Brunell Revisited

MTK · 10-06-2004, 05:09 PM

I can't argue that fact that Portis isn't getting it done, but bust of the NFL? A little harsh if you ask me.

SUNRA · 10-06-2004, 10:15 PM

Did anyone notice on the first TD against the Bucs that Portis scored that the O line was pulling to the left when Portis cut back to the right where the hole was wide open. My question is if Portis knew that the Browns defense had an idea where he was going to run the ball, why didn't he change his course and cutback more often to break one open? Joe Gibbs reviewed the tapes of Portis's claim that the defense knew the plays and Gibbs concluded that most defenses call out all kinds of plays that suggest the team is running but turnovers are the key reason we loss this game. Portis better shape up before he's shipped out.

That Guy · 10-06-2004, 10:30 PM

Quote:

Portis better shape up before he's shipped out.

umm... wtf is with all this cut portis crap?

screw it, football sucks, lets line them all up and flush the league... its not that good anyways....

SUNRA · 10-06-2004, 10:55 PM

[QUOTE=That Guy]umm... wtf is with all this cut portis crap?

screw it, football sucks, lets line them all up and flush the league... its not that good anyways....[/QUOTE

I'll tell you what it is. A runningback whose sole purpose on this team was to be our running game. WTF do you think will happen to him if the Tiki Barber disease rears it ugly head in the Ravens game? He insulted the team and Gibbs when he accused the Browns defense of calling the plays out. WTF did he learn about reading the defense and adjusting to it. Take your pick, 100 yds and no turnovers or sit in Dan Snyder's office and discuss your future endeavors with another team. It's been done before.

jrocx69 · 10-06-2004, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SUNRA

Portis better shape up before he's shipped out.

LOL

That Guy · 10-06-2004, 11:42 PM

SUNRA, the oline needs to help him... its not as good as KC or denvers right now... he's not out there alone...

four games in is a little early to threaten shipping a top 5 RB out of town...

SKINSnCANES · 10-07-2004, 12:08 AM

ship portis out of town???? howd Trung do last week? mabye we should bring him back.

offiss · 10-07-2004, 04:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SUNRA

Did anyone notice on the first TD against the Bucs that Portis scored that the O line was pulling to the left when Portis cut back to the right where the hole was wide open. My question is if Portis knew that the Browns defense had an idea where he was going to run the ball, why didn't he change his course and cutback more often to break one open? Joe Gibbs reviewed the tapes of Portis's claim that the defense knew the plays and Gibbs concluded that most defenses call out all kinds of plays that suggest the team is running but turnovers are the key reason we loss this game. Portis better shape up before he's shipped out.

That is what I have been saying all along, the denver system is a cut back system, they block down, the back then follow's the block until a wall emerges, he then cut's back through the hole with a strung out defense, which allow's him one on one matchup's after he get's though the hole, that type of blocking allow's him to use his excelleration, and cutting abilities. The reason he was able to break off that big run against Tampa, was because it was a draw, and on draw's you allow linemen to take themselves out, so whichever way they rush you just keep riding them that way, so if the defensive line was slanting, the line would block down, not by design, but dictated by the pass rush, essentially creating the same type of blocking pattern that Portis was used to on a regular basis in denver.

SUNRA · 10-07-2004, 10:07 AM

Offiss, that's a great breakdown of the system that Portis emerged from. Now if that system produced 1,500 yd seasons back to back, shouldn't we adjust our playbook to give him a chance to be the back we know he is capable of being?

backrow · 10-07-2004, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by offiss

That is what I have been saying all along, the denver system is a cut back system, they block down, the back then follow's the block until a wall emerges, he then cut's back through the hole with a strung out defense, which allow's him one on one matchup's after he get's though the hole, that type of blocking allow's him to use his excelleration, and cutting abilities. The reason he was able to break off that big run against Tampa, was because it was a draw, and on draw's you allow linemen to take themselves out, so whichever way they rush you just keep riding them that way, so if the defensive line was slanting, the line would block down, not by design, but dictated by the pass rush, essentially creating the same type of blocking pattern that Portis was used to on a regular basis in denver.

My point as well! If we block like Denver's line did, Portis gets his yards. If we do the Counter Gap, we wind up with the usual 2 yards and a cloud of dust that we have been doing!

Great point about Barrow being a bust! Although, I'm not sure that he counts against the Salary Cap if he is hurt, and on the injurred list each week, or until the Skins put him on IR for the year! Maybe our Salary Cap friend can enlighten us!

offiss · 10-07-2004, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SUNRA

Offiss, that's a great breakdown of the system that Portis emerged from. Now if that system produced 1,500 yd seasons back to back, shouldn't we adjust our playbook to give him a chance to be the back we know he is capable of being?

I said it in another post, when you pay 50mil. for a back you change what you have to change to make sure he fit's in, even if it's just a couple of play's to feel thing's out, with that said, I don't see us changing anything until we are certain that the line is doing their job, reason? Regardless of the back, if the line isn't opening hole's, I don't care who the back is, or what the system is, your not going to run the ball, the counter trey is the type of play that Portis should excell at, it's a similar philosophy, we can have Portis do some straight ahead running on occasion, but it has to be the exception not the rule, now if the line is blowing holes for running up the gut then fine, but we have to keep the D-linemen off of Portis, he's not big enough to take a pounding from those big boy's, with Bugel's track record I don't think we will change philosphy any time soon, which I think is ok, but I think we should also prepare in case that is the case and we have to change, putting a couple of play's where we block down might be a good idea, even if it's only until we get the rest of the running game going, it could be the difference in winning and losing right now, considering how close the games have been, great coaches adjust to their personel, well let's see what happen's, I know the staff is more than capable of changing the blocking scheme, in fact, the denver blocking scheme I believe was derived from some of the play's Gibb's used to run, if you remember early on in his carreer with us, he ran some pretty funky blocking schemes that no one had seen before, like pulling both tackle's, and guard's, and criss cross them to opposite side's, then you would just watch the LB's, and linemen, so confused they would just stand there, while the TE would be wide open 20yd's down field, it was a thing of beauty.

