Football IQ Only

[KLHJ2]

I was under the impression that a QB in the WCO throws to a spot on the field (not at the reciever) and that most of the routes were based on timing. Several good QB's throw to a spot on the field, why cant JC just trust his recievers to be where they are supposed to be?

[firstdown]

Well I'm not giving up on JC now but to me there are some thing that stand out that I don't know if its because he has had so many O's or its just him. One thing that I have seen in JC is that he locks on to one WR. It really stood out last year in our home game against the Giants last year. I was up high looking down on the field and there was 7 to 10 plays where we had WR's very wide open and JC dumped it off or threw to a covered WR. Even my wife asked why he was not throwing to these WR's.

[dmvskinzfan08]

Originally Posted by Skins4Eva

Good Evening fellow Skins Fans. This will be a rather lengthy post and I hope you do not mind. Also, I would like to ask that this post is only answered with objective foootball knowledge/experience and not emotional fan-based sensitivity. With all of that said I will begin.

First, I was raised on the Redskins and bleed, absolutely bleed the Burgundy & Gold so please do not take my statements as "quitting" on the team we all love. We can no longer ignore the shortcomings of Jason Campbell. As a player, former Div II Offensive Coordinator, and Offensive Coordinator/Quaterbacks Coach at a North Carolina High School who sent off 6 Division I football players last year (4 offensive players); I understand the quarterback position. And as of this year, Jason Campbell is not an upper-tier NFL QB. What makes a QB great in this game is leadership ability, ability to read/react to the defense, pocket awareness, and accuracy. However, it is in these areas where Jason has the most detriment. I have been charting his games as I would any of the QB's I have ever worked with at the start of last season. First, how can Clinton Portis be the leader of your offense? The QB absolutley has to be the vocal, emotional, physical leader of the offense. Second, he holds the ball entirely too long, especially in a West Coast System. Third, he regularly locks on too one reciever and has shown to be inept and basic when it comes reading and reacting to the defense. Why do you think it is so easy to defend him? Coordinators know that JC cannot hurt them. Our O-Line isn't really that bad as many would be led to believe. The line is constantly overmatched as defenses send 6,7, sometimes 8 defenders because they know JC cannot react and has a super slow processing time. Processing is the term used by QB coaches that refers to his anaylsis and diagnosis of what he sees after snap is typically two to three seconds slower than your average to elite NFL QB.

I hope the young man does well because I think he is a super guy. However, this is the NFL, not church. Let's now look at some ways they could help him, if they they mistakenly stay with him as a starter. I do think, however, that the addition of Malcolm Kelly can really help his confidence. Devin Thomas will not be in this league longer than 3 years. However, mark my words, as an offensive guy, from what I've seen of Malcolm Kelly, his skills/body type, are comparable to many of the NFL's elite recievers. Also, another way they could help is getting off this crack fantasy that Moss is a No.1 reciever. He is too small and simply cannot be seen by JC in traffic, not to mention terrible hands. Your No.1 reciever cannot be a streaky, although,exciting and talented guy. They have to consistently get open and move chains. Also, they need to scrap that old-style Gibbs running game and go to the West Coast Zone blocking scheme in which Portis became a star in Denver. And please, please, stop keeping your best recieving threat in Cooley in the backfield to block!!!

I could go on and on but I will end this now. Thanks for listening to my rant. Hail !!!!

Question how many titles have your teams won? Just a question I am curious. I am not questioning your knowledge of the game or your expertise. I just want to know.

We have to be frank here and use some common sense. I agree with a lot of things you have said. But also you have to take in many contributing factors. Poor O-line play. Receivers are learning this offense also. WRs dropping balls. Our rookie receivers being hurt throughout training camp.

This is the first freaking game. People are really OVERACTING. We were playing the defending Super Bowl champs.

Saying that. We only lost by 9 points. This is a work in progress. Many factions of our team were not playing well. Also remember the Giants didn't score in the second half. Saying that. The WHOLE offense needs to speed up its grasp of this offense. This offense needs to gel. If anyone expected us to come out the box and be the greatest show on turf. Then you weren't be realistic. Give the team a chance. Give JC a chance. This is only the first freaking game. Zorn needs to step his game up. If we had some consistency the past few years we would have been much further along. But this is a learning process for everyone including the coach.

[KWilly_2003]

Al Saunders offense?!? Are you kidding me? Tom Brady would have a hard time running Al's offense with his 789 page playbook. Did you see the Rams yesterday? They were shut out, and Kyle is a good QB. Al's offense worked in KC because he was rooted there for a long time, and the players went for it. It took him three years to get KC up to what it "was", and he only had two years in Washington. I don't think Al Saunders offense will work in the NFL anymore anyways.

