Perspective: A Few Things We Know

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by offiss

The ones that really don't have an opinion, the lukewarm posters, the will get'em next week crew, the all is well it's just a matter of time Guy's, the posters who can't handle controversy, the cheerleaders?

There is no reason to believe that one should be labled "lukewarm" if they can see the team from a total perspective, not just from the highly pessimistic and angry tone that you present us with. One can only assume the controversy you're referring to is what you attempt to bring to the board. If you are referring to any controversy that the Redskins team is going through, I would be lead to believe that those of the "sky is falling" mentality are in fact the ones who have issues with dealing with adversity, and not the ones who face the rough times yet still maintain an optimistic view on things.

Furthermore, you assume cheerleaders in a negative light. Can you actually look at the Redskins cheerleaders and see anything bad about them?

[MTK]

Label me a cheerleader all you want, I really don't give a F. Sue me for trying to have some optimism for my favorite team.

A fan rooting for their team. What an amazing F'ing concept huh?

Life must really suck for those that can't find an ounce of pleasure in their favorite team.

[mheisig]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

If you ask ten different people what's wrong with the Redskins, you'll probably get ten different answers. You ask ten different Warpath members and that number shoots to twenty!

First of all, let's face it. There's no good way to lose, and no one is truly happy or satisified when their team loses - no one. I believe it was Malcolm who best summerized our frustrations with the Redskins this season, if it 'aint one thing, it's another. (paraphrase)

But if you break down this team individually, you really start to scratch your head. We have a middle linebacker who leads the NFL with 84 tackles (not a typo). A running back in Clinton Portis, who is now third in the NFL in rushing with 766 yds rushing, and might be breathing down Adrian Peterson's in a couple of weeks if he keeps this up. Speaking of which, I want to see if Peterson can respond to his recent injury in the same manner Portis has been doing all season. On top of all of that, we boast the baddest safety in the NFL - Sean Taylor. If Taylor doesn't leave the game early, you have to wonder if McNabb and Westbrooks rip down the middle of the field like they did Sunday.

Then there's Jason Campbell. Who, lately, has been making lemonade with a bunch of lemons. And doing so behind a makeshift offensive line that has yielded an impressive 14 sacks this year. Go look for yourself, it's one of the best totals in the NFL. Not too shabby if you ask me.

But let's get down to the brass tacks here. What do we really want to know? Can the Redskins make the playoffs and can they win once they're in? I believe that the answers are yes and yes.

I don't care if this team gets in by the hair of their chinny, chin, chin. Furthermore, if they do make it, I believe with all my heart they can be dangerous once there. Some might say, well, if you play poorly during the regular season, you play poorly in the playoffs too. Well, that might be sound reasoning, but what has been sound and reasonable about the Redskins this year? The only thing or things that have been constant,
I've already mentioned above. But there's more than meets the eye with Redskins, and it can't be underestimated. I believe two magical words will translate into a happy ending for Joe Gibbs' team: "playoff team". Those two words can validate one team and affirm who they were all along, while giving new life and identity to another. My gut tells me, the Skins fall into the latter category. This team desperately needs something they can now identify with; something more concrete to hang their hat on.

Could it be that this team stumbles, side steps, and zig-zags from now through December only to find themselves hosting a playoff game at FedEx? Could it be we have to suffer through several more weeks of roller coaster endings from the Redskins, only to wake up Monday morning to the latest "Fire Joe Gibbs" thread? How many more of those must we suffer through? It's quite possible that real Redskins won't show up until, God forbid, the playoffs? We'll see, but let's not write this team off just yet. If the Redskins go down to Dallas and snatch one from the high flying Cowboys, those two words won't seem so far fetched.

Very well put, 12th.

All this crap flying around about who's a fan and who isn't, who's an optimist and who isn't is really starting to piss me off, to be quite honest.

I'm completely with 12th - that's exactly how I feel about this team. We look SO damn good on paper and we ARE performing and we ARE "in the hunt."

That doesn't make a loss feel any better, in fact it makes it feel worse. I can't find one good reason we lost to the Eagles - it just doesn't make any sense to me. I'm not calling for Gibbs head, I'm not calling for Snyder to move to Argentina, I'm just a fan who lives and dies every Sunday by whether my team wins or not.

Losses suck, losses like the one to the Eagles REALLY suck. I'm pissed off and my hopes for the season took a dive. I'm cautiously optimistic about Dallas for the only reason that when it comes to Dallas the records and stats don't seem to matter. Yeah, I'm pissed we blew a lead and gave up 20 4th quarter points to a team that we had beat. Yes, something is terribly wrong when you blow a game like that. But I'll be damned if I won't be there next Sunday, cheering on the Skins and hoping for an upset.

