their man-- at half the cost he would have been.

SKINSnCANES · 03-30-2004, 10:55 PM

Id love a first round pick for Johnson. It wouldnt have happened but just think, we could have had two picks on teh first day!!

joecrisp · 03-30-2004, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SKINSnCANES

Gibbs apparently has a plan. Was Rock at the minicamp? Anyone know how Gibbs plans to use him? I dont know if Rock would be as good of a blocker for Portis. If we had Winslow, a play action fake to Portis or Winslow out of the backfield would have defenses scambaling to decide who to cover

Yes, Rock was at minicamp, but he was used exclusively out of the runningback spot, rather than the H-back spot where a fullback-type player would normally fit. This probably has a lot to do with Cartwright's frame, which at 5-7, 223 lbs, is much smaller than than the prototypical H-back. The guys Gibbs has been primarily using at H-back (Sellers, Chamberlain, Royal) average over 6-2, 255 lbs.

In blocking mode, the H-backs are frequently matched up against defensive ends and linebackers, working in tandem with the tight ends to negate a defensive overload or blitz. Cartwright doesn't have superior blocking technique to make up for his lack of size, and therefore is a bad fit for the H-back spot.

He looked okay at runningback, but didn't do anything special, really. In all fairness, though, it was difficult to take a whole lot out of the runningback's performances, since these were limited-contact practices.

I agree with you on the Winslow scenario. The possibilities for this offense with that kid in there are just mind-boggling.

joecrisp · 03-30-2004, 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skinsfanthru&thru

plus a few reports r saying that Sellars did pretty well at the mini camp and could fill that role.

Sellers was far and away the leader at the H-back spot. I think Bugel and Gibbs are pretty enamored with him. He was made to be an H-back.

I don't think Gibbs' desire to keep Johnson was so much an indication that he wasn't confident in any of the other guys at the position, so much as it was a desire to have at least two very solid guys in there that he could rotate and keep fresh, as well as provide quality depth at a critical position.

03-29-2004, 06:19 PM	#17
SKINSnCANES Pro Bowl Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: New Jersey Age: 42 Posts: 5,454	yea looks like they got the trade in before they had to pay the bonus so it didnt cost them anything. Appears Winslow might be in our future. They may want to trade down but since the Lions picked up Marion they might want to snag Winslow, trading down might be a bad idea. __________________ "I'm used to winning, coming from the University of Miami. " Clinton Portis

03-29-2004, 08:57 PM	#18
Hail to the Redskins The Starter Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 1,687	Just a random thought... I have some feeling inside me that this whole BJ was a little game involving Snyder and the league.... I think the Saints overpaid for Johnson, trying to "stick it" to Snyder and the 'Skins for playing the RFA game on the Jets last year... So then Snyder PROBABLY got pissed, because he is one hell of a smart business guy and competitor and said, ok, you wanna play that game? We'll match that offer and deal him somewhere else BESIDES you and GET a draft pick in the process... Anyone notice that of the 3 teams trying to trade for BJ, the Saints weren't mentioned?? Nice work FO... we ARE the official kings of the RFA game... __________________ “Sometimes it is not enough to our best; we must do what is required.” - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

03-30-2004, 12:48 AM	#19
SmootSmack Uncle Phil Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 45,256	nice observation Hail __________________ You're So Vain...You Probably Think This Sig Is About You

03-30-2004, 03:34 PM	#24
SKINSnCANES Pro Bowl Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: New Jersey Age: 42 Posts: 5,454	Gibbs apparently has a plan. Was Rock at the minicamp? Anyone know how Gibbs plans to use him? I dont know if Rock would be as good of a blocker for Portis. If we had Winslow, a play action fake to Portis or Winslow out of the backfield would have defenses scambaling to decide who to cover __________________ "I'm used to winning, coming from the University of Miami. " Clinton Portis

03-30-2004, 10:55 PM	#28
SKINSnCANES Pro Bowl Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: New Jersey Age: 42 Posts: 5,454	Id love a first round pick for Johnson. It wouldnt have happened but just think, we could have had two picks on teh first day!! __________________ "I'm used to winning, coming from the University of Miami. " Clinton Portis

03-29-2004, 06:18 PM	#16
RedskinPete The Starter Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Camino,Ca Posts: 1,174	It sounds like the Skins have a plan!!! The last ten years has been hell!!!! So what ever they do with the three picks they have I know the Redskins and Gibbs will get what they need!!! Beat Dallas!!! I am so tired of they winning ever game so now it's our time to run of some wins...Right?

03-30-2004, 01:24 AM	#20
RedskinPete The Starter Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Camino,Ca Posts: 1,174	Snyders move on BJ's sign and trade could it be done again. Now that teams know the hole in thier deal. Can those holes be taken care of?

03-30-2004, 06:16 AM	#21
AnonEmouse The Starter Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: UK Age: 58 Posts: 2,441	It could only be done again if a team makes an offer sheet w/o a signing bonus. It was a surprise the Saints didn't think of this when they made the offer (I thought there was one as nothing either way had been mentioned). If clubs put a SB on the deal, the trading team must take the financial and cap hit on the bonus even if they are traded. Makes the deal very doubtful as they'll be paying cash to make the trade happen and creating dead space in to the bargain. Unless the trade is too good to turn down, I'd expect to see more SB's on offer sheets from here on out.

03-30-2004, 09:13 AM	#22
Beemnseven Pro Bowl Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Virginia Beach Age: 50 Posts: 5,311	Let's see, we lose a potential starting H-back in Bryan Johnson for a sixth round pick who's most likely headed for the practice squad? I'm not as enthused about this deal as everyone else.

03-30-2004, 04:54 PM	#25
skinsfanthru&thru Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Richmond, VA Age: 44 Posts: 3,813	plus a few reports r saying that Sellars did pretty well at the mini camp and could fill that role.

03-30-2004, 09:47 PM	#26
skinsfanthru&thru Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Richmond, VA Age: 44 Posts: 3,813	I don't know if anyone has read this 2 or not but on espn's john clayton's quick hits, he talks about how the saints were willing to send a 5th round pick to washington for johnson but because of a rule stating that when a team matches an offer for a restricted player, they can't in turn trade said player to the team who offered the matched contract. Kinda sucks but I'm not sure how many spots different the two picks r. I'm just glad we got something for losing him.

BJ and the Bears

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