Brunell & Other Offseason Moves (Merged Thread)

[steveo395]

if campbells starting to look pretty decent in the offseason, i say just start him....he'll only get better and the best way for a qb to learn is to play

they need a #2 receiver and backup o-lineman

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by offiss

...it will be curious to see what we do with our next to nothing draft picks this year?

I don't much disagree with most of this post but I wouldn't call our draft pciks next to nothing. A second rounder will be a quality guy for us if choosen well. And good depth guys are always available in the 4th. It's not like all our picks are turds.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

I don't much disagree with most of this post but I wouldn't call our draft pciks next to nothing. A second rounder will be a quality guy for us if choosen well. And good depth guys are always available in the 4th. It's not like all our picks are turds.

And there's always potential trades to pick up additional picks... Ramsey, LaVar??

[offiss]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

And there's always potential trades to pick up additional picks... Ramsey, LaVar??

Speaking of Lavar, did anyone notice him getting yanked when we gave up the first down on that screen to his side, I wonder who missed their assingnment?

Matty I would love to get anything for Lavar at this point, I just don't believe after this season he has much value.

Do you think it's wise to trade Ramsey at this point?

[MTK]

Originally Posted by offiss

Speaking of Lavar, did anyone notice him getting yanked when we gave up the first down on that screen to his side, I wonder who missed their assingnment?

Matty I would love to get anything for Lavar at this point, I just don't believe after this season he has much value.

Do you think it's wise to trade Ramsey at this point?

I definitely think LaVar would have some value, I don't think anybody would want him with his current deal but if he were to agree to sign a new deal upon being traded I definitely think there's a market for him.

As for Ramsey who knows. I certainly wouldn't want to deal him, I think he could still have a shot at being the starter next year but it's all up to him. If he feels he doesn't have a realistic shot here he could ask to be traded. I guess we'll see how things play out.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by offiss

Speaking of Lavar, did anyone notice him getting yanked when we gave up the first down on that screen to his side, I wonder who missed their assingnment?

Matty I would love to get anything for Lavar at this point, I just don't believe after this season he has much value.

Do you think it's wise to trade Ramsey at this point?

I think Lavar would command a huge ammount of value. I would be surprised if a late 1st and possibly a later round pick was the best we could get. Seems to me most of the league still thinks he is a great LB. (I think he is but that's another matter.) The out of position stuff isn't new but it simply didn't fit so well here so far. Other teams will ignore that in lew of the great athleticism and game changing abilities. Unless of course they think we are going to cut him. Then we'll get nothing or next to nothing. It is probably the biggest off-season story for this team.

[offiss]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

I don't much disagree with most of this post but I wouldn't call our draft pciks next to nothing. A second rounder will be a quality guy for us if choosen well. And good depth guys are always available in the 4th. It's not like all our picks are turds.

I didn't even think we had a #2, still a late 2, other than Cooley in the third who do we have to show in the later rounds, or even the second round? I believe Jansen was our last real good second rounder, if there are others I am unaware.

Dockery, I guess but he's not a world beater that's for sure.

[dgack]

Originally Posted by offiss

I kinda believe that our offensive woe's are due to his inability to take chances downfield, late in the game when there's nothing to lose he will take shots, kind of funny how things start opening up on offense when he has done that.

So if he runs the plays as he's told and takes a coverage sack, that's his fault? If the pocket folds and he's got nobody to throw to, and he dances and throws it away, you're blaming him?

And where is that third receiver he's supposed to check down to, that you're alluding to?

The reason "things start opening up on offense when he has done that" (taking chances downfield late in the game) is because the defense is typically playing a prevent, not because Brunell is magically deciding to "take chances"...

I'm not saying he is a great QB at this stage in his career. But I think you are naive if you think that making a change at QB is going to fix the "woes" of our offense. Which, I might add, didn't seem too woeful before we entered the playoffs. Coincidence?

How about fatigue.