All this mudslinging about who's a pessimist, who's not, who's drinking kool-aid and so on is just ridiculous. I'm as equally sick of the people who have nothing to do but complain no matter what happens as I am with the idiots who have their head stuck in the sand and think we're one first down from being better than the Patriots.

We're a good team. We're in the playoff hunt. We're above .500. The injuries have been absolutely brutal, which makes our current position all the more incredible. We've got a lot of talent and a lot to build with.

We also do some inexplicably stupid stuff sometimes. The clock management is bewildering on occasion, the penalties and turnovers are frustrating to say the least.

Why can't we all just approach this as it is? A good team that's got it's problems but is still in the playoff hunt? Point out the good things, point out the bad things - that's the way it should be.

The mudslinging and namecalling shouting about who's a fan and who's not and requests for people to be shot really need to come to an end or this entire forum is going to be a miserable place to hang out.

[SouperMeister]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

It's funny how we haven't heard all the virtues of the Champ v. Portis trade lately.

I'm on record in the past saying that it was ridiculous that the Skins threw in a high 2nd round pick when Denver was getting the much rarer commodity (shut down CB). I'm also on record singing Portis's praises. The trade has worked well for both teams, but Gibbs has had a sketchy record of giving away draft picks when he didn't need to (also see trades for Brunell, Duckett, and Lloyd).

[#56fanatic]

Originally Posted by mheisig

Very well put, 12th.

All this crap flying around about who's a fan and who isn't, who's an optimist and who isn't is really starting to piss me off, to be quite honest.

I'm completely with 12th - that's exactly how I feel about this team. We look SO damn good on paper and we ARE performing and we ARE "in the hunt."

That doesn't make a lost feel any better, in fact it makes it feel worse. I can't find one good reason we lost to the Eagles - it just doesn't make any sense to me. I'm not calling for Gibbs head, I'm not calling for Snyder to move to Argentina, I'm just a fan who lives and dies every Sunday by whether my team wins or not.

Losses suck, losses like the one to the Eagles REALLY suck. I'm pissed off and my hopes for the season took a dive. I'm cautiously optimistic about Dallas for the only reason that when it comes to Dallas the records and stats don't seem to matter.

All this mudslinging about who's a pessimist, who's not, who's drinking kool-aid and so on is just ridiculous. I'm as equally sick of the people who have nothing to do but complain no matter what happens as I am with the idiots who have their head stuck in the sand and think we're one first down from being better than the Patriots.

We're a good team. We're in the playoff hunt. We're above .500. The injuries have been absolutely brutal, which makes our current position all the more incredible. We've got a lot of talent and a lot to build with.

We also do some inexplicably stupid stuff sometimes. The clock management is bewildering on occasion, the penalties and turnovers are frustrating to say the least.

Why can't we all just approach this as it is? A good team that's got it's problems but is still in the playoff hunt? Point out the good things, point out the bad things - that's the way it should be.

The mudslinging and namecalling shouting about who's a fan and who's not and requests for people to be shot really need to come to an end or this entire forum is going to be a miserable place to hang out.

very good post. I have been a diehard for all of my 33 years. My Sundays are sacred, I live eat breath redskin football. Every year I get caught up in "we are going to be great hype!" and seems like every year we are in the same position of frustrating losses. I am one fan that gets tired of hearing the cool aid crap. I am a fan that wants to see improvement from year to year (i gave up on the week to week stuff!) Some may call me a negative pessimist fan, oh well. Facts are hard evidence this team has not improved since Joe has been here. We have had two losing seasons (horrible losing seasons!) and one season where we had to win 5 straight (against a light schedule) to make the playoffs. And here we are in the middle of the pack again, having to basically win all most all of the remaining games to get a shot at the wild card. We may have a bright future with some of the young talent we have here, and I do believe we have some very good young talent. But, we are not a rebuilding type franchise. we are built to win every year, and when the same type of losses mount up year after year its very frustrating and hard to see the brighter side of things. I go into every sunday thinking this is the week we bust out and show what we can do, but all most every sunday we show what kind of team we are. Good enough to hand around and lose in the final minutes. I dont know if Joe leaving is the best thing after this season or not, I could go either way right now. I respect Joe so much I want to see him win, but the NFL is so different now, that I am not sure his mentality fits todays NFL. Call me what you will, but I just want a winner, a team that competes week in and week out, year in and year out.

on that note, i hope we whip the cowboys ass Sunday. If not, bring some pain to TO and Romo. Go after Romo's ass until he see's Burgandy and Gold in his sleep.