[sandtrapjack]

Originally Posted by Skins4Eva

Good Evening fellow Skins Fans. This will be a rather lengthy post and I hope you do not mind. Also, I would like to ask that this post is only answered with objective foootball knowledge/experience and not emotional fan-based sensitivity. With all of that said I will begin.

First, I was raised on the Redskins and bleed, absolutely bleed the Burgundy & Gold so please do not take my statements as "quitting" on the team we all love. We can no longer ignore the shortcomings of Jason Campbell. As a player, former Div II Offensive Coordinator, and Offensive Coordinator/Quaterbacks Coach at a North Carolina High School who sent off 6 Division I football players last year (4 offensive players); I understand the quarterback position. And as of this year, Jason Campbell is not an upper-tier NFL QB. What makes a QB great in this game is leadership ability, ability to read/react to the defense, pocket awareness, and accuracy. However, it is in these areas where Jason has the most detriment. I have been charting his games as I would any of the QB's I have ever worked with at the start of last season. First, how can Clinton Portis be the leader of your offense? The QB absolutley has to be the vocal, emotional, physical leader of the offense. Second, he holds the ball entirely too long, especially in a West Coast System. Third, he regularly locks on too one reciever and has shown to be inept and basic when it comes reading and reacting to the defense. Why do you think it is so easy to defend him? Coordinators know that JC cannot hurt them. Our O-Line isn't really that bad as many would be led to believe. The line is constantly overmatched as defenses send 6,7, sometimes 8 defenders because they know JC cannot react and has a super slow processing time. Processing is the term used by QB coaches that refers to his anaylsis and diagnosis of what he sees after snap is typically two to three seconds slower than your average to elite NFL QB.

I hope the young man does well because I think he is a super guy. However, this is the NFL, not church. Let's now look at some ways they could help him, if they they mistakenly stay with him as a starter. I do think, however, that the addition of Malcolm Kelly can really help his confidence. Devin Thomas will not be in this league longer than 3 years. However, mark my words, as an offensive guy, from what I've seen of Malcolm Kelly, his skills/body type, are comparable to many of the NFL's elite recievers. Also, another way they could help is getting off this crack fantasy that Moss is a No.1 reciever. He is too small and simply cannot be seen by JC in traffic, not to mention terrible hands. Your No.1 reciever cannot be a streaky, although,exciting and talented guy. They have to consistently get open and move chains. Also, they need to scrap that old-style Gibbs running game and go to the West Coast Zone blocking scheme in which Portis became a star in Denver. And please, please, stop keeping your best recieving threat in Cooley in the backfield to block!!!

I could go on and on but I will end this now. Thanks for listening to my rant. Hail !!!!

Why did you feel the need to start that post with your resume'? I do not think it will matter to anyone here nor change thier opinion about Campbell one way or the other.

[KLHJ2]

It's called Ethos. A strong argument has 3 elements (Pathos, Logos, and Ethos). He played on the Ethos side of the argument to validate his authority of the subject.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by Skins4Eva

We can no longer ignore the shortcomings of Jason Campbell. As a player, former Div II Offensive Coordinator, and Offensive Coordinator/Quaterbacks Coach at a North Carolina High School who sent off 6 Division I football players last year (4 offensive players); I understand the quarterback position. And as of this year, Jason Campbell is not an upper-tier NFL QB. What makes a QB great in this game is leadership ability, ability to read/react to the defense, pocket awareness, and accuracy. However, it is in these areas where Jason has the most detriment. I have been charting his games as I would any of the QB's I have ever worked with at the start of last season. First, how can Clinton Portis be the leader of your offense? The QB absolutley has to be the vocal, emotional, physical leader of the offense. Second, he holds the ball entirely too long, especially in a West Coast System. Third, he regularly locks on too one reciever and has shown to be inept and basic when it comes reading and reacting to the defense. Why do you think it is so easy to defend him? Coordinators know that JC cannot hurt them. Our O-Line isn't really that bad as many would be led to believe. The line is constantly overmatched as defenses send 6,7, sometimes 8 defenders because they know JC cannot react and has a super slow processing time. Processing is the term used by QB coaches that refers to his anaylsis and diagnosis of what he sees after snap is typically two to three seconds slower than your average to elite NFL QB.