[dgack]

The front office and finding quality players in late rounds is where the Skins made their living in the 80's and 90's, and I've said it before, it's absolutely where we've SUCKED IT during the Danny Snyder reign.

I don't know much about Vinny Cerrato, but we need to get some Bobby Beathard-style help up there to the front office to make sure we're finding those diamonds in the rough. Cooley's a start.

[offiss]

Originally Posted by dgack

So if he runs the plays as he's told and takes a coverage sack, that's his fault? If the pocket folds and he's got nobody to throw to, and he dances and throws it away, you're blaming him?

And where is that third receiver he's supposed to check down to, that you're alluding to?

The reason "things start opening up on offense when he has done that" (taking chances downfield late in the game) is because the defense is typically playing a prevent, not because Brunell is magically deciding to "take chances"...

I'm not saying he is a great QB at this stage in his career. But I think you are naive if you think that making a change at QB is going to fix the "woes" of our offense. Which, I might add, didn't seem too woeful before we entered the playoffs. Coincidence?

How about fatigue.

You should read everything before you write, I said it could possibly be Brunell playing it safe because that's how Gibbs want's it. So defense's are playing prevent when there only up 1 score? What defenses were the cowboys and the giant's in? Fatigue I am curious what does our offense have to be fatigued about? until the Tampa game [reg season] they did nothing, if anyone has the right to be tired it's our defense, and once again they overwhemingly outplayed our offense.

The reason our offense took off when we hit the cowboy's the second time is because Portis and some of the other players had a meeting with Gibbs and told him we have to stop trying to run the clock out in the second quarter, and so he started to push the offense, and guess what, we went on a tare. But as the games became more important Gibbs became more and more conservative, or Brunell was to scared to take shots downfield, take your pick, because it's one or the other, fatigue had nothing to do with our offense, their one of the most rested offensive unit's in the league.

[dgack]

Originally Posted by offiss

Fatigue I am curious what does our offense have to be fatigued about? until the Tampa game [reg season] they did nothing, if anyone has the right to be tired it's our defense, and once again they overwhemingly outplayed our offense.

Right, because the offense has just been sitting on their asses at home for the past 8 weeks while the defense flew around the country winning games.

Fatigue means injuries, both serious and the little nagging things that add up over a season. Fatigue means you had the hardest schedule in the NFL and a 3rd week bye, so you've been getting clobberered for 13 weeks straight before the playoffs.

Fatigue means Randy Thomas. Ray Brown. Portis. Brunell. Thrash. Betts.

You think our offense is the most rested in the league? Because we had 2 bad playoff games? Did you think the Tampa game was a no-contact scrimmage?

You know what's sad is when fans decide to organize into "offense sucks" and "defense sucks" camps and try to kill each other. The entire team was tired and if you can't see that, well, you're blind.

[offiss]

Originally Posted by dgack

Right, because the offense has just been sitting on their asses at home for the past 8 weeks while the defense flew around the country winning games.

Fatigue means injuries, both serious and the little nagging things that add up over a season. Fatigue means you had the hardest schedule in the NFL and a 3rd week bye, so you've been getting clobberered for 13 weeks straight before the playoffs.

Fatigue means Randy Thomas. Ray Brown. Portis. Brunell. Thrash. Betts.

You think our offense is the most rested in the league? Because we had 2 bad playoff games? Did you think the Tampa game was a no-contact scrimmage?

You know what's sad is when fans decide to organize into "offense sucks" and "defense sucks" camps and try to kill each other. The entire team was tired and if you can't see that, well, you're blind.

Look if you want to feed yourself excuses on why we lost go right ahead, whatever gets you through the day, but our defense was tired from all the 3 and outs from our offense, and still played outstanding, now if your going to tell me running on and off the field will wear an offense out then I stand corrected, they must be the most over worked offense in the playoffs.

And just for the record, Fatigue in no wise coincides with injuries, how you conclude that a backup who hardly play's all season is now burnt because he's had to play 3 games in a row is rational I am not qualified to comprehend, but good luck with it!