[mheisig]

Originally Posted by #56fanatic

very good post. I have been a diehard for all of my 33 years. My Sundays are sacred, I live eat breath redskin football. Every year I get caught up in "we are going to be great hype!" and seems like every year we are in the same position of frustrating losses. I am one fan that gets tired of hearing the cool aid crap. I am a fan that wants to see improvement from year to year (i gave up on the week to week stuff!) Some may call me a negative pessimist fan, oh well. Facts are hard evidence this team has not improved since Joe has been here. We have had two losing seasons (horrible losing seasons!) and one season where we had to win 5 straight (against a light schedule) to make the playoffs. And here we are in the middle of the pack again, having to basically win all most all of the remaining games to get a shot at the wild card. We may have a bright future with some of the young talent we have here, and I do believe we have some very good young talent. But, we are not a rebuilding type franchise. we are built to win every year, and when the same type of losses mount up year after year its very frustrating and hard to see the brighter side of things. I go into every sunday thinking this is the week we bust out and show what we can do, but all most every sunday we show what kind of team we are. Good enough to hand around and lose in the final minutes. I dont know if Joe leaving is the best thing after this season or not, I could go either way right now. I respect Joe so much I want to see him win, but the NFL is so different now, that I am not sure his mentality fits todays NFL. Call me what you will, but I just want a winner, a team that competes week in and week out, year in and year out.

on that note, i hope we whip the cowboys ass Sunday. If not, bring some pain to TO and Romo. Go after Romo's ass until he see's Burgandy and Gold in his sleep.

Well I guess we completely disagree on Gibbs. I'm in no way calling for Gibbs head. He's been more successful than any other coach we've had in recent decades, I see no reason to throw in the towel on him yet.

I guess our sentiment is the same, though.

[SouperMeister]

Originally Posted by #56fanatic

very good post. I have been a diehard for all of my 33 years. My Sundays are sacred, I live eat breath redskin football. Every year I get caught up in "we are going to be great hype!" and seems like every year we are in the same position of frustrating losses. I am one fan that gets tired of hearing the cool aid crap. I am a fan that wants to see improvement from year to year (i gave up on the week to week stuff!) Some may call me a negative pessimist fan, oh well. Facts are hard evidence this team has not improved since Joe has been here. We have had two losing seasons (horrible losing seasons!) and one season where we had to win 5 straight (against a light schedule) to make the playoffs. And here we are in the middle of the pack again, having to basically win all most all of the remaining games to get a shot at the wild card. We may have a bright future with some of the young talent we have here, and I do believe we have some very good young talent. But, we are not a rebuilding type franchise. we are built to win every year, and when the same type of losses mount up year after year its very frustrating and hard to see the brighter side of things. I go into every sunday thinking this is the week we bust out and show what we can do, but all most every sunday we show what kind of team we are. Good enough to hand around and lose in the final minutes. I dont know if Joe leaving is the best thing after this season or not, I could go either way right now. I respect Joe so much I want to see him win, but the NFL is so different now, that I am not sure his mentality fits todays NFL. Call me what you will, but I just want a winner, a team that competes week in and week out, year in and year out.

on that note, i hope we whip the cowboys ass Sunday. If not, bring some pain to TO and Romo. Go after Romo's ass until he see's Burgandy and Gold in his sleep.

Have faith Fanatic - it might not happen this year with all the injuries, but this team is FINALLY seeming to move in the right direction. As bad as the 2006 offseason was, some restraint was demonstrated last winter by the FO. We resigned some of our own core guys (Sellers, Betts, and Cooley) and with Campbell, we have a great young leader to build around. Many of us may bitch about poor game management today, but I believe that most of us would also agree that the future looks bright for the Redskins.

[BDBohnzie]

While I have faith, while I'm being optimistic, and while I'll be drinking the Warpath flavored Kool-Aid this week (is it one of those that changes color when you mix it?), I did some snooping today and something doesn't sit right with me...the Redskins vs. the NFC East.

Since 2002 (the year that Yahoo! stops keeping track), the Redskins are 10-23 against the NFC East. The numbers are only "that good" because of 2005, when the Skins went 5-1 in the East on their way to 10-6 and the playoffs. By comparsion, in the same timeframe, the Eagles are 22-12, the Giants are 19-15 and the Cowboys are 16-17.