I hope the young man does well because I think he is a super guy. However, this is the NFL, not church. Let's now look at some ways they could help him, if they they mistakenly stay with him as a starter. I do think, however, that the addition of Malcolm Kelly can really help his confidence. Devin Thomas will not be in this league longer than 3 years. However, mark my words, as an offensive guy, from what I've seen of Malcolm Kelly, his skills/body type, are comparable to many of the NFL's elite recievers. Also, another way they could help is getting off this crack fantasy that Moss is a No.1 reciever. He is too small and simply cannot be seen by JC in traffic, not to mention terrible hands. Your No.1 reciever cannot be a streaky, although,exciting and talented guy. They have to consistently get open and move chains. Also, they need to scrap that old-style Gibbs running game and go to the West Coast Zone blocking scheme in which Portis became a star in Denver. And please, please, stop keeping your best recieving threat in Cooley in the backfield to block!!!

First off, just because you're a HS OC/QB coach doesn't make your assessments more valid. You're also not the only one on this site with coaching and playing experience. It's also my experience that HS coaches who are sending 6 kids in one year to DI schools are not necessarily good coaches. If you have that much talent in one place, coaching mistakes/deficencies are often made up for by the physical talents of the players. Also, not to knit-pick, but if you were a DII OC, why move back to HS? I'm not trying to bash you, but if you're throwing out your experience as support for your opinions.....

That being said, I'm surprised at your post for two reasons; 1) After 1 game you've changed your opinion of JC from what you stated in the off-season after 3 1/2 quarters of pre-season and 1 regular season game of mediocre play. Earlier in the off-season you said, "Campbell looked much improved from a technique standpoint and i believe he is ready to lead our beloved Skins this year" and "if Jason Campbell puts all his talents together then you are looking at the next "big thing." He is the key to our future. He should be picking Zorn's brains this off-season and learning whatever he can. With Campbell's mobility, arm strength, and pocket presence...he has all the tools to be one of the most dangerous players in the game."

I certainly wouldn't want my son to play for an OC who is ready to yank him after a game where he played medicore, but several other parts of the offense were medicore or worse. By that same logic, should Tavaris Jackson, Derek Anderson, Carson Palmer and a few others be dumped or benched after medicore or worse performances on Sunday? What about Eli, his QB rating was actually worse than JC's.

2) Also, if you've been "charting his games", why not this opinion in the off-season? Your assessments of "holding the ball too long" and "locking on to one receiver" and the "processing time" thing (which is ridiculous BTW) are wrong for the most part. (see below). Note: If JC took 2-3 seconds longer than an elite QB to process info, he wouldn't be here. Gibbs knew a thing or two about QBs and he would've been seeking out other options if JC was that "slow".

Instances of delaying a throw or having a 1/2 sec of hesitation are common for a QB who has only played in 1 1/4 seasons of NFL games and is learning a new system. As a DII & HS OC you should know and understand this stuff. The comments you're making, I would expect from fans who have no playing experience past HS or have no coaching experience.

http://www.thewarpath.net/redskins-l...tml#post473320

Your QB is definitely the leader of the O, but each QB leads differently. Not all are emotional or vocal. Many lead by example and other players are the rah-rah guys. Big Ben took a back seat to Bettis in the Steelers SB run, Eli is obviously not a rah-rah guy but his effective play helped the Giants win SB. Rivers takes a back seat to LT and the defensive guys, etc. etc.

Your assessment of Devin Thomas is way off and completely opposite of all the NFL scouts who had him rated as the top WR in the draft. Could he bust, possibly but how do you know that after 1 game.

While Kelly is comparable to some of the elite NFL receivers, isn't Moss comparable to a couple of speedsters who did pretty well on Sunday? How about Steve Smith, Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne. While I agree, Moss' route running and hands are not elite. He is still a solid WR and stretches the field vertically, he's not ready to be cut along with JC.

The Skins are using a variant of the Zone Blocking scheme specifically to help Portis already.

If you're having problems with pass-pro don't you normally hold in some extra help, specifically a 250+ lb TE, rather than a 220lb. RB? Should we take the Spurrier approach to pass-pro?

[hooskins]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

First off, just because you're a HS OC/QB coach doesn't make your assessments more valid. You're also not the only one on this site with coaching and playing experience. It's also my experience that HS coaches who are sending 6 kids in one year to DI schools are not necessarily good coaches. If you have that much talent in one place, coaching mistakes/deficencies are often made up for by the physical talents of the players. Also, not to knit-pick, but if you were a DII OC, why move back to HS? I'm not trying to bash you, but if you're throwing out your experience as support for your opinions.....

