No progress in Derrick Dockery Negotiations....

[Schneed10]

One problem I have is the 'Skins will say things like "Marcus Washington makes x, so we can't pay Antonio Pierce more than that."

In a league where the salary cap goes up 7-10% per season, the team has to realize that there is an inflation factor built in. Washington was signed in 2004. Pierce wanted like 3% more than Washington was making, but he wanted it in 2005, one year later than Marcus signed for. The salary cap went up by 7% that year, so since 7% is greater than 3%, on an inflation adjusted basis, Washington woulda been making more.

But the Skins used that angle as the crux of their argument, and no wonder it alienated Pierce, and pissed off a good portion of the locker room. The 'Skins are totally willing to follow the rising cap for free agents, but when it comes to their own players, they pay them based on what their teammates signed for one, two, three years ago.

It's bullsh*t. Pay up for Dockery goddammit. I don't care if it's $35 million over six years with a $10 million signing bonus. He deserves it, and if you don't pay it, you're REALLY going to piss off the 'Skins locker room.

Sometimes I admire the salary cap management and ingenuity of Snyder and Schaffer. But then, I see the team potentially alienating the players with retarded moves like this, and I lose all faith in their understanding of human nature.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by TAFKAS

Good points. I think the bigger question is if we lose Dockery, will God just create another offensive lineman or will one evolve?
(cross promotion of threads!)

LOL

We'll regenerate another Dockery.

[hail_2_da_skins]

Let's not have another Ryan Clark situation. What I mean is, let's not low ball a steady performer and risk not signing him and then have to overpay for a less-talented replacement. Git 'R Done.

[Bill B]

You know the funny thing - instead of the team giving Brandon Lllyod a $10 million bonus they could have redone Dockery's deal and earmarked it for him and not have to be in the current situation - I mean someone else could have given them the 30 catches Llyod made and probably even had a bonus TD or 2 which would have been better than Lloyd. Plus you would have had an extra 3rd and 4th round pick! I know - hindsight is 20-20.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Bill B

You know the funny thing - instead of the team giving Brandon Lllyod a $10 million bonus they could have redone Dockery's deal and earmarked it for him and not have to be in the current situation - I mean someone else could have given them the 30 catches Llyod made and probably even had a bonus TD or 2 which would have been better than Lloyd. Plus you would have had an extra 3rd and 4th round pick! I know - hindsight is 20-20.

But I (and many others) were saying just this at the time of the Lloyd trade. That's not hindsight. That's just the front office giving up a lot to get a guy that, by all accounts, is an average player at best.

Lloyd never really disappointed me here...unfortunately he's just Brandon Lloyd.

[Hog1]

Originally Posted by TAFKAS

Good points. I think the bigger question is if we lose Dockery, will God just create another offensive lineman or will one evolve?
(cross promotion of threads!)

THAT'S humor!!!
#1311

[gibbs4life]

Originally Posted by squrrelco3

I guess the real question is what is he REALLY worth...everyone on the planet, including myself hammers the FO (Gibbs included) for making bad deals by overpaying for marginal players. Why overpay for ANYONE even if he's already on the team I mean I hate to see a "Core Guy" go but not if he wants too much money.

thats when i have a problem too.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

I smell trouble on this one, a whole heap of trouble.

Gibbs has a way of digging in his heels, insisting that Marcus Washington was better than Antonio Pierce, so Pierce should not have been paid more than Marcus. I'm guessing they're thinking along those lines for Randy Thomas and Dock. I'll bet Dock is asking for Randy T money, and Gibbs/Snyder and company won't budge.

Doesn't bode well, IMO. The line will revolt if they don't sign Dockery.

They are not going to revolt. What are they not going to show up for work and cash their large paychecks? Boycott becasue Dock didn't get paid? I don't think so. I'm sure they will be disappointed but they realize that this is business. Guys come and go all the time. Look at the guy that left Seattle for Minn? It's all about who's going to pay me the most money. If Dock can't get the deal he wants here, and someone overpays for him, then let him walk. He's a good player buy not the best and he should not be paid like the best.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by Bill B

You know the funny thing - instead of the team giving Brandon Lllyod a $10 million bonus they could have redone Dockery's deal and earmarked it for him and not have to be in the current situation - I mean someone else could have given them the 30 catches Llyod made and probably even had a bonus TD or 2 which would have been better than Lloyd. Plus you would have had an extra 3rd and 4th round pick! I know - hindsight is 20-20.

The thing is LLoyd never did anything to warrant the money he's getting. Yes he had some highlight catches but does he ever go over the middle? No.

[dmek25]

i want dockery back. if that means a large signing bonus, then so be it. but keep the salary manageable. the players now a days are all about the guaranteed money, anyways

[Pocket$ $traight]

Originally Posted by TheMalcolmConnection

While I think he'll get signed, the problems are definitely the precedent the Skins have set for overpaying people in the past. He'll want a Jansen-like deal I would guess.

There is no way he is looking for a deal like Jansen's. 1. Jansen was considered one of the best right tackles when he signed that deal. 2. Guards are not nearly as coveted as tackles. Hell, Steve Hutchinson's deal wasn't as lucrative as Jansen's and he is light years ahead of Dock.

[Pocket$ $traight]

Originally Posted by jdlea

That's what people need to focus on. I'm not saying "give him whatever he wants." However, they need to keep this group together. There are usually some growing pains when an offensive line gets a new guy...see: Casey Rabach. That didn't go so smoothly his first season. I think they need to keep this group together and hope that they continue to improve.

Portis set the franchise record and they went to the playoff's in Rabach's first season.

[Pocket$ $traight]

Originally Posted by REDSKIN2

Why does it seem like the negotiations in signing our own players are always "far apart" and painful. But throw a Free Agent into the mix and all of sudden we have a contract in seconds flat.

It's like we worry about salary cap ramifications with signing our own players but in signing these big time free agents we don't care.

Interesting to say the least and very frustrating.

You have just stated principal number one of the Dan Snyder marketing machine.

- Covet another's at the expense of your own.

I would think that they would want to keep Dock because Samuels wants to keep him and he offered to restructure to help.

[TheMalcolmConnection]

Originally Posted by Grim21Reaper

There is no way he is looking for a deal like Jansen's. 1. Jansen was considered one of the best right tackles when he signed that deal. 2. Guards are not nearly as coveted as tackles. Hell, Steve Hutchinson's deal wasn't as lucrative as Jansen's and he is light years ahead of Dock.

You seem to forget who signs the paychecks though.

Jansen hasn't been to the Pro Bowl, neither has Dock, and I bet Dock is basing all this on those numbers.

[MTK]

I would give Dockery something in the neighborhood of 5 years, $20M, $7M SB.