diehardskin2982 · 10-07-2004, 02:17 PM

Bring in pot-smokin Ricky as a one two punch HA HA. who would stop us then noone. what ever needs to be changed, change it so we can exploit Portis's potiental period. otherwise linemen need to stay on their block until the whistle blows. the dirtbags don't have a mean streak that they should let get dirty "dirtbags", elbow a guy inthe face or something don't look so nice and willing to give up. can anyone see Cadillac Williams as a shock draft pick in next years draft?

bedlamVR · 10-07-2004, 04:11 PM

I think the bigest problem is we have never had an answear to Jon Jansen going down . he was the No.1 run blocker bar none on the O-Line but it will come back. What we need to do posibly is run more 3/4 reciver sets. as has been mentioned before the max protect is great but really limits your opptions as the D just stacks 8 or even 9 in the box to stuff the run. I personally think spreading things out a bit more will both help the passing game and running game as Brunell will be able to make more use of his game smarts and Portis will have some daylight.

It is however excecution and concentration which are missing. We cannot loose the ball as we have been doing in key situations and giving away stupid penilties also even if the defence knows what is comming a good offence still makes the play and gets the yards.

SmootSmack · 10-07-2004, 04:18 PM

speaking of Jansen what's the latest on Kenyatta Jones, when is he returning?

MTK · 10-07-2004, 05:21 PM

I think Jones will be starting on Sunday night

10-06-2004, 10:15 PM	#32
SUNRA The Starter Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 1,680	Did anyone notice on the first TD against the Bucs that Portis scored that the O line was pulling to the left when Portis cut back to the right where the hole was wide open. My question is if Portis knew that the Browns defense had an idea where he was going to run the ball, why didn't he change his course and cutback more often to break one open? Joe Gibbs reviewed the tapes of Portis's claim that the defense knew the plays and Gibbs concluded that most defenses call out all kinds of plays that suggest the team is running but turnovers are the key reason we loss this game. Portis better shape up before he's shipped out. __________________ Redskins Member since 1970

10-06-2004, 10:55 PM	#34
SUNRA The Starter Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 1,680	[QUOTE=That Guy]umm... wtf is with all this cut portis crap? screw it, football sucks, lets line them all up and flush the league... its not that good anyways....[/QUOTE I'll tell you what it is. A runningback whose sole purpose on this team was to be our running game. WTF do you think will happen to him if the Tiki Barber disease rears it ugly head in the Ravens game? He insulted the team and Gibbs when he accused the Browns defense of calling the plays out. WTF did he learn about reading the defense and adjusting to it. Take your pick, 100 yds and no turnovers or sit in Dan Snyder's office and discuss your future endeavors with another team. It's been done before. __________________ Redskins Member since 1970

10-07-2004, 12:08 AM	#37
SKINSnCANES Pro Bowl Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: New Jersey Age: 42 Posts: 5,454	ship portis out of town???? howd Trung do last week? mabye we should bring him back. __________________ "I'm used to winning, coming from the University of Miami. " Clinton Portis

10-07-2004, 10:07 AM	#39
SUNRA The Starter Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 1,680	Offiss, that's a great breakdown of the system that Portis emerged from. Now if that system produced 1,500 yd seasons back to back, shouldn't we adjust our playbook to give him a chance to be the back we know he is capable of being? __________________ Redskins Member since 1970

10-07-2004, 04:18 PM	#44
SmootSmack Uncle Phil Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 45,256	speaking of Jansen what's the latest on Kenyatta Jones, when is he returning? __________________ You're So Vain...You Probably Think This Sig Is About You

10-06-2004, 05:09 PM	#31
MTK \m/ Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: NY Age: 52 Posts: 99,518	I can't argue that fact that Portis isn't getting it done, but bust of the NFL? A little harsh if you ask me.

10-06-2004, 11:42 PM	#36
That Guy Living Legend Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: VA Age: 42 Posts: 17,553	SUNRA, the oline needs to help him... its not as good as KC or denvers right now... he's not out there alone... four games in is a little early to threaten shipping a top 5 RB out of town...

10-07-2004, 02:17 PM	#42
diehardskin2982 Another Year, another mess. Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 3,581	Bring in pot-smokin Ricky as a one two punch HA HA. who would stop us then noone. what ever needs to be changed, change it so we can exploit Portis's potiental period. otherwise linemen need to stay on their block until the whistle blows. the dirtbags don't have a mean streak that they should let get dirty "dirtbags", elbow a guy inthe face or something don't look so nice and willing to give up. can anyone see Cadillac Williams as a shock draft pick in next years draft?

10-07-2004, 04:11 PM	#43
bedlamVR Special Teams Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 389	I think the bigest problem is we have never had an answear to Jon Jansen going down . he was the No.1 run blocker bar none on the O-Line but it will come back. What we need to do posibly is run more 3/4 reciver sets. as has been mentioned before the max protect is great but really limits your opptions as the D just stacks 8 or even 9 in the box to stuff the run. I personally think spreading things out a bit more will both help the passing game and running game as Brunell will be able to make more use of his game smarts and Portis will have some daylight. It is however excecution and concentration which are missing. We cannot loose the ball as we have been doing in key situations and giving away stupid penilties also even if the defence knows what is comming a good offence still makes the play and gets the yards.

10-07-2004, 05:21 PM	#45
MTK \m/ Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: NY Age: 52 Posts: 99,518	I think Jones will be starting on Sunday night

Brunell Revisited

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