That being said, I'm surprised at your post for two reasons; 1) After 1 game you've changed your opinion of JC from what you stated in the off-season after 3 1/2 quarters of pre-season and 1 regular season game of mediocre play. Earlier in the off-season you said, "Campbell looked much improved from a technique standpoint and i believe he is ready to lead our beloved Skins this year" and "if Jason Campbell puts all his talents together then you are looking at the next "big thing." He is the key to our future. He should be picking Zorn's brains this off-season and learning whatever he can. With Campbell's mobility, arm strength, and pocket presence...he has all the tools to be one of the most dangerous players in the game."

I certainly wouldn't want my son to play for an OC who is ready to yank him after a game where he played medicore, but several other parts of the offense were medicore or worse. By that same logic, should Tavaris Jackson, Derek Anderson, Carson Palmer and a few others be dumped or benched after medicore or worse performances on Sunday? What about Eli, his QB rating was actually worse than JC's.

2) Also, if you've been "charting his games", why not this opinion in the off-season? Your assessments of "holding the ball too long" and "locking on to one receiver" and the "processing time" thing (which is ridiculous BTW) are wrong for the most part. (see below). Note: If JC took 2-3 seconds longer than an elite QB to process info, he wouldn't be here. Gibbs knew a thing or two about QBs and he would've been seeking out other options if JC was that "slow".

Instances of delaying a throw or having a 1/2 sec of hesitation are common for a QB who has only played in 1 1/4 seasons of NFL games and is learning a new system. As a DII & HS OC you should know and understand this stuff. The comments you're making, I would expect from fans who have no playing experience past HS or have no coaching experience.

http://www.thewarpath.net/redskins-l...tml#post473320

Your QB is definitely the leader of the O, but each QB leads differently. Not all are emotional or vocal. Many lead by example and other players are the rah-rah guys. Big Ben took a back seat to Bettis in the Steelers SB run, Eli is obviously not a rah-rah guy but his effective play helped the Giants win SB. Rivers takes a back seat to LT and the defensive guys, etc. etc.

Your assessment of Devin Thomas is way off and completely opposite of all the NFL scouts who had him rated as the top WR in the draft. Could he bust, possibly but how do you know that after 1 game.

While Kelly is comparable to some of the elite NFL receivers, isn't Moss comparable to a couple of speedsters who did pretty well on Sunday? How about Steve Smith, Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne. While I agree, Moss' route running and hands are not elite. He is still a solid WR and stretches the field vertically, he's not ready to be cut along with JC.

The Skins are using a variant of the Zone Blocking scheme specifically to help Portis already.

If you're having problems with pass-pro don't you normally hold in some extra help, specifically a 250+ lb TE, rather than a 220lb. RB? Should we take the Spurrier approach to pass-pro?

First of all, zing! Secondly, great post, I am glad you mentioned Zorn using some zone blocking now. Most people have been complaining about us not using it over the just because Denver does it well, and I am pretty sure they do not realize we employed some on Thursday. Now we are using it, quit your whining and see how it goes.

[dmvskinzfan08]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

First off, just because you're a HS OC/QB coach doesn't make your assessments more valid. You're also not the only one on this site with coaching and playing experience. It's also my experience that HS coaches who are sending 6 kids in one year to DI schools are not necessarily good coaches. If you have that much talent in one place, coaching mistakes/deficencies are often made up for by the physical talents of the players. Also, not to knit-pick, but if you were a DII OC, why move back to HS? I'm not trying to bash you, but if you're throwing out your experience as support for your opinions.....

That being said, I'm surprised at your post for two reasons; 1) After 1 game you've changed your opinion of JC from what you stated in the off-season after 3 1/2 quarters of pre-season and 1 regular season game of mediocre play. Earlier in the off-season you said, "Campbell looked much improved from a technique standpoint and i believe he is ready to lead our beloved Skins this year" and "if Jason Campbell puts all his talents together then you are looking at the next "big thing." He is the key to our future. He should be picking Zorn's brains this off-season and learning whatever he can. With Campbell's mobility, arm strength, and pocket presence...he has all the tools to be one of the most dangerous players in the game."

I certainly wouldn't want my son to play for an OC who is ready to yank him after a game where he played medicore, but several other parts of the offense were medicore or worse. By that same logic, should Tavaris Jackson, Derek Anderson, Carson Palmer and a few others be dumped or benched after medicore or worse performances on Sunday? What about Eli, his QB rating was actually worse than JC's.