I will agree with you I will not go into the offense sucks camps, and here's the proof, our offense is great, it's the reason we made the playoffs, lucky for our defense, if they had to win a game on their own we'd be sunk, again lets have a big round of applause for the best offensive display's seen in recent playoff history.

How Seattle survived losing the league MVP early in the first to injury, I mean fatigue, is beyond me?

[Big C]

unless campbell shows huge strides, brunell will open the year as the starter. however, campbell will get atleast a little game time throughout the year. it is unlikely brunell will stay healthy enough to start all year again

[SC Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by Big C

unless campbell shows huge strides, brunell will open the year as the starter. however, campbell will get atleast a little game time throughout the year. it is unlikely brunell will stay healthy enough to start all year again

I agree with this point. I worry about Brunell too, and the main thing I have found troubling over these past couple of weeks is the thought that Brunell might not be able to put together another season like this one next year and the Redskins might suffer as a result. I am not, however, ready to throw Mark out the door just yet. I think he made good decisions pretty much all year and the team would not have made it this far without him at the helm. As we all realize, Jason Campbell was drafted as the quarterback of the future, but the question becomes when exactly is that future? Given the fact that next year will probably be Gibbs's last I think the team really needs to stick with Brunell as long as he is physically able to perform. Clearly Campbell needs to be ready because Mark might not be able to stay healthy another year but Brunell needs to be the starter on opening day.

Someone made the analogy to Carson Palmer and Jon Kitna. Kitna did have a great year and was then benched in favor of Palmer, but Palmer did not suddenly take off that first year. He was hit and miss and the Bengals went 8-8...it was only in his second season as a starter that he really blossomed. Take a look at any of the guys that sat their first year and then came in to play (Palmer, Culpepper, McNair, Palmer, and even Byron Leftwich who took over for Brunell in Jacksonville), they did not light up the league that first year and they all made mistakes that cost their teams games. I guess you could point to Eli Manning and say he led the Giants to a 11-5 record (but of course Barber had 2,000+ yards from scrimmage) but he also played pretty terribly down the stretch and absolutely bombed in the playoffs. Moreover, all of those guys were Top 10 picks (well Culpepper was #11 - a pick the Vikings obtained from the Redskins in return for Brad Johnson by the way) and both Manning and Culpepper were the first overall selections. That is a long way from Jason Campbell who, by most accounts at least, was probably taken a bit high when the Redskins nabbed him at #25 - most people thought he was a second round pick who still needed some development. Now I am clearly not on the practice field or in the film room with the kid, so maybe he has really shown the coaches something, but I think Brunell probably gives the team the best chance to win and return to the playoffs. Put the pieces around him (as others have mentioned, O-Line depth, a second wideout - Patten is fine as a #3 but not a #2...like I said earlier, I'd love Reggie Wayne, but that might be asking too much) and let him - along with Coach Gibbs - give it one more go.

[BigSKINBauer]

I say we need a BIG reciever next to moss. I would absolutly love Joe jurivisious. I think he will be a FA this year. I liked him before he became dominant and actually got him on my fantasy team early off FA.

Otherwise i want a DE through FA or Draft. I don't want a big name like Freeney. But Kyle Vandn bosh is a FA this year. HE did great this past year with 12.5 sacks. I guess he is now a "big name" but people really don't know him. I would also love Darren Howard as he is a FA too.

Trade wise i guess lavar is gone. He does have trade value. I say package lavar with ramsey(two of my favorite players so i hate this) and trade them together. I place that comes to mind is the raiders. I think we could get either Randy or Porter. I know it sounds crazy but either of them would be great next to Moss. Moss and moss on the same team? Randy moss IS NOT IS NOT IS NOT a bad character player. I have always thought he was misunderstood. Really no joke. Collins is old and it seems people aren't comfortable with him. Give the raiders a great LB to compliment that beast they have on the D-line(derrick burgess-16 sacks). I think it is possible but i am a little emotionally not in my head right now.