The Real Problem of the Redskins ...

[44ever]

Personally I think this is the first season he has truly "stepped back". I don't think he ever will completly. Again in a world with no salary cap Snyders a nice asset.

Smoot did sum it up nicely.

[freddyg12]

I think the article is well written. I appreciate what others have said about DS stepping back on decisions and letting Vinny take over. Yet I can't be totally convinced that Vinny's not making decisions w/Snyder in his ear. Two wr's & a TE in last year's draft smells of danny influence. Was Jason Taylor all Vinny's decision (for the record I like the deal at the time, but a 2nd was awful high).

Has Snyder improved? I think so, but it will take a long time for him to truly be able to step aside. Something about the team of Danny/Vinny that rubs people the wrong way, and doesn't seem good for the team. It's not like people hate them because they're jealous of the wins, they just hate them.

[Skinny Tee]

Originally Posted by freddyg12

I think the article is well written. I appreciate what others have said about DS stepping back on decisions and letting Vinny take over. Yet I can't be totally convinced that Vinny's not making decisions w/Snyder in his ear. Two wr's & a TE in last year's draft smells of danny influence. Was Jason Taylor all Vinny's decision (for the record I like the deal at the time, but a 2nd was awful high).

Also, Vinny seems to be our GM because of his close relation to Snyder and not because of his GM prowess. Since he seems like a minion of Snyder, the owner's personel tiebreaker rule sounds absurd:

"If Vinny and the head coach can't decide between a player then Danny decides."

Danny can set himself up to make any decision he wants to by making Vinny contest a personel decision with the head coach. Vinny doesn't seem to be strong enough in his own football convictions that he would stand up to Danny. Vinny and Danny don't seem to butt heads enough in lite of the football personel moves we've been making. Since Vinny is still with the team I think that it is evident that Danny still plays a large part in the personel moves.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Skinny Tee

Also, Vinny seems to be our GM because of his close relation to Snyder and not because of his GM prowess. Since he seems like a minion of Snyder, the owner's personel tiebreaker rule sounds absurd:

"If Vinny and the head coach can't decide between a player then Danny decides."

Danny can set himself up to make any decision he wants to by making Vinny contest a personel decision with the head coach. Vinny doesn't seem to be strong enough in his own football convictions that he would stand up to Danny. Vinny and Danny don't seem to butt heads enough in lite of the football personel moves we've been making. Since Vinny is still with the team I think that it is evident that Danny still plays a large part in the personel moves.

Yeah, that's so unheard of.

"If there's a trade or a signing or a move Gibbs and General Manager Charley Casserly want to make, they explain it to Cooke. If Gibbs and Casserly disagree, they each make their cases to Cooke, who serves as arbitrator."

WashingtonPost.com: Cooke, Gibbs Forge Friendship, Winning Ways

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Yeah, that's so unheard of.

"If there's a trade or a signing or a move Gibbs and General Manager Charley Casserly want to make, they explain it to Cooke. If Gibbs and Casserly disagree, they each make their cases to Cooke, who serves as arbitrator."

WashingtonPost.com: Cooke, Gibbs Forge Friendship, Winning Ways

Wow, that's a nice find. Good article.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Yeah, that's so unheard of.

"If there's a trade or a signing or a move Gibbs and General Manager Charley Casserly want to make, they explain it to Cooke. If Gibbs and Casserly disagree, they each make their cases to Cooke, who serves as arbitrator."

WashingtonPost.com: Cooke, Gibbs Forge Friendship, Winning Ways

Ah 1991, our last hurrah as a successful team.

[GusFrerotte]

Nobody knows how much The Danny has pulled back from the FO decision making. More than half the stuff coming out of Redskins Park is BS anyway. And even if the Danny is totally out of the decision making process, he still needs to knock some heads with some of the crap that has gone down in the team's recent past. I do not look for us to have a solid winner built til my 50th birthday at the rate we are going. IF we stink next season don't look for JC to be resigned either!!!!!!!

[GusFrerotte]

I agree he has pulled back some, but I don't think it is as much as folks make it out to be. A guy that in the past has been shown to h ave a really big ego(almost like J Jones) can't just all of a sudden give up total command in a matter of 1-2 seasons.

[skinsfan69]

I think it's silly to bring up 1999-2003. It's pointless. Gibbs has to take some responsibilty for some of the bad moves the team has made while he was here. And it doesn't seem Snyder is nearly as involved as Davis and Jones. But if Snyder REALLY wanted to win bad enough, he'd go out and get some people who really knew how to put a team together. Floyd Reece has been sitting out there for a while now. Why isn't he here in some capacity? Reece has as much experience as anyone out there. I know a lot of you out there will frown on it but Casserly knows the league and has helped put together SB winning teams. Why isn't he here? IMO Snyder doesn't want to win bad enough.

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

I think it's silly to bring up 1999-2003. It's pointless. Gibbs has to take some responsibilty for some of the bad moves the team has made while he was here. And it doesn't seem Snyder is nearly as involved as Davis and Jones. But if Snyder REALLY wanted to win bad enough, he'd go out and get some people who really knew how to put a team together. Floyd Reece has been sitting out there for a while now. Why isn't he here in some capacity? Reece has as much experience as anyone out there. I know a lot of you out there will frown on it but Casserly knows the league and has helped put together SB winning teams. Why isn't he here? IMO Snyder doesn't want to win bad enough.

