The Official Defense Has Major Issues/Fire Jim Haslett Thread

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I'm not for firing Haslett at this point and I don't think we'll end up as bad defensively as we have been the past couple of weeks...but Haslett, you'll recall, wasn't Shanahan's first choice. Will be interesting to see if he's able to lure his first choice over next season

who was the first choice? was it a 3-4 guy?

[saden1]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I'm not for firing Haslett at this point and I don't think we'll end up as bad defensively as we have been the past couple of weeks...but Haslett, you'll recall, wasn't Shanahan's first choice. Will be interesting to see if he's able to lure his first choice over next season

If things don't get better, how can they not when you're dead last, he will most certainly be fired at the end of the season. Shanahan having GTripp0012 Vision™ not withstanding of course.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Defensewins

GTripp,
I have been quiet until now, but this is way wrong. Our LB's play has not been excellent except for screens. I watched the Rams game again last night and only to watch the defense. Our LB's are not playing excellent except for screens.
On Steve Jackson 1st TD for example the left OLB and DE were hooked, they blew containment and the left ILB was blown up the RG. On several other plays and not just in this game the OLB's are not setting the edge well. The DL and LB's arenot playing well together. There is a huge gap left between the DE and OLB on runs around end. Our DE are getting hooked to easy.
Use your stats and feel good about them.
I am not a huge stats guy. I watch the play on the field and our defense is not playing well tegther as a unit.

The Jackson TD was the worst run defense play of the year. So, naturally, we didn't play it all that well (imagine that). Fletcher/Moore missed tackles, the pursuit from Holliday/Haynesworth was lacking. In addition to what you mentioned. That's all it takes sometimes.

Good job going to their most successful play to find something that the LBs overplayed...that took great skill. It's almost as if you knew the result of the play!

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I'm not for firing Haslett at this point and I don't think we'll end up as bad defensively as we have been the past couple of weeks...but Haslett, you'll recall, wasn't Shanahan's first choice. Will be interesting to see if he's able to lure his first choice over next season

Is Mike Zimmer's contract up at the end of this season?

[Defensewins]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I'm not for firing Haslett at this point and I don't think we'll end up as bad defensively as we have been the past couple of weeks...but Haslett, you'll recall, wasn't Shanahan's first choice. Will be interesting to see if he's able to lure his first choice over next season

I agree completely. He will not be fired this year. If things do not improve soon I do not see Haslett here next year.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Was that your C game?

First of all, it's not that uncommon to give up 20 points in a half. It happens 4 or 5 times per week in the NFL. The Texans actually had just done it to the Colts the week before.

That 133 rushing yards comes out to 3.6 yards per carry. Someone can try to convince me that's good (It'd be great if we had not let Jackson go for 42 and a TD on us -- 9 rushes for 16 yards on all of Jackson's other carries, btw), but I'm unconvinced.

7-16 third down conversion is about league average. We don't know how good the Rams offense will look. This might look like a really bad figure at the end of the year (bottom three or four offensive unit), but probably just "meh". We were 0-8 on passing third downs. That's bad vs. anyone.

A 30 pt giveaway necessarily requires that you count the drive that started on the 3 yard line after the Moss turnover. I don't know. Seems to me like it would be unreasonable to expect a team to come away with no points from there. Of course, the Rams had first and goal at the one at the end of the first half and didn't score, so the defense had to have figured out something in that situation.

So the problem is bad luck and the offense?

Seriously, the Texans did it to the Colts is such a piss poor excuse. I expect us to be those 10 other teams that don't allow that to happen. You know, those above avg.

Really, 43% third down conversion is league avg? And here I was thinking you were good with stats.

Fine, they could have given up a field goal but they ended up giving away a TD. Their objective is to make stops. I'll give the Rams 23 pts. We still lose. Happy?

[Defensewins]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

The Jackson TD was the worst run defense play of the year. So, naturally, we didn't play it all that well (imagine that). Fletcher/Moore missed tackles, the pursuit from Holliday/Haynesworth was lacking. In addition to what you mentioned. That's all it takes sometimes.

Good job going to their most successful play to find something that the LBs overplayed...that took great skill. It's almost as if you knew the result of the play!

Dude you take everything so personally. We all make mistakes. And by you saying our LB play is excellent except for screens is incorrect.
No need to take it so personal.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Was that your C game?

First of all, it's not that uncommon to give up 20 points in a half. It happens 4 or 5 times per week in the NFL. The Texans actually had just done it to the Colts the week before.

That 133 rushing yards comes out to 3.6 yards per carry. Someone can try to convince me that's good (It'd be great if we had not let Jackson go for 42 and a TD on us -- 9 rushes for 16 yards on all of Jackson's other carries, btw), but I'm unconvinced.

7-16 third down conversion is about league average. We don't know how good the Rams offense will look. This might look like a really bad figure at the end of the year (bottom three or four offensive unit), but probably just "meh". We were 0-8 on passing third downs. That's bad vs. anyone.