2) Also, if you've been "charting his games", why not this opinion in the off-season? Your assessments of "holding the ball too long" and "locking on to one receiver" and the "processing time" thing (which is ridiculous BTW) are wrong for the most part. (see below). Note: If JC took 2-3 seconds longer than an elite QB to process info, he wouldn't be here. Gibbs knew a thing or two about QBs and he would've been seeking out other options if JC was that "slow".

Instances of delaying a throw or having a 1/2 sec of hesitation are common for a QB who has only played in 1 1/4 seasons of NFL games and is learning a new system. As a DII & HS OC you should know and understand this stuff. The comments you're making, I would expect from fans who have no playing experience past HS or have no coaching experience.

http://www.thewarpath.net/redskins-l...tml#post473320

Your QB is definitely the leader of the O, but each QB leads differently. Not all are emotional or vocal. Many lead by example and other players are the rah-rah guys. Big Ben took a back seat to Bettis in the Steelers SB run, Eli is obviously not a rah-rah guy but his effective play helped the Giants win SB. Rivers takes a back seat to LT and the defensive guys, etc. etc.

Your assessment of Devin Thomas is way off and completely opposite of all the NFL scouts who had him rated as the top WR in the draft. Could he bust, possibly but how do you know that after 1 game.

While Kelly is comparable to some of the elite NFL receivers, isn't Moss comparable to a couple of speedsters who did pretty well on Sunday? How about Steve Smith, Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne. While I agree, Moss' route running and hands are not elite. He is still a solid WR and stretches the field vertically, he's not ready to be cut along with JC.

The Skins are using a variant of the Zone Blocking scheme specifically to help Portis already.

If you're having problems with pass-pro don't you normally hold in some extra help, specifically a 250+ lb TE, rather than a 220lb. RB? Should we take the Spurrier approach to pass-pro?

Slingin Sammy your the man!! I couldn't have said it better.

[T.O.Killa]

Originally Posted by Skins4Eva

Good Evening fellow Skins Fans. This will be a rather lengthy post and I hope you do not mind. Also, I would like to ask that this post is only answered with objective foootball knowledge/experience and not emotional fan-based sensitivity. With all of that said I will begin.

First, I was raised on the Redskins and bleed, absolutely bleed the Burgundy & Gold so please do not take my statements as "quitting" on the team we all love. We can no longer ignore the shortcomings of Jason Campbell. As a player, former Div II Offensive Coordinator, and Offensive Coordinator/Quaterbacks Coach at a North Carolina High School who sent off 6 Division I football players last year (4 offensive players); I understand the quarterback position. And as of this year, Jason Campbell is not an upper-tier NFL QB. What makes a QB great in this game is leadership ability, ability to read/react to the defense, pocket awareness, and accuracy. However, it is in these areas where Jason has the most detriment. I have been charting his games as I would any of the QB's I have ever worked with at the start of last season. First, how can Clinton Portis be the leader of your offense? The QB absolutley has to be the vocal, emotional, physical leader of the offense. Second, he holds the ball entirely too long, especially in a West Coast System. Third, he regularly locks on too one reciever and has shown to be inept and basic when it comes reading and reacting to the defense. Why do you think it is so easy to defend him? Coordinators know that JC cannot hurt them. Our O-Line isn't really that bad as many would be led to believe. The line is constantly overmatched as defenses send 6,7, sometimes 8 defenders because they know JC cannot react and has a super slow processing time. Processing is the term used by QB coaches that refers to his anaylsis and diagnosis of what he sees after snap is typically two to three seconds slower than your average to elite NFL QB.

I hope the young man does well because I think he is a super guy. However, this is the NFL, not church. Let's now look at some ways they could help him, if they they mistakenly stay with him as a starter. I do think, however, that the addition of Malcolm Kelly can really help his confidence. Devin Thomas will not be in this league longer than 3 years. However, mark my words, as an offensive guy, from what I've seen of Malcolm Kelly, his skills/body type, are comparable to many of the NFL's elite recievers. Also, another way they could help is getting off this crack fantasy that Moss is a No.1 reciever. He is too small and simply cannot be seen by JC in traffic, not to mention terrible hands. Your No.1 reciever cannot be a streaky, although,exciting and talented guy. They have to consistently get open and move chains. Also, they need to scrap that old-style Gibbs running game and go to the West Coast Zone blocking scheme in which Portis became a star in Denver. And please, please, stop keeping your best recieving threat in Cooley in the backfield to block!!!

I could go on and on but I will end this now. Thanks for listening to my rant. Hail !!!!

Wow, you should be a general manager.