To the extent that as Team President Gibbs had the final "yes or no" on any given player, I would agree -- he bears some responsibility. But I don't think Gibbs was a micro-manager in that role. I believe he knew his limitations, and I still maintain that even during Gibbs 2.0, the man most directly responsible for the content of the roster was and is Vinny Cerrato.

As one who was never afraid to delegate responsibilities, I don't think it's a stretch to say that Gibbs handed the duty of player scouting and grading of college and pro free agents over to Vinny. We know that the overriding philosophy for the Redskins has always been to take the best player available. So isn't it reasonable to say that Gibbs directed Vinny to present to him the best players he thought were available, and Gibbs basically went with them? I think so.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

...and I still maintain that even during Gibbs 2.0, the man most directly responsible for the content of the roster was and is Vinny Cerrato.

Well you'd be wrong unless you have some proof that everything ever said during that time was a lie. Gibbs was team rpesident. Plain and simple. Vinny was a glorified director of scouting. If you want to base our acquisitions upon poor scouting then lay it at VC feet for the evaluations but it still took Gibbs' signoff to draft/pick up a player in EVERY SINGLE CASE.

[celts32]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

Well you'd be wrong unless you have some proof that everything ever said during that time was a lie. Gibbs was team rpesident. Plain and simple. Vinny was a glorified director of scouting. If you want to base our acquisitions upon poor scouting then lay it at VC feet for the evaluations but it still took Gibbs' signoff to draft/pick up a player in EVERY SINGLE CASE.

True Gibbs had final say but he was still deciding off of recomendations from his scouting department that was run by Vinny. If you recomend 3 bad ideas to me and I pick one then who's fault was it really?

Gibbs is a great coach but he never had a track record of good personel decisions...his biggest mistake in the 2nd go around was not insisting that Danny get him a real GM. But in truth Gibbs probably felt he could do it and was comfortable not having a GM on more equal footing with him like inthe old days.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by celts32

True Gibbs had final say but he was still deciding off of recomendations from his scouting department that was run by Vinny. If you recomend 3 bad ideas to me and I pick one then who's fault was it really?

Gibbs is a great coach but he never had a track record of good personel decisions...his biggest mistake in the 2nd go around was not insisting that Danny get him a real GM. But in truth Gibbs probably felt he could do it and was comfortable not having a GM on more equal footing with him like inthe old days.

No. That is not how scouting works. Scouts are synthesizers. They watch thousands of plays and put together portfolios on players. They eliminate obvious "no"s and highlite obvious "yes"s. It is then up to the decision makers to poor over the synthesized data and watch pertinent film. VC probably had recomendatory responsibilities but in all reality does anyone think JG just let VC tell him who to pick? If that was the case then I lose a lot of respect for him. I doubt it worked that way though.

[Bishop Hammer]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

I think it's silly to bring up 1999-2003. It's pointless. Gibbs has to take some responsibilty for some of the bad moves the team has made while he was here. And it doesn't seem Snyder is nearly as involved as Davis and Jones. But if Snyder REALLY wanted to win bad enough, he'd go out and get some people who really knew how to put a team together. Floyd Reece has been sitting out there for a while now. Why isn't he here in some capacity? Reece has as much experience as anyone out there. I know a lot of you out there will frown on it but Casserly knows the league and has helped put together SB winning teams. Why isn't he here? IMO Snyder doesn't want to win bad enough.

"Gibbs has to take some of the responsibility"! JG only led the Skins to the playoffs twice in 4 years here. How many of Snyder's other coaches can say that? How many can say they even lasted 4 years here for that matter?

The fact that Gibbs came up one game shy of making the NFC Championship under Snyder is a testiment to Joe's coaching genius.

But you are right that there are GMs availiable who could do a better job than "Dan the Man". Reece would be a big upgrade to whoever is running the show. Or someone from the Patriots FO. Really anyone who would tell Snyder "Butt out, sign the checks and let me do what I was hired
for." Sadly that will never happen because Snyder would never hire someone who would do that.

Another reason why Cerrato is the only GM who Danny boy want to work with. Cerrato has shown some idea of what he is doing but has not shown the testicular fortitude to tell our beloved dictator to handle the financial side and he'll do the football part.

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by Bishop Hammer

"Gibbs has to take some of the responsibility"! JG only led the Skins to the playoffs twice in 4 years here. How many of Snyder's other coaches can say that? How many can say they even lasted 4 years here for that matter?

The fact that Gibbs came up one game shy of making the NFC Championship under Snyder is a testiment to Joe's coaching genius.

But you are right that there are GMs availiable who could do a better job than "Dan the Man". Reece would be a big upgrade to whoever is running the show. Or someone from the Patriots FO. Really anyone who would tell Snyder "Butt out, sign the checks and let me do what I was hired
for." Sadly that will never happen because Snyder would never hire someone who would do that.

Another reason why Cerrato is the only GM who Danny boy want to work with. Cerrato has shown some idea of what he is doing but has not shown the testicular fortitude to tell our beloved dictator to handle the financial side and he'll do the football part.

The same genius who had to have Brunell?