A 30 pt giveaway necessarily requires that you count the drive that started on the 3 yard line after the Moss turnover. I don't know. Seems to me like it would be unreasonable to expect a team to come away with no points from there. Of course, the Rams had first and goal at the one at the end of the first half and didn't score, so the defense had to have figured out something in that situation.

Tripp I think what you're missing is that the Rams are a bad team. We're not talking about the Texans or Cowboys. To allow 24 first downs to a team w/out it's best player and a rookie qb with terrible wr's is just UNACCEPTABLE. No one cares about yards per carry. The bottom line is the defense can't get off the field.

[mooby]

What's really concerning to me is how many points we are giving up in the second half. Against Dallas we gave up a touchdown in the second half and it would've been two touchdowns if Alex Barron wasn't such a crappy player, and we'd also be sitting at 0-3 instead of 1-2 if it wasn't for him. Against Houston we were outscored 20-7 in the second half and against the Rams we were outscored 16-3 in the second half. It's an unsettling trend that needs to be reversed if we are going to win games this season.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by saden1

So the problem is bad luck and the offense?

I don't think they've had bad luck...and the offense is its own animal. If you're going to throw out points against, now you have to consider what role the offense had in field position.

But I don't want to talk points against, I just want to talk defense/defensive numbers.

Teams haven't been able to run the ball on us this year like a lot of people thought they'd be able to based on the preseason. We clearly lapsed on 2 TD runs last Sunday. Neither play was good effort. But that's the only rushing TDs against us this year.

I think our pass defense has been poor, mitigated by the fact that we have a strong, consistently effective pass rush. In other words, it's the same strengths and weaknesses as last year.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

who was the first choice? was it a 3-4 guy?

It was Mike Zimmer-who just signed a new contract, but if he gets a promotion (i.e. assistant head coach) he could be ours. Or we could promote option 2A Bob Slowik. Either way, Shanahan's track record with DCs would say that Haslett is on a short leash. Though I don't know if it's entirely his fault. Haslett's not the one (to my knowledge) who said let's go after Maake, battle with AH, address our linebacker situation by moving Alexander to LB and Jarmon and then move him to DE, and sit arguably our second most explosive pass rushing LB in Chris Wilson.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

Tripp I think what you're missing is that the Rams are a bad team. We're not talking about the Texans or Cowboys. To allow 24 first downs to a team w/out it's best player and a rookie qb with terrible wr's is just UNACCEPTABLE. No one cares about yards per carry. The bottom line is the defense can't get off the field.

I largely agree. We still cant get off the field w/o the benefit of a turnover. But I also know we had the same problem last year with a lot of the same personnel.

It's not because of scheme that we can't get off the field though. I can tell you that for certain. Our big plays against have dropped significantly as soon as we started playing a real defense. Our turnovers created are way up. Our sack production is consistent with last year.

Yards against per play is the only place things are worse than last year, and I showed in the Detroit/St. Louis direct comparison how even that number (at least vs. the rookie quarterback that YOU YOURSELF SAID WAS UNACCEPTABLE) was worse under the prior regime than the current one. It's got to get better to be a productive defense, but people asserting that the front seven scheme is a problem have proven to be full of it.

[CrustyRedskin]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

It was Mike Zimmer-who just signed a new contract, but if he gets a promotion (i.e. assistant head coach) he could be ours. Or we could promote option 2A Bob Slowik. Either way, Shanahan's track record with DCs would say that Haslett is on a short leash. Though I don't know if it's entirely his fault. Haslett's not the one (to my knowledge) who said let's go after Maake, battle with AH, address our linebacker situation by moving Alexander to LB and Jarmon and then move him to DE, and sit arguably our second most explosive pass rushing LB in Chris Wilson.

I got one for ya Smack!! Where are we sitting after these four games?
WAS @ PHI
GB @ WAS
IND @ WAS
WAS @ CHI

[saden1]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I don't think they've had bad luck...and the offense is its own animal. If you're going to throw out points against, now you have to consider what role the offense had in field position.

But I don't want to talk points against, I just want to talk defense/defensive numbers.

Teams haven't been able to run the ball on us this year like a lot of people thought they'd be able to based on the preseason. We clearly lapsed on 2 TD runs last Sunday. Neither play was good effort. But that's the only rushing TDs against us this year.

I think our pass defense has been poor, mitigated by the fact that we have a strong, consistently effective pass rush. In other words, it's the same strengths and weaknesses as last year.

Through 3 games the Skins have given up 1271 (423.7 avg per game), 977 passing yards (325.3 avg), and 294 yards rushing (98 avg yards) and have given up 22.3 pts a game. I don't know how these numbers can look good to you or any other sane person. Even for a beautifier like you these numbers are indefensible.

We f'ing lost to the Rams! Without their #1 receiver and #1 running back for the majority of the game and a rookie qb!

p.s. my other post was mended.

[artmonkforhallofamein07]

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