The Redskins do control their destiny...they have to come out and hit the Eagles, Cowboys and Giants right in the f'ing mouth. If nothing else, these teams see past records and know they can beat the Redskins, because time has told us that. The Redskins have to stop this thinking.

A fairer comparison: A 21st century Gibbs-coached Redskins team has a record of 8-13 against the NFC East. We can talk playoffs, and kool-aid flavors, and optimism until we're blue in the face, but this record is the one number is what will make or break the Redskins. Currently sitting at 1-2, it's an uphill battle the rest of the way against the NFC East. The 3 games left will guide the path of the 2007 Redskins. It starts this Sunday in Irving.

[TheMalcolmConnection]

That's an interesting stat.

Here's what it always seems to me. As soon as the Redskins improve, other teams seem to improve just that much more.

In 2005, we're 10-6, sweeping most of the NFC East, and expecting to dominate the next season. Well we all know how well that went. EVERYONE improved, Eagles, Giants, Cowboys. It's a never-ending cycle.

I have to agree with the person who stated this is the "5-3 season that feels like 2-6". For me, it's the injuries. SO MANY key players getting hurt. Not just one or even two or three. MANY, MANY players.

And not just key players, CORE Redskins. Just SO frustrating.

[SouperMeister]

How about this for perspective:

Imagine being a 49ers fan. They invested a ton in 2005 1st overall pick Alex Smith who is looking like a huge bust since Norv left SF. They significantly overpayed in free agency for CB Nate Clements. They traded their 2008 1st round pick (plus a 2007 4th rounder) to NE to move up to take OT Joe Staley toward the end of the first round. That 2008 pick is looking more and more like a top-5 pick with SF's increasing ineptitude. And figuratively rubbing salt in that wound, NE traded SF's 4th round pick to Oakland to land Randy Moss.

Being a Skins fan doesn't look so bad by comparison. Our future looks much brighter than theirs, not that that means anything.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by SouperMeister

How about this for perspective:

Imagine being a 49ers fan. They invested a ton in 2005 1st overall pick Alex Smith who is looking like a huge bust since Norv left SF. They significantly overpayed in free agency for CB Nate Clements. They traded their 2008 1st round pick (plus a 2007 4th rounder) to NE to move up to take OT Joe Staley toward the end of the first round. That 2008 pick is looking more and more like a top-5 pick with SF's increasing ineptitude. And figuratively rubbing salt in that wound, NE traded SF's 4th round pick to Oakland to land Randy Moss.

Being a Skins fan doesn't look so bad by comparison. Our future looks much brighter than theirs, not that that means anything.

Soup, let me tell you something, we're better off than more than half, count them, NFL teams right. We 'aint happy about a lot of things right now, but things could be worse.

SF? So funny how people rarely talk about their FA busts. I'll throw Philly in that bunch too.

[Stacks42]

Originally Posted by TheMalcolmConnection

That's an interesting stat.

Here's what it always seems to me. As soon as the Redskins improve, other teams seem to improve just that much more.

In 2005, we're 10-6, sweeping most of the NFC East, and expecting to dominate the next season. Well we all know how well that went. EVERYONE improved, Eagles, Giants, Cowboys. It's a never-ending cycle.

I have to agree with the person who stated this is the "5-3 season that feels like 2-6". For me, it's the injuries. SO MANY key players getting hurt. Not just one or even two or three. MANY, MANY players.

And not just key players, CORE Redskins. Just SO frustrating.

I agree that the injuries are key, but we have had the lead in 3 of the 4 games we lost. Something in the 4th quarter changes with this team. Instead of trying to win the game outright, the skins want to run out the clock, we are not a good enough team (especially with the injuries) to become one dimensional. We have also blown leads and managed win against the dolphins, cards, and jets. All but 2 games this season the skins have tried to run out the clock in the fourth.

Lets equate this to boxing: Boxers are always told to finish fights, not get the lead on the score cards through the ninth round then dance around for the final 3 rounds (playing it safe). You either barely win, lose on the cards, or get knocked out.

[SouperMeister]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

Soup, let me tell you something, we're better off than more than half, count them, NFL teams right. We 'aint happy about a lot of things right now, but things could be worse.

SF? So funny how people rarely talk about their FA busts. I'll throw Philly in that bunch too.

Just in the last 12 months the FO has come to appreciate the role that stability plays for sucessful NFL teams. Now we're starting to retain core guys before they hit free agency. I hope that trend continues with Taylor and Campbell especially. I predicted 9-7 at the beginning of the year, but I see the Skins as a perenniel 10+ win team in another year or two if they continue to practice stability with existing personnel complemented by solid drafting.